❓ Archers thread #126: It’s a mystery why we’re all still listening.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you’d love to be on the Parish Council, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/4197199--The-Archers-spoilers-thread-6-Cant-wait-for-7-02pm-Join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @LillianGish and @Taswama for thread title ideas, but I felt most in sympathy with @R4's suggestion. Is it me, or is the programme in the doldrums at the moment?

Haven't heard the 31/3 episode yet. Perhaps it's a gem.

Yes I wondered whether she'd poured it away. Nevertheless the damage is now done as she has seen how Chris will react if she returns to drinking. I do believe they have to 'explore her alcoholism further as the story so far had implied that you hit rock bottom and can be magically fixed with a two week detox stint. This doesn't ring true for me, not for someone whose withdrawals included hallucinations.

I'm listening now and am not sure I can deal with the alcohol-related explosion. Maybe I need to give it a break for a while...

CaptainMyCaptain
Jazzer won't necessarily move in, for a while anyway. In any case, do you think two working class people can't be happy in a Council house. Many, many people do live quite happily like that.

Two would be fine. Two plus her dad, her brother and her two teenage children of two different sexes. on the other hand, might be a bit cramped.

@cameocat

Yes I wondered whether she'd poured it away. Nevertheless the damage is now done as she has seen how Chris will react if she returns to drinking. I do believe they have to 'explore her alcoholism further as the story so far had implied that you hit rock bottom and can be magically fixed with a two week detox stint. This doesn't ring true for me, not for someone whose withdrawals included hallucinations.

She was drunk enough to have passed out between Chris setting off for the Grundy party with Martha, and Chris returning when he stopped believing she was still hoovering the lounge -- call it an hour tops, I'd guess.

I don't think there is much of an "if" about her returning to drinking, at this point.

@Umbivalent

I thought I heard Chris say "Is that a bottle?" and then he went ballistic. Is that right?

If he did, then it must have been an empty bottle. So the only options are a) that Alice drank it, or b) that she poured it away to avoid temptation.

If she had poured it away the bottle would be beside the kitchen sink or in the bin. It was obviously beside where she was sleeping- so presumably the sitting room or bedroom (unless she was so drunk she fell asleep in the kitchen)

That's an interesting point ThreeofWeevils - do you think people in close-nit farming villages pay more attention to families when choosing a mate than do people in general?

Rural friend of mine commented cynically that it was all about land - you married the farm that you'd had your eye on.

Your rural friend is doubtless right about the 'look at the acres on that' kind of attraction in farming communities, @MereDintofPandiculation. That wasn't specifically what I had in mind, though. Until the recent boomerang generation, increased social and geographic mobility has meant that not so many couples across the board really know one another's families before it's too late. But growing up in the same village really should have warned Alice off marrying him. Dalliance - no probs. To marry and live in the same village - madness.
Of course, Alice did try to make a break for it, but then Christopher bribed a horse to half-kill him and bring her scuttling back into line and a life of bucolic tedium.

If I'd chosen on families I know which ex I'd have ended up with, I still kind of miss his family. Definitely much better than the family I ended up marrying into. Unfortunately- we were never going to work out as a couple.
And Jazer doesn't exactly have the best family background.

To marry and live in the same village - madness.

If they'd moved away, we would be denied all knowledge of them. It wouldn't be TA without that kind of madness.

Weevils (or anyone else for that matter), how few characters would you like there to be in the everyday story of country folk, and which people would they be?

Silence but for distant (alarm call) birdsong and Hilda chittering faintly would be my ideal. It would have been preceded by Pip and Ruth's dying screams, of course

Is Hilda ok? We haven't heard about her for ages.

Hmm, actually that sounds alright to me, Weevils

@theThreeofWeevils

Silence but for distant (alarm call) birdsong and Hilda chittering faintly would be my ideal. It would have been preceded by Pip and Ruth's dying screams, of course

I'd also like to hear the ker-ching! of a till from time to time, and a low, soothing litany of change-counting (probably soon to become a quaint old-fashioned ritual akin to knowing how to use a payphone and dial a number). A few animal noises too.

I don't think it's a given that Alice was drunk. She's probably so short of sleep she could drop off anywhere, any time. I know I could have done at that stage. They could be playing with us and she might have put the bottle there to explain to Chris that she'd poured it all away. Naive of her to think he'd believe her, but there we are.

@MereDintofPandiculation, that's certainly a factor.

Someone who worked at an agricultural college once told me of how a group of students had gone on a trip (North Midlands). One girl wasn't particularly popular with the lads, but someone asked her about her father's farmland as they were near where she was from. It turned out that the farm was rather vast. She was very popular after that.

You definitely need to consider the family and how the DP behaves when he/she is with family.

Did Kristiffur take Marthyr to Ambridge View?

I liked the Will'n'Em co-parenting bit. George Grundy is 16!

probably soon to become a quaint old-fashioned ritual akin to knowing how to use a payphone and dial a number

My jaw is still on the floor from learning (probably from MN) that, thanks to an exclusively digital life, some 21st century teens cannot tell the time on an old-school clock face.

Joe would probably have wanted to give George a watch for his 16th birthday ...

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

CaptainMyCaptain Jazzer won't necessarily move in, for a while anyway. In any case, do you think two working class people can't be happy in a Council house. Many, many people do live quite happily like that.

Two would be fine. Two plus her dad, her brother and her two teenage children of two different sexes. on the other hand, might be a bit cramped.

Yes, but that wouldn't be a reason to turn down someone that you really like. They don't have to move in together for ages, if at all. The kids will grow up, her Dad (who seems to need 'looking after') won't be there forever. All of the above would have applied to Roman and he was completely unrealistic about the children.

I agree that with a four week old, up throughout the night, I could have fallen asleep at any time, given the opportunity.

I thought that on Tuesday, after Alice saw Brian, she became a bit elated at the idea that she'd 'got away with it' and Martha was fine. Whether that elation carried her through the day alone, or made her think she could throw restraint aside and drink the wine, I don't know.

I wonder whether the SW's are going to fatal covid infections for Tracey's dad and brother, thereby freeing up space to Jazzer to move in?

Nobody has been ill, have they?

Was it realistic for Chris to start acting like Alice had turned into Rose West? I have no experience of these matters as don’t have children so have no idea if a father’s protective streak can manifest itself in this (quite alarmingly) weird way!

Definitely unusual, you're usually on the same side, trying to keep the baby cared for and everyone else functioning adequately, on little sleep. Can result in tetchiness and arguments about ridiculously trivial things. But caring for a premature baby with an alcoholic mother isn't within the realm of usual and Chris has already made his position clear.

They're already terrified/worried that Alice's drinking harmed the baby in utero, so I'm not surprised at Chris's reaction. Emotions are running high in the early days, everyone's exhausted, and add in the worry of a tiny baby drinking alcoholic milk - not surprised at his going over the top, after all her lying before.

Since its inception, this thread has increased my listening satisfaction one hundredfold. Whenever I'm ready to throw my radio out of the window I think how much I'd miss the chat here, and restrain myself. My feelings exactly. @benorjerry so sorry to hear about your OH hope you'll continue to pop in here and feel you can resume your omnibus habit.
I've only just realised they've added a new episode - I just listened to Tuesday (what I thought was Wednesday) and wondered how you all knew about the Rioja already I think there are two possibilities: 1) Alice was happy and relieved that Brian told her what bright spark he thought Martha was - Martha was asleep because Brian tired her out on the walk. She hid the wine and drank it the following day. 2) She drank Brian's bottle and that's why she was cheery and Martha was asleep then acquired more booze the following day and drank herself into a stupor. This has been signposted all along ever since Peggy's initial warning to Chris - he is now finally acting on her advice. Alice may try to claim she poured the wine away and Chris may even believe her (unlikely this time), but it looks like this story is only going to end one way - with Alice hitting the bottle again. The upshot of Chris walking out will be that everyone will find out about Alice's drinking - ironically if they'd told everyone in the first place then Brian would never have left her alone with a bottle of Rioja.

What a shame it's too early in the thread for

The Archers: Get Away From Us!

to be a thread title contender.

Never mind - Chris is bound to say something equally melodramatic in the next few days / weeks.

I don't think Chris was being melodramatic - I think he's supposed to be Everyman (any one of us with no experience of alcoholism). He didn't see the signs and refused to believe it - even when it was pointed out to him by his sister. Peggy (his wife's own grandmother) - and something of an expert - gave it to him with both barrels yet still he wanted to give Alice the benefit of the doubt and believe she could be cured. But Peggy planted the worm of doubt that has gradually eaten away any trust left between him and Alice. Martha has now replaced his wife in his affections and all his protective urges (once focused so fiercely on Alice) are now firmly focused on his daughter. He feels she's had a lucky escape - home from the hospital and apparently thriving - he (and she) have been given another chance and he's not going to blow it this time by giving Alice the benefit of the doubt for a second time.

@LillianGish

I don't think Chris was being melodramatic - I think he's supposed to be Everyman (any one of us with no experience of alcoholism). He didn't see the signs and refused to believe it - even when it was pointed out to him by his sister. Peggy (his wife's own grandmother) - and something of an expert - gave it to him with both barrels yet still he wanted to give Alice the benefit of the doubt and believe she could be cured. But Peggy planted the worm of doubt that has gradually eaten away any trust left between him and Alice. Martha has now replaced his wife in his affections and all his protective urges (once focused so fiercely on Alice) are now firmly focused on his daughter. He feels she's had a lucky escape - home from the hospital and apparently thriving - he (and she) have been given another chance and he's not going to blow it this time by giving Alice the benefit of the doubt for a second time.

I agree. I'm not a Chris hater. He hasn't had any previous experience of alcoholism and tried to protect Alice to the best of his ability (even though most of us don't think that was the right way). He is now trying to protect Martha as she is the weaker person here, in more need of his protection.