Discuss The Archers #108: Has Ed & Emma’s ship sailed? Will Alice stick her oar into Kate's love life? Can Shula walk on water? Come and discuss whatever floats your boat in The Archers.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads and @DadDadDad for being our resident statistician and keeping the ball rolling when Pseudo stepped back a bit.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to be Susan's best friend or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3439443-keep-it-to-yourself-the-archers-spoilers-thread-4, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @QuaterMiss for the title of this thread. For reasons of space had to cut out the bit speculating about Oliver and Tracy pairing off. Surely not!

Off now to give blood, something nobody in Ambridge ever does. See you all later.

(How many do you need to play bingo? If the scriptwriters could please get some to call Adam energetic or Peggy self-effacing this week, that would be dead handy....)

If you just listen for five years or so it will mainly make sense... One of the good things is that you don't have to listen continuously. You can stop listening for months or years, and it's still carrying on much as ever. Occasionally you will hear reference to an event that happened when you weren't there, but if it's vital to the plot, someone on here will usually answer a specific question.

tinatsarina I second the suggestion to start with wikipedia. There's a vague history/synopsis of major stories, but more useful are the links to individual characters - browsing through there will get you a long way.

Mardylardy and Shulascreamcardigancollection and very true R4!

tinatsarina some articles here may help!

Or how about this for the new title: Join us here to discuss The Archers. If you just listen for five years or so it will mainly make sense...you will hate all the characters but be addicted nonetheless.

Or rather than discuss The Archers it should perhaps say Come and nitpick here

I think my issue tonight was with how emphatic and final Emma seemed to be. WIll shall never see George again. I will never talk to you or your family again.

I agree Ed doesn't get to just sweep a lot of it under the carpet for an easy life, and as George won't see Will that's not a pressing issue either.

I certainly wouldn't be letting the children anywhere near Will but Emma saying she will actively prevent him from seeing George ever again is just a great way to push him over the edge. I'd prefer, "If WIll gets help and we can be assured he is making good progress, with George's agreement, we'll discuss a supervised visit, and possibly visits. You know he didn't want to see him last week mind and I won't force him to."

Emma doesn't have to like Ed, and she certainly doesn't have to be his friend, but it's not in anyone's interests to maintain. It's exhausting and won't bring happiness. Batting away his question about Kiera's homework question was unpleasant to hear. Whatever has gone on between them, he is Kiera's father and the sooner they can move to coparenting civilly the better for her, and all of them.

Indeed R4 I only like 2.5 characters now and that’s out of them all!

I liked Nigel too, of course. Bastards

If Peggy's estate incurs inheritance tax on the £500,000 prize, it would be up to the estate to pay it, not the prizewinners.

If Peggy's estate incurs inheritance tax on the £500,000 prize, it would be up to the estate to pay it, not the prizewinners

I know that but if the estate has to pay it that reduces the amount available to the beneficiaries. Of the 3 prize winners only Phoebe is likely to have been a beneficiary so cue lots of " that's not fair" from the beneficiaries who get less because of this gift.

I’m torn on Emma. She was so hard faced and weird about Will. Whatever you think, you could show a bit of compassion and acknowledge that it’s not cut and dried.

But also she’s grieving her marriage - which can make you a bit shitty with other people’s stuff

Go on Mardy, tell us: who is the .5 of the 2.5.
Is it a child? Or somebody who is only here half the time? Or someone you like/dislike on alternate days?

Whatever you think, you could show a bit of compassion
People have been showing Will compassion and cutting him slack for 18 months and look where it's got him. They need to let him hit rock bottom so that he can finally start to climb back out of the dark hole he is in.

Don't want to nitpick LillianGish, but it is Brian not Bryan.

Title suggestion: Hammer Horror (Grey Gables), Carry On (Bryan Brian Aldridge) or Call the Midwife (Adam, Ian and Lexi) - whatever the genre you can be sure The Archers will remain a Brexit-free zone. Come and discuss developments here

Nitpick away Mike - it’s what we’re all here for

Could we further refine it to: Discuss The Archers #109 Hammer Horror (Grey Gables), Carry On (Brian and Neil) or Call the Midwife (Adam, Ian and Lexi) - whatever the genre you can be sure The Archers will remain a Brexit-free zone. Come and nitpick here

It woukd bug me for the whole thread.

Linda and Gill bug me too. Lynda just so isn't a Linda, and Jill just isn't a Gill. Ian probably isn't an Iain either, and Ruairi isn't a Rory.

would not woukd. Emma is such a miserable person. She's toxic. Mind you, so would I be if I'd been married to Will.

I think my issue tonight was with how emphatic and final Emma seemed to be. WIll shall never see George again. I will never talk to you or your family again

I think asking someone to yet again be empathetic and centre Will just three days after he threatened to kill himself, you risked yourself to try and stop him and momentarily thought he had killed someone is simply demanding too much.

I agree with R4 - the constant excusing and covering up for Will for over 18 months has just reinforced his own views that nothing is ever his fault, that he is always right.

Emma knows the Grundys well enough to know that Will will make excuses to avoid getting proper treatment and Clarrie/Eddie/Ed will close ranks around him and excuse that behaviour.

So no - no child of mine would go near Will until he and the rest of the Grundys acknowledge and address Will's problems.

Its difficult enough dealing with someone who has a mental health breakdown/crisis, when their family keep undermining any help by telling the person their worldview is correct and $RANDOMSHIT is all to blame and they don't need to change anything they are making him worse not better.

Emma is feeling hurt and rejected and is in shock - she's been part of the Grundies life for what, 16 years? Her hurt and sense of betrayal is towards them collectively imo. Hence the "I want nothing to do with the whole family " stance.

Whereas the grundies are actually the living and supporting family with rudimentary emotional intelligence and compassion etc.

Regarding new thread can I offer an overarching title of "pulp fiction"?

I was all set to point out the inheritance tax implications but I see Margarita has beaten me to it. If Peggy dies in the next 3 years, that's £200,000 in IHT on the Potentially Exempt Transfer that will need paying out of Peggy's estate (as well as the IHT on the actual estate) - this liabilty reduces each year after this. The Ambridge money fairy will wave her wand so that the benificiaries get their money in an unfeasibly short time, instead of the usual 2 years or so that it would probably take in "real life" but that's ok with me.

I think in Emma’s position - knowing Will has a shotgun, knowing his state of mind and knowing he Lost control and narrowly avoided shooting his own brother - I wouldn’t let my children anywhere near him either. Particularly if it had just been pointed out to me (as if it should have needed pointing out) that I was partly to blame for his state of mind. I have a nasty feeling that Emma’s decision to keep what happened secret is going to come back to haunt her. I also feel we are really missing Joe in all of this - if he were alive (which he still is in The Archers) - there’s no way he would have not had some input into everything that’s happened. I realise this a dilemma for the SW, but I think they need to tackle it otherwise I will stop believing Joe Grundy is a real person and start thinking he is just an actor.

The worst thing, I thought about Will's breakdown, was when he said everyone thought he was a terrible dad, and Eddie reassured him that no-one thought that. I realise that you want to placate the man with the loaded weapon, but for goddness' sake don't feed into any idea that his parenting is ok and just needs a bit of a boost to get back to normal. If he's to get any better at all he needs to face up to what an awful parent he has been and address that.

Whereas the grundies are actually the living and supporting family with rudimentary emotional intelligence and compassion etc

Will is emotionally illiterate and Ed frankly was no better until he lived with Emma.

The Grundys are already closing ranks against Emma and in complete denial of Will's problems. That isn't compassion its group denial. Compassion would see them pushing him into getting the help he needs and that may include telling people who need to know.

Wouldn't the trust mean that it's technically not Peggy's money any more, so not subject to IHT?