Discuss The Archers #108: Has Ed & Emma’s ship sailed? Will Alice stick her oar into Kate's love life? Can Shula walk on water? Come and discuss whatever floats your boat in The Archers.

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Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads and @DadDadDad for being our resident statistician and keeping the ball rolling when Pseudo stepped back a bit.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to be Susan's best friend or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3439443-keep-it-to-yourself-the-archers-spoilers-thread-4, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Thanks to @QuaterMiss for the title of this thread. For reasons of space had to cut out the bit speculating about Oliver and Tracy pairing off. Surely not!

Off now to give blood, something nobody in Ambridge ever does. See you all later.

Should have said "real" people !

I dislike Emma's character but I think she was looking for friendship from Will, not seduction.
If you wanted friendship wouldn't you go to a friend? Not your ex. Not a member of the Grundy clan (having just been dumped by a Grundy). Not the bloke whose outburst caused you to lose your house.
Why does Emma never talk to her 'friend' Helen?

Will isn't used to not being the victim that everybody has to consider the most and now Emma is. Not his brother, but his ex. He had the putting in his place coming to him, misogynistic nasty git that he is. I agree though that she went way too far.

The thing that's annoying me most though is haunted room 13 at GG... hotels and the like never have a room number 13 due to obvious superstition.

I do feel a bit sorry for the SWs with so many loose threads to weave together!

But yes, it’s remarkable that Helen hasn’t rushed to comfort Emma.

But yes, it’s remarkable that Helen hasn’t rushed to comfort Emma.
You would think that they would be having "all men are bastards" conversations. Are they actually that friendly or is it an acquaintance-of-convenience (live in the same village, had DC at the same time)?

I don't think they are real friends, not in the same way that Kirsty and Helen are friends. Although am not sure kirsty and Helen are given that much airtime together anymore.

If you wanted friendship wouldn't you go to a friend? Not your ex. Not a member of the Grundy clan (having just been dumped by a Grundy). Not the bloke whose outburst caused you to lose your house. Why does Emma never talk to her 'friend' Helen?

Presumably because Emma has cut herself off from the village having burned her boats asking so many of the residents for money! She may still feel ashamed and upset or even bitter about having received so many rejections, and she can't be sure that negative words haven't been shared about her among the Archer clan. Hence her sticking to what she assumed was the "safety" of family.

Anyway, it was apparent from Tracy's break-up game that she is still very much in love with Ed. So no, I still think seduction was the last thing on her mind.

It feels as though the SWs have literally lost the plot. They can’t write about Brexit - probably the key issue affecting farmers at the moment (never mind the abattoir being closed - what will happen when none of their meat can be exported?) because events are moving faster than even a topical insert could keep up with. Not to mention the effect of Brexit on the surrogacy storyline. The result is that it all feels very far removed from reality - particularly when we have to listen through such nonsense as the Grey Gables ghost.

Yes what is the point of the abattoir storyline? Where are they going with that?

If they can’t do a topical story surely we could have a non-topical one that is either interesting or amusing. Why not explore what the CofE actually does when people think there is a ghost rather than giving Shula yet another pointless scene? Why not have Jenny presented with an actual letter from an Ambridge resident that gives her a crisis when she realises that she knows who it is rather than a weakly written “funny” scene with Brian? Why not have Phoebe admit to a mental health crisis at Uni which means she isn’t graduating, that’s topical but not dependent on news. And so on. Or just return to some unfinished business. When does Brian and Jenny’s lease run out, for example?

Shula was awful. It was so vain of her to assume Tracey was only doing this to mock her.

I don't really see why? I'm definitely not a Shula fan, but if anything this seems to be the reverse of vanity.

Eyesores house back in the 70s is exactly whah I thought too. Glad I'm not alone.

Shula does think everything is about her though? Suggesting throwing Jim a party was her idea so all the hand wringing she did later was "what have I done?" As though she were Harold himself. When Alistair is busy or curt with her she makes it about her rather than acknowledging that he's busy, in stressful circumstances, and importantly, no longer her husband. At her own request! Don't get me started on the vanity project that was her art committee. They put in some scenes to show us what a great vicar she will be, with Kirsty, Jazzer etc but honestly, I think there's plenty of evidence to the contrary too that is being wilfully ignored.

I am guessing the abattoir storline may involve Brian getting himself involved in something dodgy again.

If you wanted friendship wouldn't you go to a friend?

It's often struck me that Emma doesn't seem to have what you'd call friends. Not old mates she can meet for a quick coffee and a moan/gossip, or even for a night out. We keep being told she and Helen are 'friends' but I've never really seen much evidence of it.

I know she is (or was) a busy, harassed mother with precious little leisure time and even less money etc etc .... but she's lived all her life in Ambridge, went to school there, she must have some acquaintance with people her own age who are still living locally?

As far as I can recall she's always portrayed as being with either family members or neighbours. I don't mean since the break-up; since always.

Shula was awful. It was so vain of her to assume Tracey was only doing this to mock her

I don't really see why? I'm definitely not a Shula fan, but if anything this seems to be the reverse of vanity

It is the epitome of vanity to make everything about Shula. Why on earth would she think Tracey cares enough about Shula to plot something to make Shula look silly?

For Shula to come to that conclusion Shula must think Shula features so much in Tracey's thoughts that Tracey would come up with this as a way to mock Shula.

Shula’s path to the church is another tedious storyline with her giving slow and ponderous advice to various villagers in a bid to assure listeners that she is absolutely cut out for her calling. Has anyone else noticed she has changed her delivery since announcing she was thinking of going for ordination? Jenny as agony aunt is just silly - as if any local paper (particularly one as small as the Westbury Courier sounds) would employ its own agony aunt these days.

Friendship is not often done convincingly on TA. Caroline and Shula were real friends. Kathy and Pat used to be. Neil and Mike. Susan and Clarrie were, and no doubt in the near future will be again.

I don't like the surrogacy storyline for all sorts of reasons. I find the idea of inviting two men to witness an unrelated woman giving birth just ..... eurgh, even though one of them is the biological father of the baby. Wasn't there a nasty story a while back about two gay men who'd employed a woman to be a surrogate getting the whole process filmed for a reality TV programme or similar, and then putting out some sort of catty message about her not making enough of an effort with her personal grooming so she would look good for the birth? It had to do with her pubic hair, IIRC. That made me see red. Birth is so risky for both mother and child. It's not something to be made light of. Adam and Ian had better be respectful and very, very grateful to Lexi for what's she about to do for them.

While the BBC is cautious about politics in TA, I thought the conversation between Brian and the man at the market (who sounded to me a bit like Tiger so a wide boy-type? Maybe, but I digress) alluded to Brexit by discussing the meat going to France. Was it 50% of meat sales? It was a fair quantity anyway. I can’t believe that subject won’t come again later, possibly after we’ve gone over the cliff edge. Farmers are going to be so badly affected. Am I right in thinking we know only how one character voted, that being Adam who voted Leave?

Just thinking - I made a not totally serious remark the other night about Ian and the behbeh having EU passports and leaving Ambridge. It’s occurred to me that Adam - through his father - will be eligible for an Irish passport too. As long as it can be proved who his father was. Of course it’s a red herring as I don’t expect Adam to leave Ambridge anyway.

chemenger
If they can’t do a topical story surely we could have a non-topical one that is either interesting or amusing. Why not explore what the CofE actually does when people think there is a ghost

Maybe because if Alan were approached about it he would ask Roy whether there was any explanation, and be given the ones Roy has: that the plumbers in the loft caused the water to come on, and the "ghost" at the store-room window was a sous-chef with coulis in his beard.

Tracy wouldn't need to know Shula to think it funny to play a practical joke on her, to try to be fair to Shula. She might do it, at the moment, just to make Emma laugh.

But I think that Alan investigating, Roy getting annoyed about Tracy spreading tales about GG, Lynda probably getting involved etc is actually a better story than Shula getting stroppy.

You're right! Of course it is, I'm just being stupid.

I think any storyline involving a ghost at GG would be awful. I fear we have been manipulated by TA in to thinking slightly better tosh would be ok compared to the unmitigated tosh we are listening to currently.

Help him load the fun for God’s sake, do us all a favour.