*The Archers No.95* *Welcome to the 'real' world Ben and Ruarhi, the bad boys of on roading and welcome to the cereal cupboard little Rosie *!

[ppeatfruit]

Thanks to witchmountain for the last thread and to dadx3 for Godfathering them! Also to any other posters whose ideas I have borrowed for the title.

about to hit the hay, but I had to read the thread update before bed after tonight's episode. So no one night stand after all for Hannah and Jazzer, but instead Rex and Lilly are blending...I have to say I didn't see that one but I'm all for it if it means Russ is discarded.

Absolutely loved Jazzer melting over Fallon, it rang true and me and my partner were pretty glued to tonight's episode. More of this please

What a heartwarming thread this is this evening. DDD gallantly defending Witch, Baxter on the brink of leaving, other posters chipping in to diffuse the situation and then Baxter’s reappearance to thank DDD for his off-stage intervention - almost as entertaining as TA itself. And all going to confirm that this still the friendliest thread on MN. all round - I can sleep easy. DDD your role as Father Thread is assured.

Loved tonight's episode! 

@LillianGish I'm pretty new but I also felt a bit upset with any turmoil on the thread as it was very reassuring to read DDD steering the thread back into calm waters.

In this world, this is definitely got to be a positive place

except when talking about Pip or David obviously

I don't know if any of you watch Emmerdale, but Mumsnet was pretty heavily featured on Thursday night.

BOOP for Christmas tree scene between Lizzie and Lily (Lilly?)

I want to know how Rex is getting on with his pig business.

I missed a bit --- did Lizzie go to bed because she was tired or because she was feeling ill?

Is she going to have a heart attack and make Freddie Lord of the Manor?

Yes BOOP for the scene with Lily, Rex, Xmas tree and remembering her Dad.

Good for Jazzer not taking advantage of Hannah.

I saw that Baxter, thought it was quite funny. It felt like the writer knew Mumsnet.

DadDadDad yes, I think Russ is pestering. We get clues in the way Lily’s constantly saying how she needs to extend her stay. So although he may Not be on at her all the time, I get the impression that when he does, he makes her feel guilty. wasn’t there some ghastly dialogue about her being his muse?

I so want a scene where Kenton reads him the riot act.

I think Elizabeth went to bed to let Kenton and Lily talk.

I bet Meanwhile in Manchester is asking Lara to come home for Christmas.

Hi all, I haven't visited for a long time. Following these threads is lovely but time-consuming (one of those things that promotes a feeling of wellbeing as much because being able to do it signifies that all is well in the world, as because of the thing itself).

Anyway, I'm sure this will have been covered recently but I just feel at the moment that old plots are being recycled:

1. Young female character has ill-advised relationship with lecturer (Debbie and Simon), widening to 'unsuitable older man' (Lizzie and Robin... more?).

2. Young female character goes away for education or career development, a personal or family crisis ensues, so she gives it all up and comes back to Ambridge: Debbie, Brenda, Pip (more?). I was raging when they did this to Pip and her burgeoning career. Not Lily now too, arghhhh!

3. And surely not, another controlling, manipulative boyfriend (Russ), so soon? I know he's whiny, self-pitying, spoilt and a dreamer, rather than full-on controlling like Rob but, really, enough.

I know they've been signalling 'Lily's so mature' for a long time, so 'older man', at that age, has followed quite inevitably and, equally inevitably, she's now growing out of it.

If they make her stay and run LL though, I will scream.

And yes, such a nice scene with Rex, as I immediately thought 'he's way too old for you, he's being kind to an upset teenager here'.

Burgeoning career

I don't get what's wrong with working on the family farm if that's what you want to do. Pip wanted to do it. Why is that so wrong? Johnny's doing it.

In RL we need young people working in the countryside bringing new ideas and energy into it.

The two things are not in opposition. Pip's work at Brookfield (when she eventually settled there) would have been enhanced by the skills, experience and perspective she'd gained elsewhere.

Pip deciding to stay at Brookfield wasn't because she wanted to, it was a (particularly weak in that instance) plot device, to keep a well-known character in the programme and provide a reason for the Fairbrethren to hang around. .

This happens to every young woman in TA, as discussed here before. This stifling of ambition is an artefact of character continuity. It still grates.

Working at Bridge Farm is Johnny's burgeoning career. He's moved away from home and taken some bold work and personal decisions to pursue it.

I don’t think Russ is a controlling man story so much as a teenager being determined to somehow prove they know their own mind and then finding it hard to admit they were wrong. It’s Lily who is in charge - it’s her money paying for the flat, they are in Manchester for her course, she’s able to come back to Ambridge while he’s stuck up north. I agree he is pestering her with his constant calls and texts asking when she’s coming back - I think she may actually be finding it hard to kick him in to touch because she knows that thanks to Kenton reporting him he can’t go back to teaching. But she is in control - she could move out and into halls whenever she likes I’m not sure what he’d do or where he’d go. I’m not feeling sorry for him by the way - can’t stand the man - but I don’t think he’s controlling. I think plot-wise he is ultimately there to give her a reason to come back to LL. If she’d been happily ensconced in university life like Phoebe she’d be off the scene.

Yes, I agree Russ lacks the focus to be controlling. He seems more 'early mid-life crisis' but his lack of practicality and dependence on Lily seems unrealistic and makes him seem incoherent and 2D as a character, to me. He's taken huge risks for what is clearly her youthful 'playing older, playing house' phase.

There's so much potential for drama at LL isn't there, with Freddy the inheritor, yet in prison. Lily the capable one, but without a stake in the empire.

Thankyou, again, DDD, you are a very nice man.

Sorry to all for my wobble yesterday.

I'm staying!

Glad you are staying Baxter. We don't do falling-outs on this thread.

Russ hasn't got a job. Russ is in Manchester not-painting because his muse isn't there.
Is there anything stopping Russ from coming down to LL and being useful.

Oh it's only 'stifling ambition" working on the family farm if you're a female . I forgot.

Pip went or nearly went abroad and to Devon or somewhere didn't she ? Of course it was a plot device, what is TA if not a plot!

Lilian I said before Russ is a man child. He's been thwarted somewhere in his childhood\teenagehood from just following his artistic desires, in oder to take academic qualifications, so has decided to follow his early wishes now(using the opportunity of Lily's crush on him) to get on with becoming a Picasso or Banksy or whoever . Lily will soon work out he's a looser.

I still think Russ is after that valuable painting.

Why can I never remember the name of the artist

I was thinking that to turn things on their head, and be a less predictable but maybe more realistic plot would be:

Russ actually gets really inspired by being alone and starts working a lot on his painting, and it turns out his work is 'sellable' or whatever. He then sells a few paintings to a gallery and gets an exhibition, followed by him meeting other pretty young things, cool artists ect and he is the one who sacks Lily off.

This is definitely has happened to a few people I know! whether they were the clingy and useless poor artists themselves who with one hint of fame or success completely sacked off there supportive younger muses/partners, or the partners themselves that i have seen this happen to.

Its just so predictable where the Archers have actually chosen this story to go