Male or female, young or old - Bad Stuff can happen to you in The Archers. Discuss the perils of Ambridge life here.

[PseudoBadger]

Not exactly upbeat at the moment is it

Tom sounds depressed to me too. He is lost and confused and can't see the way through his future.

Didn't Kenton and Jolene fly to Australia, no expense spared, on the promise of a share of the Brookfield sale?

I think for Tom it's not just about losing the baby, it's also about losing Kirsty. The baby would have bound them together forever - he was happy to accept whatever terms she was offering to have her (and their baby of course) in his life. It was a happy chance for him that their one night stand ended in pregnancy and now his only chance has gone. Kirsty has made it clear she doesn't want to rekindle their relationship, so as well as saying goodbye to the baby Tom is also saying goodbye to the love of his life. Even worse, from his point of view, he knows he's brought it on himself - not the miscarriage, but the jilting - it's not surprising he is depressed. In Tom's mind, Kirsty might be able to put it behind her and move on, but there is no moving on for Tom.

Is she "the love of his life" though Lillian? I always thought that she was the keener of the two and a definite rebound relationship when Brenda left. The speed of T&Ks subsequent engagement was a mistake and I don't think any of us were really surprised when the wedding didn't go ahead.

I think Tom's been depressed since he went to Canada. At that time, he made his speech to Tony about how he'd "always been in John's shadow". He only returned because Tony almost died and he was needed at the farm. There have been so many distractions over the last couple of years (the flood/closure of Ambridge Organics/new farm shop/Helen in jail etc) that he hasn't really had time to plan his own future.

I honestly don't know where he's going to go from here but I don't think he's really in a good position to continue with the scholarship.

Agree that he's not 'love of you life' type of person! He's very self absorbed.

I don't think he's depressed. He's just grieving and sad.

I also don't think he is destined to be with Kirsty. I reckon he'd get back with Brenda if it were easier.

I didn't think Kirsty was that bad a bridezilla and a lot of the nonsense was driven by Tom (the new build etc)

Costa Rica was the honeymoon destination I think?

I think your analysis is pretty spot on Vango. I don't think Kirsty was the love of his life to start with, but I think subsequent events have made him rethink a lot of things. For Tom it is the classic not knowing what you've got until it's gone. Tom has really changed seeing his father nearly die, watching his sister go through hell and nearly lose her children, having Johnny in his life has really made him grow up. I think although backing out of the marriage seemed like the right thing to do at the time (from his own purely selfish point of view) now he would give anything to turn back the clock. I think what is really making it difficult for him now is knowing that that he could have had everything he now wants if only he hadn't backed out then. I think being the author of your own misfortune is much harder to with than having something awful randomly happen to you. I think that is why Kirsty is finding it easier to move forward at the moment - because she doesn't blame herself.
Whoever said it was a relief to have a break from Pip and Toby was absolutely right - I have absolutely no interest in debating their relationship because I don't believe in it the way I believe in Tom and Kirsty's.

And yes to all of that Lillian, particularly that he's "the author of his own misfortune" and finding that burden very hard to bear. I'm coming round to the idea, though, that it would be a compromise too far if he and Kirsty tried to give it another go for the sake of 'what might have been'.

You've got me thinking about relationships now Lillian and their prospects of success.

Loving each other equally are/were:

Phil and Jill
Peggy and Jack 2
David and Ruth
Kenton and Jolene
Lizzie and Nigel
Brian and Jennifer (yes I think they do!)
Pat and Tony
Clarrie and Eddie
Ed and Emma
Alice and Chris
Lynda and Robert

Unbalanced/too one-sided:

Brenda and Tom
Kirsty and Tom
Toby and Pip
Rob and Helen
Adam and Ian 😟

Clarrie only loves him equally because she hasn't discovered mumsnet yet.

Pip and Tobes are different. I think Tobes loves Pip and no-one could love Pip more than she does apart from her stupid parents

I've just heard last night's episode and I've got to say there's a little bit of a double standard going on here on this thread! 😁

Tom's made a decision. He's not asking for advice or interference. Kirsty telling him "it's not what (she) wants" was hilarious! She expects everyone else to respect her decisions but doesn't seem to feel the need to reciprocate. Imagine if Helen had been delivering Kirsty's lines last night? There'd have been outrage in some quarters on here.

AuldHeathen, yes, Annabelle Dowler is originally from Formby, which is just up the coast from Liverpool - so Kirsty's reported origins are pretty much spot-on. It's a small-ish commuter town for Liverpool, seen as rather 'posh' though. Lots of (wealthy) footballers live, have lived, or aspire to live there. Her accent is possibly modified by drama school but there are hints of Lancashire in the mix, as well as the odd Liverpool inflection.

I interpreted Kirsty saying Tom's decision was not what she wants as meaning (1) if you're doing this to support me, please don't, I don't want or need it: and (2) you're making me feel bad because you're giving up a massive opportunity because I got pregnant and then lost the baby. I don't think she was saying wanted Tom to go and therefore he must, or indeed that she had made any "decision" about it all. Given that he was discussing it with her it was perfectly reasonable for her to make it clear that, if he was doing it for her, he needed to know that she wasn't asking that of him.

That's how I took it too mega

That was all wrapped up when new Tom returned and had his heart to heart with Tony post otto

Formby was the first place in the NW I saw a Waitrose.(there are a few more encroaching into Booth's territory nowadays). Naice, with red squirrels and natterjack toads, lots of birdwatching places up and down the coast - Kirsty should try and find a nature conservation job back there (though not live too near her mum) and put the Archers behind her. But I selfishly hope she doesn't because I like her more than many other characters.

I'm sure they heart to hearted the John thing in the hospital

I interpreted Kirsty saying Tom's decision was not what she wants as meaning (1) if you're doing this to support me, please don't, I don't want or need it: and (2) you're making me feel bad

Precisely my point Mega! That's not what she said, and even if it was, why assume that the decision Tom has made, for himself, is connected to her? Listen again and pretend it's Helen speaking.

Many of the decisions Tom makes/has made have been determined by other people's expectations of him, most recently Kirsty's outline of his role in her life and that of the baby to be. If he's decided that now is not the time to take up the scholarship then they should listen to him and respect his decision. And if it's well and truly over between the two of them, as she would have it, then they need to knock the late night texts on the head.

Listening to your defence of Tom makes me dislike him even more!

This is ridiculous.
Rex is/was a professional rugby player. He is in desperate need of cash. So what does he do? - he coaches Anisha for free in the skills of cricket.
Why isn't he looking for a paid coaching job.