Roy and Kirsty up a tree, K I S S I N G? Swipe right for The Archers thread and enjoy the Ambridge dating scene.

[PseudoBadger]

I still think Jill knows something we don't know, I really do.

I don't think a family portrait is any indicator of class It's not about the photo it is about how Susan thinks everyone should look in the photo - she wants to control every detail from Neil's nails (so he doesn't look like a manual labourer), to Ed's hair (actually I picture him as the most photogenic lot of the bunch) she can't even bring herself to choose her own dress in case it gives out the wrong image. When Susan is being a snob she doesn't even realise she's doing it - she's just desperate to distance herself from her Horrobin past. But actually she has a lovely family in Emma and Christopher (and not just because he married an Aldridge) and she does everything she can for them even having Emma and Ed and the kids living with her despite the devastation wreaked on her home which is her pride and joy. Susan is also an incredibly hard worker.

Except that most characters are gently mocked from time to time Bertrand, regardless of 'class'. Eg. Kenton, Lynda, Jennifer, Nigel...... all the butt of comedy storylines over time.

It's not that long since Jenny's 'hilarious' kitchen refurbishment.

I don't think it's puttingher in her place I think it's making us realise that it's not about having a perfect photo of your family. I'm sure the Aldridge's have many of those, but they hardly tell the whole story.

I still think Jill knows something we don't know, I really do.

That's not supposed to be the way that TA works. We, the listener, are meant to be omniscient. The fun is when we know things that the characters don't know. Not v.v.

Low - I did a double-take of the headline, presumably meant to be "It's a privilege..."

Timothy Watson describes Rob as a psychopath. Although he's unpleasant and lacking in empathy or self-awareness, I wouldn't have thought Rob ticks the boxes for a psychopath. I'll have to re-read Jon Ronson...

When I hear Neil and Emma repeatedly telling Susan that she looks fantastic in her dress, I take them at face value. Susan has always been a looker and has a good figure.

But Pip was the one who invited the feckless, jobless loser to move in with her Francis! The suggestion seemed to come as a bit of a pleasant surprise to him if I remember correctly and only came about after an argument with David? Jill? when the relationship was uncovered.

Toby flies by the seat of his pants. I don't think there are strong feelings on either side to be honest. Pip's keeping him at Rickyard to make a point to her extended disapproving family; he's hanging around for the free bed and board. She's backed herself into a corner. If she was prepared to swallow her pride and endure the chorus of "I told you so's" she'd be able to get rid of him fairly quickly. He's got no hold over her.

Well exactly! She's cut her nose off to spite her face. Why did she ask him to move in? Because she's spoilt and used to getting her own way. Jill wasn't going to allow Toby any of her scones so Pip's punishment to Jill was to move him in!! I'm making myself feel sorry for Toby now. He's just a pawn in their battle of wills 😁.

Yes, but at the rate things are going with Pip and Jill/David, if Toby suggested that 'moving back to Bert's might be for the best', Pip would probably chain him to the bed to prevent him going rather than admit she might have been a bit hasty.

He had a pretty easy life at Bert's too!

I'm not saying it hasn't worked out favourably for him, just that I don't believe it's a situation he's in control of necessarily. I bet he wished he wasn't there when David barged in apoplectic with rage.

Just listened to Tuesday's episode.

What strikes me about the Jill/Pip SL is how odd it all is. I can't see how Jill would think that constantly berating Pip re Toebee's shortcomings will actually work!! Surely given Jill's past experiences she should see it will only make Pip defend him all the more. Yes Pip and Toebee are super annoying, yes Toebee's latest business idea is doomed to fail but Jill's stance towards Pip sounds almost childish ( she sounded as if she could barely bring herself to speak to Pip - how on earth will that help persuade her to cast Toby aside?).

Jill does sound terribly overwrought about Toby, I think they are leading into a long dementia plotline. I don't believe she has any additional information about Toby, if she did she wouldn't hold it back.

What's with the "I don't like the way he treats women" comment? That's the sort of thing that makes me think she knows something we don't. She barely knows Toby, and has hardly exchanged a word with him since he arrived. Pip's the first girl he's been in a relationship with. Unless it is, as pp have said, a dementia storyline and she's confusing him with his Dad?

"Older woman has strong opinions and expresses them. Refuses to back down when told to by dil younger woman"

Must be dementia....

I think if it were a dementia storyline they would be dropping hints all over the place with Peggy forgetting appointments, leaving ingredients out of her cooking, forgetting names etc. They've done none of that.

Strong opinions based on what though Bertrand. Jill isn't normally so irrational. I listened again today and it was quite an outburst. Totally out of character and inexplicable.

She kNOWS something. You mark my words.

Well then why isn't she revealing this oh-so-significant knowledge instead of getting on everyone's wick and digging Pip deeper in with her near-hysterical, querulous accusations? It's not ageism or misogyny to point out that Jill is digging her own heels in in a bewildering and unjustified way. It's just poor story and character development. God. I honestly don't know why I keep listening to this tripe, I should get out more!

I know. It's crap storytelling.

Maybe it's not her secret to tell? Something she can't bring herself to tell?

Yes, it might have been dementia with Jill muddling up Toby and his father - but in my experience of dementia, it doesn't fix on only one particular person, it is much more generalised confusion. So I agree, it's bad storytelling.