New house has major structural issue

[INeedCharcoalPants]

I posted recently about issues in the house we moved into on 19th January and we've now discovered yet another problem, but a pretty serious one.

I noticed the upstairs floor was bowed near a wall, big gap under the skirting board which looked concerning. The joiner who looked today has said that at some point a wall was removed downstairs (which we never realised had actually been done) and no support above of any kind was put in. He's coming back tomorrow to put timber supports in the kitchen to shore it up.

I spoke to the neighbour to get an idea of what this part of the house previously looked like and he told me that the work was done well over a decade ago, by the owner who was there before our own seller.

Where do we go from here? I'm calling the solicitor first thing for advice but we're devastated at this latest setback. I feel like just packing a bag and leaving this place with the first property auction I can find

Did you get a full structural survey done when you moved in?

You will need a structural surveyor to assess this asap. Getting some temp supports in (if they're needed) needs to be the priority.

No structural survey, we maxed out the budget and just went with the homebuyer survey. Bitterly wish we had gotten one now. Joiner is coming back tomorrow to put temp supports in.

You need a structural engineer and a builder, not a solicitor! Basically structural engineer tells the builder what they need to uncover, builder uncovers, structural engineer designs the remedial work, builder quotes and implements it, and then you pay everyone's bills.
Unfortunately I think adding a solicitor's bill on top wouldn't be a good investment. Unless it was obvious enough that your surveyor should have noticed.

This sounds like a pain. Echoing others - you need a structural engineer. Maybe do that full survey now so you know what you’re dealing with.

First things first, make the house safe. Try to sort that out first, then move onto the next thing.

this is all a pain but if you take one step at a time, it’ll be easier.

It's all fixable, try not to worry

Unless its a newbuild , its an expensive mistake not getting a survey done. A solicitor won't be much help.

Unfortunately I think adding a solicitor's bill on top wouldn't be a good investment. Unless it was obvious enough that your surveyor should have noticed.

I'd have thought this sort of major structural issue should have been declared by the seller , though I suppose if it was done by the previous owner to them they might claim ignorance. Given the neighbour knew about it that seems unlikely. So a solicitors advice may be useful.

Caveat emptor does not apply nowadays, this gives some info
https://www.chancellors.co.uk/resource-centre/useful-information-for-sellers/what-do-you-legally-have-to-disclose-selling-a-house-uk

If its been like that for over ten years i don’t think there is any need to rush to get it propped up, Take a few floorboards up and have a look what’s actually going on under there.j

@Diyextension - it’s that attitude that’s created the issue! It doesn’t sound like the OP’s house had remained the same for 10
years, it’s been gradually shifting due to poor support - leaving it unsupported when you can see this would be foolish.

OP - we got all the surveys and still had a significant unexpected structural issue so they’re no guarantee it’ll be plain sailing. What are you aiming to achieve via the solicitor? Have you got a structural engineer or builder that specialises in structural work to help with this?

No its not, someone removing a wall ? And not supporting it ? Has created an issue. Not an attitude 🙂. Plus you don't know that it hasn’t been like that for over ten years ? Lots of people/ surveyors don’t see things when looking at properties. At a guess id say if a wall has been removed then any movement would have been when it was first removed? If it were moving then cracks should be appearing in the plaster above it.
Also he floor would be bouncing when you walked on it ?

Some needs to actually have a look under the floor as it might be supported ( timber ) but it has just deflected ( sagged ) over time ?

Therein lies your problem. You didn't do sufficient checks and now you need to fix them.

I feel for you, but I don't know what to say.

structural engineer and not solicitor. Once the issues resolved and the house starts to be a home, you’ll feel better about the place

I just hope people are right that this will get better. We've made an expensive mistake by not doing a full survey and will be paying for it now. The neighbour told me it's a great street (which it is!) and everyone here is nice so I'm clinging on to hope here that it'll work out in the end

Have you double checked your homebuyer's report to make sure they didn't flag the sagging skirting? There's no point instructing a solicitor if it was mentioned but you didn't follow it up.

If they removed a wall downstairs but didn't add support you might need an RSJ inserted. A structural engineer will be able to advise on that.

If somethings not adequately supported, it doesn’t always stop moving on its own.

Our previous owner filled in the cracks around our rear bay and thought that solved the problem - over about 15 years it separated from the house and continued moving v slowly. Internally, there was just a bulge at knee height and a horizontal crack under the RSJ, no visible plaster cracks due to thick wallpaper.

The builder has obviously spotted something concerning because he’s suggested acrows.

Honestly, this feels like the end of the world now, but it can be fixed. If possible, get hold of the original plans and, as others have said, get a structural engineer. You can find a list here: https://www.istructe.org/find-an-engineer/. I imagine they’ll design a temporary solution then work out a permanent fix. Don’t bother with a solicitor - they’ll add nothing but costs.

Also, contact your insurance company to see if you’re covered.

OP, I would suggest as others have, that you have a structural survey done now and make sure you remove any floor coverings/furniture so that they can access the area without obstruction. Once you have a better understanding of what is going on, then you can move forward.

Please don't worry, everything is fixable.

With regard to contacting the solicitor, bear in mind that your conveyancing solicitor won't be able to help you - it's not in the scope of the work they do. You'd probably need to instruct a different kind of solicitor - litigation? That will cost a lot of money and no guarantees.

As others have said expensive mistake not to have a full structural survey. However, I am a building surveyor, and would have flagged such an issue in a homebuyers report to say that it was of concern and needed further investigation. I think you would have some recourse with the company that carried out that survey and should go back to them in the first instance.

I've paid for a full survey, found the house has subsidence afterwards and had no luck getting the surveyor to take any responsibility for missing it. Getting a full survey is no guarantee.

I've had another look at the homebuyers survey and it's noted no issues to the floors, was given a 1 for this

I really would check with the solicitor if the TA6 form was negligent or possibly fraudulent. They may at least be able to advise if you're likely to have a case to reclaim anything from the sellers, or from the surveyors.

you need to check first there is an actual issue first - a surveyor and structural engineer at the first instance. Otherwise, it might just be you making assumptions as you are clearly stressed about the house.

Solicitor has looked at it and said no comeback on the previous owner as it was altered before she moved in. She's advised contacting the surveyor and getting them back out to look at it