It's a Buyer's Market: experiences in 2023/2024 ?

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Just wondering what other buyer's experiences have been like on this side of 2023? Any horror stories? Issues with sellers? Guzumping? Guzundering? Problems with EA?

There's a few threads with Seller's experiences on MN (many saying their buyer can't afford the mortgage for their (overpriced?) property and so re marketing them).

What good and bad experiences have you had as a buyer?

Hope this thread will be useful to the buyers of 2023 and 2024!

Been looking to buy for the last 6 months or so. Not much coming on the market, plenty of older homes that need lots of work, and priced excessively (in my opinion), ex rental flats that are ‘tired’ or very large houses. Anything well presented and in good condition is selling quickly. I’ve been outbid on a few of those. I’m getting quite despondent about the whole idea of buying now. My affordability has dropped substantially due to mortgage rates and I’m starting to question should I even bother. Think I might just live in a caravan instead 😂

Mostly facing delusional sellers who have been marketing their house at peak price from summer 2022 + 10-20% for good measure. Start seeing the cracks though with more reductions and emails from agent mentioning « motivated sellers » to encourage low balls but there is a long way to go to make up for increased mortgage cost. Volume is pretty low since anyone who doesn’t need to sell probably stays away until the next cycle in few years (?).

Viewed three houses all owned by boomers in May. First one, very very desirable area, said they would move into a caravan to facilitate a sale. Their house sold within a month. Second one, small village, 20 yo estate, also said they had a caravan to move into. Imo house was overpriced by 70k. They sold about three weeks ago. Third ones, lovely house but on the edge of an exceptionally rough village, children want them to move closer. They haven't reduced and it's been on since Nov.

Most of the best quality houses are not reducing and also not selling.

There's a lot of quite rapid stock turnover with maybe one minor reduction in the <200k market.

300k + sitting on the market for a long time.

First area I am looking at has circa 90k people and reductions are mainly in the low category and they don't need to reduce much or for long.

Second area I am looking at, population of 13k at my last count around three weeks ago, 35% of listings <250k have been reduced, 250-300k 37% of listings have been reduced.

It seems unless you live in a quaint idyllic village or a town with a large population, you will struggle to sell.

I am seeing a LOT of problem houses coming to market. E.g. being too close to railways, having a 6ft X 12ft kitchen and the only way to make it bigger is to extend, overextended houses with no garden left, overpriced houses with 70s decor, properties with odd shaped rooms that are tough for furniture placement, overlooking graveyards, opposite rough schools, too many bedrooms to bathrooms and no possibly to add another, box rooms you couldn't swing a mouse in. Also a fair few that purely run on electric and others with horrific EPCs.

Not going to go on because I already posted a bleaty thread about it, but I'm looking in the <250K bracket in the southeast, most likely for a 2 or 3 bed terrace that needs work, fully prepared to compromise on almost everything, but finding that most of that kind of property is being marketed on a Modern Method of Auction basis. Have told every agent I'm registered with that I'm not interested in MMA and given any of the ones that want to argue the toss a full blooded lecture about what a scam I think it is and how much their reputation will suffer long-term, not that any of them give a toss. Once you take out MMA properties it leaves very little.

My experience of sellers so far is that they're a bit desperate but that doesn't necessarily translate into being willing to drop the price, as the desperation often stems from onward plans that are looking increasingly unrealistic but haven't been let go of yet. I don't think anyone with much choice in the matter is selling for the time being, and who can blame them. I'm a cash buyer living in rented, so I'm just going to sit tight until something gives.

I am so tired of seeing run down doer-uppers marketed at the same price that they would yield in immaculate condition.

The cost of renovation has gone through the roof. I am not paying full price for a house that will cost me £80k to get it up to scratch, and then be worth roughly the same as what I paid for it.

Lots of overpriced houses owned by unrealistic sellers who think it's still 2021.

Lots of houses reduced several times by nominal, insignificant amounts.

EAs are having to work again - far more calls and emails about houses new to market, 'unexpectedly back on the market' and reductions.

Local new build development has banners outside advertising offers and freebies, minor reductions that don't offset the fact that their advertised prices are up about 5% on last summer - they don't seem to be selling any.

We moved last year to a town in Scotland. In 12 months we’ve seen three houses we like enough ti offer on and have been outbid each time. We’ve been putting offers in at 15-20% over asking and each time ranked 3rd/4th out of up to 15 offerers. The first property we offered on we eventually found out had been bought by a couple in their 60s who lived 500 miles away, perhaps for a second home.

it does get us down a bit but we’re optimistic. Where we live has cooled down but it’s still pretty hot when a family home comes on the market. Meanwhile we’re stuck in rental!

Bought this year. Viewed over 20 properties. Made offer on just two. First one wouldn't come down on price. Cue very irate estate agent. For the second I knew they'd priced it below market value so I offered asking price and got it. The buying process was extremely smooth with no funny business on either side. I secured a mortgage when prices started going down in the spring so locked in 4.4% for 5 years.

Property 1: was on for £350k for 7 weeks. We offered £340k & wasn't accepted or rejected. We didn't think it was worth more could see lots of work was required & was rough round the edges. 6 weeks later a bidding war started & it sold for £380k. 8 months later & the sale still hasn't gone through.

Property 2 on for £395k. Again on the market for 2 months with £372k on it. We bid £395k and it was rejected! Wanted over £395k. We went up to £400k then a new buyer bid £405k and it was agreed. A month later the EA came back to me as the buyers had asked for a £20k reduction due to the survey. I said no & they took the property off the market.

We are finding that it’s just all a bit of a stalemate. Sellers not adjusting to the new reality, houses that would of sold quickly aren’t selling or taking ages because sellers are trying to (as someone else said upthread) get 2021/2022 prices + 10\20%.

We have made some offers below asking, none have been accepted, but none have been worth the asking price. It’s all very frustrating. We have a buyer hanging on, but soon he will pull out and then we won’t be a procedable buyer. So the sellers we are dealing with will have an even smaller pool to sell to. If that happens think we will pull from the market and wait until next year or relist when something we like comes on the market, and price to sell.

had one house on our road that had to reduce heavily to get a sale, but they did and got the deal done.

Overall the market is mostly overpriced by a considerable margin as other posters point out.
It will take time for sellers and even some agents to adjust to the normalised costs of borrowing. Hold off if you can.

EAs are having to work again - far more calls and emails about houses new to market, 'unexpectedly back on the market' and reductions.

Yeah, and they don't like it, do they. They much prefer the money for old rope times. I think that's why MMA is so popular with them even though it's a nakedly unreasonable way of doing business - because they feel entitled to big pay-offs for minimal work at all times, regardless of the market. But they couldn't do it without the collusion of sellers who are paddling upstream, so that's the real problem tbh. EAs gonna EA.

Sorry to be such an MMA bore. I'll move on eventually. Perhaps.

I find it interesting people say in the same post

The market is overpriced

and desirable properties sell quickly with lots of interest

Both can't simulataneously be true

But both can be true. A desirable property is going to be in demand, therefore can probably command a higher price. So the few properties in that category are selling because there will be some cash buyers or those with large amounts of equity who can afford to go higher. But a lot of sellers are deluding themselves about the desirability of their property and so it's overpriced. Perhaps because a neighbouring house sold for x amount 18 months ago.

I'm thinking about when I've bought from elderly sellers who thought their house was worth much more than we eventually paid - seemed to forget that their 'new' kitchen dated from the 1980s and the 'new' double glazing was actually a couple of decades old. And what they saw as a house they'd lived in happily for decades we saw as tired and lacking on the maintenance front.

You say it 'eventually sold' - how long are we talking?

If a house sells in reasonably time without reduction, then the source of funding is barely relevant, it's the market price.

If a house doesn't sell for months and is reduced, then it's fair to say overpriced

Our experience has been that there are mainly ugly houses that need a lot of work beyond just a lick of paint, being sold by Boomers mainly and asking for prices beyond 30%+ what they should be up for. They are putting their house up for sale at the same price as similar homes but have been done up (but these are still over priced, so a heck no from us too). These rundown houses also look like money pits (probably more issues that we know) and I'm not prepared to pay the extra 30% nor more on reno, especially as renos are costing more and more.

One issue we have is three bedroom properties that are up for sale usually have the third bedroom as a box room. For example, these houses are about 550k, but a proper three bed (where all bedrooms are at least a double, and the rest of the house and garden are the same as the box room homes) are asking for 650k. Four bedrooms are in the 725k region. Ummm Why would I or anyone pay that much more for a few more square feet - the math ain't mathing lol? The prices are ridiculous and completely made up.

Our other experience has been: we have been making offers (what we think is the real value of the house), being rejected but we have happily walked away. We are in a good position to buy but refuse to be ripped off. What's happened is a few weeks later (about 2 months), EAs are calling us back to see if we still want the house (lol). This has happened about 5 times since June 2023 and I believe people actually can't afford the out-bidded prices sellers are accepting, and/or the bank's valuation is way lower (I suspect it's a combo of both). We have moved on from the house by the time the EA has called us back, so it's been a big loss for the seller.

My learning so far has been:

• check of the price of house based on sq footage - what are you paying sq footage vs another house
• check the difference in prices between a house a tiny bit smaller and a tiny bit bigger... what are the price differences?
• don't be desperate. don't pay asking (you are being ripped off and deep down you know it).
• only offer what you really think the house is WORTH in today's market (factor in your own negative equity and the fact it is already over-priced) - happily walk away if the offer is rejected (you will probably get a call back lol)
• It really is a buyer's market and i am holding off like some are suggesting above. i'm a good buyer, reliable but will not pay extortion for a house. the rental market is actually cheaper for us right now without all the extra faff that comes with house buying.

I believe we are at the beginning of a proper downward spiral now and most buyers are waiting and holding off, and rightly so!

Are the renovation houses selling or not?

You mention you have put offers in on 5 houses, that havn't yet sold. but this doesn't mean much without the context of how many have sold in that timeframe?

If it's a total of 5 houses that have come on, that is more significant

Also what are peoples experiences of EA tactics at the moment? We made an offer about 10% under asking, we are in a good position and given the market thought that was fair. EA rang us today and said that they’d had offers close to asking but that they want asking because another estate agent valued it much higher. It’s all just a bit nuts.

I also felt like saying to him, well if someone’s offered close to asking why are you ringing me when I’ve got some way to go to get there 🤷🏻‍♀️

sellers expectations are just a bit wild, they’re intelligent people so surely they’ve seen what’s going on and understand the economic conditions at play?

@Mychickchick

I also felt like saying to him, well if someone’s offered close to asking why are you ringing me when I’ve got some way to go to get there

Yes, exactly this. These are EAs and sellers playing games. It's up to you, but I wouldn't try to outbid, you might be outbidding yourself. It's a take it or leave it situation? My friend, an EA, has advised to hold off any increase in prices because they're finding a lot of properties are going back to market. EAs don't know if they will even earn their commission.

Buyers are telling sellers and EAs the market's worth. I don't really care what EAs say the price/value is in today's market - they're making up prices.

Also when interest rates were lower we could have offered the price they want, but now we can’t. So it’s all quite simple really…

House we are buying had 9 viewers on 1st 2 days. 3 offers. Went to last and final bids. 2 cash buyers- 3rd was downsizing

Friend selling house. Went for sale 2 days ago. Had a stream of viewers with more booked this weekend. Already got an offer. Looking to sealed bids.

In the case of the one we bought it had been on the market 18 months and been with two EAs. It needed renovation and condition had deteriorated in that 18 months. They had lowered the price from what it was on for originally but were very reluctant to go any lower but we did eventually convince them after a lot of to and fro with offers. Or rather the EA did - don't think they'd had any viewings, let alone offers, for months!

Looking at a small city in SE with traditionally high prices. Primarily former btl and probate properties on at the £450k mark. These are nakedly overpriced and will cost more to renovate than simply buying a house that's in good condition already.

Reductions are happening but prices are nowhere near down to realistic levels, ie even 2021 prices. We really want to move but can also stay put if required for another year or two.

Houses are supposed to be a feel-good purchase and snagging an ugly doer-upper in a relatively crap area which will be a pita to renovate for the guts of half a million quid is hard to get excited about. Seems like a stalemate kind of situation.

Having looked round quite a few of the renovation properties being sold by older people downsizing, there were a lot of delusions about the condition.

They could probably see it needed a lick of paint, but seemed unaware of the elderly kitchen with doors coming loose, elderly electrics needing a rewire, double glazing going foggy, bathrooms in really poor condition (often with separate room for the loo) and without a shower just an bathtub.

Presumably they'd lived there happily for decades and it had worked for them so just wouldn't see all these things.

The one we bought they'd actually freshened it up with new paint but all the "issues" were fairly obvious!

There's another 'scam' going round in one of the areas I'm looking in. Houses marketed at far less money than expected, aimed at those 60+. They seem to be targeting boomers who are trying to affordably downsize.

The same property (this is one example, of which there are many) is listed at 299k for normal buyers, 201k for over 60s, same particulars, photos, floorplans. Two separate listing entries with two different agents.

Here's some of the feedback from Trustpilot:

Feedback 1, home seller

Listed my property without my knowledge at far below market price. I don't care if this is part of their "scheme" I've never heard of them nor given them permission to do so and the multiple adverts with different values created confusion about my propert and may have affected interest. I will be exploring legal action and I can see I'm not the only one.

Feedback 2, home seller

Absolutely shocking they advertised my house without asking . It was on with another agent and they listed it. It looked it was less than the actual sale price due to the way they operate. Complete cowboys. Please beware they should not be doing this without consent. I will be seeking legal action.

Their reply - Feedback 2 - basically, 'you didn't read the particulars'

To explain why you saw the advert, we have partnerships with trusted Estate Agents across the country and they can offer their vendors (you) a free, optional, second listing on property portals such as Rightmove.
This [redacted] listing is detailed in the vendor agreement with your agent and the service is called ‘[term that means nothing]'. You can opt out of [term that means nothing] at any time by reaching out to your estate agent or [scam firm].

They then go on to explain the homeseller still gets all the money.

Feedback 3, home buyer

This company is truly evil. They exploit the vulnerable by offering a very unattractive deal to people who don't know what signing up to them means. My mother thought she was signing up to a home for life when she contributed £225, 000 towards a £275,000 property and is now only entitled to 30% of the value and has been converted into a life tenant whilst her freehold was sold to an investor. Beyond disgusting. We are trying hard to extricate ourselves from an onerous, extortionate contract. Stay away if you value your estate.

Exactly, and yet the narrative going to sellers is that buyers are going to blink first, market is slower and other excuses to justify lack of offers or even viewings. Looking at the front page of this forum, many are asking why their house doesn’t shift, and yet other fellow contributors suggesting to add plants and declutter as if it was that wrong type of grey paint prevention a sell.