How much to reduce our listing?

[Potaytoe5]

Only had 1 viewing in 3 weeks since we went live, so we decided we might as well drop the price already (annoyingly enough they loved our house, just went with one nearer train station!).
It's quite reasonably priced against other similar houses, but they all seem to be hanging around at the moment.
EA said there's not a lot of buyers and a lot of people told them they can't afford to buy anymore.
Would it be enough to drop it from £215k to £210k to start with, with a view of going to £200k if we still get no viewings?
I don't want to shoot myself in the foot and reduce to much too early. EA said it might be worth going for the lowest we are willing to sell for at the moment, but I am not sure how low we are willing to go really.
House is a standard 3 bed semi, renovated, nothing really 'wrong' with it, so that's not the problem. Nice area, houses usually sell quickly.

All depends on how much you really want to move and if your found somewhere. We really wanted to sell so priced very competitively /maybe slightly under market value, sold on first day it was listed. All depends on circumstances tbh

'By 2025 rates will be dropping..., etc'
Maybe, maybe not. A bit foolish to bank on it though. If rates do drop to these levels it will be because we are in a massive recession. What happens in a recession? Multiple business failures (even more so because of the current v high inflation and people reducing their purchasing), much higher unemployment, more people on reduced incomes/ benefits. If anyone thinks that house prices will suddenly shoot up in the middle of a recession with high unemployment, they are deluded. It's very naive to think that, if you wait a year or two, everything will be just fine and you can achieve whatever inflated value you might have in your head. It's going to get worse, not better.

@KievLoverTwo-some people don't seem to understand how markets work do they?!

Oh goodness! I'm not sure which thread that is but it sounds worrying.

It's very naive to think that, if you wait a year or two, everything will be just fine and you can achieve whatever inflated value you might have in your head. It's going to get worse, not better.

Yep.

Right now, houses priced between about 150 and 250k are the ones dropping in price the most quickly and they're also the ones selling the fastest.

I'm wondering where all these people are who are going to be prepared to wait two years in homes not suited to them are. The ones who will be buying homes currently priced at 350-400k at the same value they're currently being priced at.

Perhaps, like us, they'll just massively adjust their 'needs' lists to 'wants' or 'would likes' and will buy in a far lower price bracket.

We're looking at homes which are 1/3rd of the price we almost bought at in May; not because of affordability, but because we're shit out of patience and really don't want to wait two years.

This year has taught us a great deal about living far under your means and I think it'll have scared a lot of people into similar thought patterns.

So. Maybe we lose a 4th bedroom, 500 sq ft, our preferred county to live in. Peace of mind, affordability and still being able to have a lifestyle whilst being economically secure should the very worst happen now seem far more important than a house that ticks most of our boxes.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/property/4848185-mortgage-dilemma-around-1-year-til-5yr-fix-ends-wwyd-anyone-else-in-the-same-boat

My son made an offer of 315 against a 330 property and they accepted straight away
his mortgage as a FTB is 4.9 and he’s got roughly just over 30 percent deposit

the other house he looked at wouldn’t negotiate much so he looked at the other one and made an offer

a few days later the sellers came back and said they would accept his offer but it was to late

'Right now, houses priced between about 150 and 250k are the ones dropping in price the most quickly and they're also the ones selling the fastest.'

Is that from your own research @KievLoverTwo or from somewhere else?

I'm sure potential buyers like potential sellers will make different decisions having weighed up the pros and cons of moving vs waiting. I would advice anyone to be cautious about the amount of debt they take on though.

Thanks for the other thread link. Barking comments!

I think this will happen more and more; people dealing reasonable offers and then regretting it later on when they get offered even less.
This is fine during a rising market but is highly unlikely to work out well now.

'Right now, houses priced between about 150 and 250k are the ones dropping in price the most quickly and they're also the ones selling the fastest.'

Well, it's not from Charlie!! ;)

Yeah, I've been keeping an eye on the market in the 150-600k bracket up the road from me every single day (where, currently, 50% of the daily listings are reductions) but also across two other entire counties as well, so probably across about 20-30 towns and villages in total, across three counties, for the best part of three months.

What Charlie has said from his data: people are already downsizing.

That's really interesting. Good for you for doing your own research.
From the areas that I look at, the more expensive properties seem to be moving the least. But, at least in the area I follow the most closely, the owners don't seem to want to reduce the prices enough to actually sell them.

Hey OP,

We went to market a week ago and were fortunate enough to have an acceptable offer this week (listed £180k accepted £170k). We've been extremely lucky!

However, the one thing that I think made a huge difference for us was the EA.

Last year my DM had her house to sell which was a bit of a niche property. We tried three large chain EA, all very successful, and got nowhere.

DM switched to a local, independent firm where one of the owners was also the EA. He knew the local market and as he told us, he has a vested interest in making sure that properties sell. He sold DM's property in three weeks. At that point it had been on the market for 5 months. Unbelievable.

We are now selling our property. Market is obviously terrible and nothing is shifting. We used the same EA again, and he got us a really solid offer within the space of a week (from 5 viewings).

I'm convinced he's some kind of property wizard.

In short, have a look in your area to see if there's a local, indie EA who will genuinely knock themselves out to get a sale. I can reach my EA at any time via text - I don't have to play telephone tennis ringing the office. I think using him was a game-changer for us.

Best of luck to you - I know waiting to find a buyer is soul-destroying.

This is a really important and very pertinent point.

He's probably not a wizard. Probably just a dude who has been in the business for 30 years.

It's all very well going with a massive chain who can talk the talk, but if the average age of the EA you are dealing with is late 20s, they are very unlikely to have experience selling in a market as turbulent as is happening now.

What you really need for a quick sale or not losing money is someone who was around in the crashes in the late 80s and 2008 and knows how to sell in that environment.

I don't intend to diss all young EAs with this reply, I am sure many of them are very hardworking and I know they get paid a pittance, but an EA who has been round the block and has seen many dire housing markets and knows how best to cope with them - that's the person you need selling your house right now.

I'm disappointed to realise there's no actual magic involved.... 😅

I think you're absolutely right re experience and knowledge but actually he's surprisingly young - I'm going to take a guess and say maybe mid to late 30s? It's a partnership between two local guys, similar age, who were born and brought up in this area. They know this place inside out.

Both of them have 10 years+ experience working at other estate agents and then about a year or so pre-COVID they set up their own agency. Terrible timing but somehow they survived and have become very successful in a short space of time. I think it's because - as you say - they really do know their stuff. They might be relatively young, but they have a decent amount of experience, and they've clearly done their homework. They know how the market works, and provide very good advice on what to expect. For DM's house and now for mine, they've proven to be 100% correct.

They price competitively but it's not a race to the bottom. I'd say price-wise they sit around the middle of other EA. There's no tie in when you sign the contract. If you decide at any point they're not doing a good job, you can simply rip up the contract and walk away. None of these 6, 8, or 12 week tie-ins that other EA demand.

He gave my DM brilliant advice based on his knowledge. And he knows the target market - he got the right buyers through the door rather than just people to make up the numbers and look good. He has a really good understanding of what type of people a house will appeal to and he has a team that proactively reach out.

And as I say, buyers and sellers can contact him by text 7 days a week. It's a completely different experience.

He valued our house at £170-180k. His initial words after viewing our house were "on a good day you'll get £180k, on a bad day, you'll get an offer of £170k". We listed for £180k and accepted an offer of £170k after one week on the market because we want to get moving and it's a good buyer (very keen on the house, no chain, hefty deposit, FTB etc). He didn't pressure us to accept - he was happy to continue marketing if we wanted to. But he was bang on the money with his advice - yet again.

I met him when I was viewing a house last year - and that's how we found him. He had a completely different vibe about him, and when we got talking I was impressed. No hard selling but very knowledgeable. He told me at the time "it's my name on that board outside the house, and I don't want anything that reflects badly on me".

I don't know the other partner but I know he comes from a farming family so maybe he deals with farming sales? Not sure. But the partner I deal with at the EA is completely different from all the pushy sales people at EA chains who don't really give much of a toss other than collecting their commission. That's unfair as I'm sure there are some great EA who work for chains - I just mean that every sale seems personal to this guy because his business is his baby.

Looking at my local RM, other similar properties with chain EA at similar price points - and even a bit lower! - that were listed way before us are still up for sale. We've had a good offer within a week, and I credit my EA with this. There's nothing special at all about our house.

I think if we went with a chain EA we'd still be kicking our heels waiting.

The person in question is over in another thread making up absolutely bizarre fantasy scenarios for a person going on maternity leave but looking to borrow more having her mortgage term extended by her lender by 25 years without the person borrowing the money being made aware of it by her lender, and being indebted for life.

Excuse me? It was my comment you were referenced and I have made no such comments that you claim on any other thread. 😡

Wow, they sound genuinely amazing. Would you mind messaging me the area they are in please? I would like to buy a house via an agency that treat their clients so respectfully.

'By 2025 rates will be dropping..., etc'
Maybe, maybe not. A bit foolish to bank on it though. If rates do drop to these levels it will be because we are in a massive recession.What happens in a recession? Multiple business failures (even more so because of the current v high inflation and people reducing their purchasing), much higher unemployment, more people on reduced incomes/ benefits. If anyone thinks that house prices will suddenly shoot up in the middle of a recession with high unemployment, they are deluded. It's very naive to think that, if you wait a year or two, everything will be just fine and you can achieve whatever inflated value you might have in your head. It's going to get worse, not better.

I made no such claim that house prices would "shoot up". 🙄 I stated that the BoE has overshot because it has no other policy tool to use so its hands are tied. Also partly Bailey's mismanagement but that's no shock given he was useless at the FCA and only appointed because he supported Brexit. 🤣 Rates should have been raised earlier and more gradually. Anyway, yes, they have overshot now so rather than simply calming inflation a recession will ensue, as you've said. Many businesses now highly leveraged after the pandemic will collapse from these rate rises and it will not be pretty.

But rates will then be cut. My point is that people will then be able to remortgage more cheaply. And likely prices will stabilise and begin to rise slowly again, because money will seek a (perceived) safe haven in fixed assets, as is the British mindset in particular. And that, as I said, nobody who isn't desperate to move due to personal circumstances will be doing so right now because this situation - like all economic situations - is temporary. I am an economist btw. 🤣 But thanks for your lecture and calling me "deluded": I shall let my employer know that @rainingsnoring on the internet considers me not up to my job. 🤣🤣🤣

No, sorry, that was a mistake. For some reason I think my reply picked up your post. Someone else entirely!

Frankly the rate rises will do little to calm inflation anyway given the fact that they will be making the cohorts will little disposable income already even poorer while increasing the disposable income of those who have plenty and are the main ones fuelling current levels of discretionary spending, and the fact that the drivers are supply side anyway, but that's rather off topic.

Thank you @KievLoverTwo , the apology is much appreciated.

Whichever poster you were referring to sounds fairly idiotic though, it must be said!

I think you've had good advice from your agent op. Since you don't want to delay moving, cut the price to the lowest you'd accept and get it sold before the market gets worse. The people hanging on despite very little interest will end up dropping prices even more or taking their houses off the market. Price to sell and generate a bit of interest.

They are honestly fantastic - I just remembered that they won some estate agent award about 18 months after they launched. My memory is shite so I just looked it up and it was a Gold Award from the Best Estate Agent Guide. They apparently review 27000+ estate agent branches for the award, and that puts the EA in the top 5%. So objectively they are performing extremely well - it's not just me raving about how good they are haha!

I've got quite a few posts on here so if anyone looks they'll see I'm in the Gloucester/Tewkesbury region. Too late for me to be all mysterious 😅 I can DM you the name of the EA if you're interested though - you can then have a root around and look for yourself.

Well you said this 'So anybody not in desperate need to move in the next two years will simply wait it out rather than accepting a hugely reduced price.' which certainly implies exactly that you think prices will start to rise again within 2 years.

You can tell your employer whatever you like. I'm not convinced that you are an economist anyway if you are projecting that house prices will rise in a recession with multiple business failures and high unemployment because rates may or may not drop a small amount, certainly nowhere near the ZIRP days.
The fact that the number of listings has risen hugely in the last year and especially very recently doesn't really fit with your assertion that only the desperate will move at present. Prices are set at the margins so falls in prices, even a smaller number than usual, affect everyone else too. Time will tell how temporary this is, if prices start to rise soon as you project, whether everyone who isn't desperate will 'wait it out' (or perhaps how many people are feeling desperate) etc.

Yes, I said people will wait it out rather than sell at a hugely reduced price. As most people are doing, hence the market being so quiet. Only those desperate to move for personal reasons would consider it at the moment, obviously. People tend to take a long-term view on fixed assets like housing, and certainly not sell during a crisis if they don't have a compelling personal reason to do so. And yes, within two years I believe rates will be significantly lower than now. I'm not alone in that analysis, either. 🤣 My guess would be maybe 3.5-4.5% but that is a guess, because obviously nobody knows how it will play out but it's very clear the current situation isn't sustainable and will result in a recession and then rates will be cut. And then yes, prices will rise again. That's the nature of it. Very different to me saying prices would "shoot up" as you claimed. The point is that estate agents trying to light a fire under potential sellers to convince them to sell now at huge discounts may not have their best interests at heart... they need to sell properties or they are out of a job and they have very few clients on their books, so have a vested interest. They are not your "friend" and people certainly shouldn't be seeking financial advice from them.

I didn't say prices would rise during the coming recession. Although they may: it wouldn't be the first time. It depends on many factors, not just interest rates. The market is extremely quiet, as is to be expected. There are some sales from BTL landlords (wholly different set of financial circumstances), people who desperately need to move, some people who have overleveraged and panicked, some who are desperate to downsize or move nearer family because they are fairly elderly so don't want to wait this out as even a few years is likely a significant proportion of the rest of their life, etc. There will always be some movement due to personal circumstances. But most people obviously will simply hold fast and wait, particularly as interventions have been made with lenders to avoid repossessions unless there is no other route - i.e. extended mortgage terms, a period of interest only payment, etc. And because nobody sane wants to upsize when new borrowing is at these high rates!

I couldn't care less what you believe.