Bringing family up in an inner city flat...

[goteam]

Our narrative at home has always been that we need to move out of our flat to a house once the kids are a few years from secondary school for more space. That time is kind of now. We are in zone 2 near lovely parks, swimming pools, theatres, quick bus into central London and lots of other amenities. We just can't decide on an area of north London we like enough and can afford (900k max) and just love our current location so much.

Anyone have positive stories about bringing older kids up in flats? The kids were sharing a bedroom but we have rearranged so our small reception room is now bedroom 3 and the kitchen diner which is quite big has become our living room too. We don't feel cramped though and have clever storage and beginning to think is it worth the upheaval of moving schools etc for an extra bedroom and a bit more living space?! We want an extra bedroom mainly so friends and family can stay but that's all we need it for really. We would downsize again if we did move once the kids leave home.

We have a garden and over lockdown we spent a lot of time in there putting new decking down and in the summer it really is like having an extra room.

I think we are beginning to doubt whether we actually want to move! I know many people live in high rises etc and apartment living is just how it is for many but I guess the thing is we have a choice here. We could move to zone 4 or 5 and get a nice house but be in the suburbs really without the which we aren't sure we want! In an ideal world we would be able to afford a house here but they are 1.2 million for 3 bedroom terraces which don't actually provide much more space....1.3 million for 4 bedrooms...

We felt a bit cramped and on top of each other over lockdown but now things are a bit more normal we are often out and about and home is more of a base which is what has always kept us here.

Any thoughts and positive stories welcome!

That's long, sorry!

From your post you come across as if you don't want to move, so don't.

As your kids are older they will need a garden less than when they were younger. If you all coped during the lockdown and you love where you are I'd stay put.

You could ask your kids as well, they may really want to stay or equally really want to move.
How old are they?

I grew up in a flat and my own kids are growing up in a flat. We are in a great spot with lots of facilities within a short walk. Better yet, it's cheaper, so we can afford nice extras.

Everyone I know has the traditional semi with 3beds garage and garden. It's nice. But it's not for me.

I don't think you want to move.

I think a move for more space is to late age wise. You've done the massive toys, outside space needed, buggy, pram etc stage. Teens take less space surely? Use outside less etc as pp said.

They are 6 and 8, nearly 9 @OverTheRainbow88 if you ask the 9 year old age will say country side or seaside as she equates it with fun, seeing family and holidays. I have explained that real life won't be how it is in the hols but it's hard to explain to a 9 year old. The younger one is sports mad and I'm not sure we would get a bigger garden but a move may mean losing the parks.

Yes, the baby stage of prams and play houses is over....

Teens need more space to themselves when they are older. I cannot imagine how you'd cope with just one reception room that included a kitchen with older teens. They may well stay out of the home a lot just to have some space to be themselves, out of your reach. It's not what we'd like if we can help it. We are looking for a larger space so we can all have a bit more privacy and they can have some space for their friends to come round, play PlayStation etc that's not the main lounge. There aren't the safe public spaces to hang out for kids nowadays especially in urban areas. I'd rather have more room so they could be at home. Obvs I'm not in London but teenagers are different to children.

We’ve always lived in a flat. First in Paris, then in Central London. Central London is fantastic for teenagers. Mine went to school outside London and their friends with huge Surrey houses with pools loved our flat and the location and we had a lot of sleepovers! As they get older and go clubbing, I am much happier knowing that they can be home in 10 minutes in a night bus or taxi in the small hours, rather than schlepping out to the suburbs. We do have a garden, but it doesn’t get much use now, apart from me and DH having a glass of wine in the evening.

@MrsJamin that's a good point. I like my own space too and in normal times DH and I would allow the other to sneak off to a local coffee shop with a book. Growing up my only personal space was my bedroom and that was shared until I was a teenager. The houses we look at all have open plan downstairs so even if we stay in London not sure we would get loads of extra space with rooms away from the rest of the family. Fair point though.

@MrsSchadenfreude yes, I know its common in Paris and we have friends in Berlin and Prague also happily bringing kids up in flats with no plans to move. Me and DH didnt grow up in London so apartment living isn't as second nature as people who grew up in big cities

I don't know about London but I would say that from experience of children leaving home (2 of them are in their 30s now) you wouldn't want to downsize when they've left home- we ended up actually building more space as when they visit with their girlfriends/soon to be wives there are 4 not 2, and hopefully there will be grandchildren eventually too so if we had downsized we would have regretted it!

I grew up in flats/maisonettes in zone 2 and always had a garden, I feel like the only main difference between a house and some flats is a garden so if you have one I don't feel you're missing out on anything as a kid at all by living in a flat? You might move to a house and have terrible neighbours or hate the area and I think that's a lot more important.

This is a very interesting discussion! We have a large flat in SE London and while I would love to have a bit more space, right now I can imagine being where we are for several more years.

I think the thing about teens is they will want privacy eventually. I think options for separate living area away from kitchen/dining is important. If they each have a friend over when they're 12 and 15, they probably won't want to be hanging out in the open plan space with you and their sibling and sibling's friend. Is the garden big enough to put a small summer house in and have that as a separate chill out space?

What about sleepovers etc as your children get older?

I think for teens, having their own space is definitely important - not so much downstairs but a room they can retreat to and shut the door, especially during exam years.

But that's equally not a reason to move now.

I wouldn't move in your position. We started off in a zone 1 central London flat and are now in a detached house in an outer zone, but it wasn't flat living itself that bothered me, it was noisy neighbours. If I'd been happy in the flat ( as it sounds as though you are) we'd have stayed there.

I love the idea of having a garden room that could be used for different things, either working from home or a chill out place for teens at the weekend. I remember congregating in a friends large sleeper van when we were teenagers just to have a space that an adult wouldn't just walk through or be within earshot, so we could put music on and sing loudly, etc! Also you need to rethink evenings, when they are 12-13 onwards they'll be going to bed 9ish more than the lovely 7pm bedtime. Where are you all going to want to be in the evening?

@MrsJamin that's a good point. They do already stay up until about 8.30 in their rooms reading. Our room doubles as an office so DH works in there. The bedrooms are actually a decent size.

The idea about a garden summer house is something we could investigate. The kids do often take a book down to the garden on sunny days and we sometimes set up a tent for them to play in.

We will have an issue with bike storage. At the moment their bikes are small....

I think you missed the boat in raising your kids in a house with enough bedrooms & a big garden. And it's clear that YOU don't want to move so your kids can have more space.

@IceSkater I think we might have missed the boat you're right. They are settled in school too and have asked if they can go back to the same school if we do move which obviously they wouldn't be able to. They haven't wanted to move either, it's not just me. They have friends here from when they were babies. When we talk to them about moving we have to do the hard sell to be honest. They do like the idea of a house but have asked if we can buy one here. We can't. They also want a trampoline in the garden, tree house, table tennis etc. but no house in London will give us a garden that size.

Living where we do has worked for us so far. I have always been near my office so haven't had long days with them in after school clubs etc. Decisions have so far been made with each family member in mind. When they were younger there were endless toddler activities and stay and plays etc.

But yes, the quandary is how much more important is the extra space compared to lack of disruption with moving schools etc, uncertainty with new neighbours, easy access to amenities we have here.

They have a bedroom each which is more than many of their friends do. I think those of us who live in London and like big city living may have a different outlook to others but I do appreciate all views.

If your children have a bedroom each here's no real reason to move for more space. As they become teenagers they will retreat to their own rooms, trust me!

I moved from a garden flat in zone 2 to a terrace in zone 3 when my kids were exactly the age yours are. We had to do it as we didn’t own our lovely zone 2 flat, so it’s been the right move for us... but in your position, assuming you own your flat, I would stay. Had we owned ours, we probably would have and done something with the space we had.

If you have outside space, kids have their own bedrooms, parks, buses and a nice school, stay where you are. I’m still RAGING that I can’t get a bus into town from zone 3

Being happy where you live is so, so important for your quality of life. It sounds like you’re all happy where you are.

If in a few years time you're not happy you could perhaps consider moving into rented and renting your flat out.

One thing to bear in mind, although it's obvious, is how much bigger your children will be. 5 almost adult (size) people mooching around your home is quite different to 2 adults and 3 children.
Your flat sounds lovely though!

DS and I lived in a 2 bed maisonette with a garden. It worked well for us. It’s fairly spacious and is on two floors which helps.

One big advantage was that the kitchen and living room are separated and the kitchen is just big enough for a table. So we could have some space when friends came over. But that’s was only one adult and one child

If you had a little bit more room you might make it work, maybe the garden room?