What do you do when your child has no school to go to in September?? I really need some help please.

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It's fluffy bunny.
I have written some threads about ds in the past, he's waiting to be assessed for aspergers and has previously had real problems at the schools he's been at because he comes across as rude, he can't read social situations very well, he panics and is silly. He's moved school's a few times because of this, the relationship between him and the head of one school was so bad (because the head was a fruit cake and ds questioned why he was only teaching them about the catholic church and no others, the head's solution was for me to pack ds off to a "strict, religious boarding school with a firm housemaster" [hmm). The school he attends currently has a variety of children, the staff are nice (apart from the head) but he's being badly bullied. I was resorting to bringing him home at lunch time to keep him safe, I work so can't always do this. Academically he's very bright and was extremely bored. The work he was given was no where near the right level for him.
He sat an entrance exam for a new school, it's private, harder work, aspergers experience etc but we recieved the letter this morning saying he was 'unsuccessful', despite the head telling me that he did really well on the entrance exam, it doesn't say why on the letter, they are aware that ds is being assessed for aspergers and has moved about as he's not had a good time at school.

We are really stuck now and I really don't know what to do. My options are
A) find him another school - difficult as it's the school holidays
B) send him back to his current school where he's being bullied, head teacher thinks he believes everyone is beneith him, work is way too easy, homework hardly ever marked, child being moved into his class in September who has severe behavioural problems
C) return him to his last school which wasn't too bad, I just couldn't pay the fees how they wanted them to be paid, poor manners in the boys though
D) home educate him, meaning I'd have him 24 hours a day, I'm a single mum, I'd have to leave work.

I really need some words of wisdom.

Another epic novel. Sorry.

Oh no fluffy. Don't know what to suggest, but . Hope you can work out a good solution.

Thanks. I've just emailed his old school and begged, (he's unhappy, misses his friends) said I have family support with the fees, am paid more now, am more then willing to pay a bigger deposit (good job I'm paid tomorrow) etc. I hate this though. I've wanted to cry all day, I can't send him back to school to be hurt, it's like I'm consenting to him being abused. I don't know what else to do.

I wonder if the current school gave a verbal reference and mentioned the previous private school, leading the potential new school to take up a reference from the old school? I wonder if the problem with the fees is the real reason for the rejection? Just a thought. It seems to me that private schools within a particular area might be in fairly close contact?

I don't know. I do have a feeling that it's the reference though, the current head really was very nasty about ds. She isn't a very professional woman, arguing in the playground with another parent whist there are other parents about indicates this. I think the old private school would have closed for the summer once the current state school would have sent their reference. Ds was collered by his teacher on the day the prospective school broke up as they had just recieved the reference and his teacher was angry. Ds was quite shaken. I don't know though.

fluffy I just saw this (sorry was at work yesterday).
No time to reply now but will have athink and post later.

Sorry you are having a tough time

You really do need to talk to the new private school and find out what has happened.

The private school may well have found out about the feees issue previously. They may use the same company or another system with links to the same company, and have your name via that. If this is the case then it is a case pf speaking to the new school and exlaining the changes you have made and how the previous problems won;t occur again.

Also can you ask to see the reference from the old school, the one they gave to the new private school? Surely you have a right to know what was said and to challenge it?

I can't get in touch with anyone, it's still going through to their answer phone. It is the school holidays though, it's a PITA.

I"m sorry to hear about your MS, however does that not put an even more complicated spin on things? If you've recently been diagnosed with a long-term, progressive condition which could well affect your ability to work is now really the time to be rushing headlong into committing to paying for fees for the next 8 years?

You desperately need to talk to someone at your local LEA and get the statementing process started. You also need to get the diagnostic process properly underway. No school's going to want to commit to taking a pupil if they don't really know what they're taking on.

I remember your posts when your ds went to the old private school (not the old, old one iyswim) and you weren't particularly enamoured of the place. Why don't you do a search on here and remind yourself what you thought of the place when he was there? Do you really want to send him back there? Is it worth the 3 hour round trip, not to mention the fees??

I remember, I'm completely out of ideas though. We do need to move anyway so it makes more sense to move closer to where ds goes to school so this will cut out the three hour journeys, on the balance of things it's going to be far more stressful to send him back to the primary school he's at now, I've been bringing him home for lunch as lunch time is the main time where he's being hurt. The MS I have is a relapsing-remission type so it does get better, stress will make it worse though which is why I'm trying to find the least stress option.
I know it wasn't perfect, I don't think anything was, I'd rather he was somewhere that he knew and where the staff knew him. I know another boy with aspergers there so they do make allowances. I'm paying for after school club and holiday care for ds at the moment which is just slightly less then the fees, I wouldn't need to pay this if he went back as they open earlier and close later so there's no need. I don't doubt that a vast majority of the problems he has at school are of his own making, he's been seeing a therapist for the past couple of months and is having an assessment with him, ds has another appointment this afternoon then I will see the therapist to see what he thinks and how he can help ds. I don't think the aspergers he has (if this is what he has) is severe enough for a statement, he's fine in class, it's when there's alot of noise and free time like PE and playtime that are the problem times for him. I've given him strategies to help him at these times but whilst he's the new kid and children know that he won't hit them back then this is going to be a problem, it's especially worse as they are (according to ds), just told off and nothing's done about it. They are not made to appologise and there's no action taken by the staff. They are not even telling me themselves that ds is being hurt, just before the end of term a ball was thrown into ds's face making his nose bleed, not one member of staff came to talk to me when I collected ds, he's had his head pushed into a filing cabinet and into a table, no one spoke to me then either, there was no sheet telling me he had banged his head.

I entirely agree with mimsum. I think that a proper assessment of your son, as well as your own situation (for which, my heartfelt sympathy) would help to determine the best long term plan for his education. At the moment it does rather seem like a series of knee-jerk reactions which are subsequently regretted. And, as wonderful as MN advice can be - and I mean that - no contributor here, including myself, is in a position to give any clear and meaningful diagnosis of your son's needs (not to mention your own at this stage). So yes, pursue that statement. You also mentioned that your mother had offered help with educational costs - maybe funding a private assessment by a recognised expert would also be a very good idea before shelling out for fees.

You said that the prospective school said he could apply again 'when he's ready". Well yes, discuss that calmly with them - realistically after term starts. But being 'ready' - for both your son and his education provider, necessitates a clearer understanding of his needs. I tend to agree with others that you might get that more rapidly where he is now.

We are waiting for a paediatrician appointment which, I imagine, is going to take a while. Looking at the letter the current school have written to the GP it is quite severly exaerated as to his behaviour. I remember the senco saying that she was going to make him sound like a little horror as this was the only was to get an assessment for him. If the prospective school recieved a copy of this letter then this would have caused a great deal of concern. It does blow his traits completely out of proportion, it states that he has moved 'several times', when in reality he's moved three times, he has 'no eye contact', which is not true, I know this as I have had to help him with this in the past.

They have said that ds

"finds it difficult to talk to people about how he feels or about things that have happened to him. He is often involved in incidents with other children and is unable to talk through the problem with a member of staff. He is unable to see things from someone else's point of view (not quite true), and struggles to understand his role in the incident (I do agree with this statement).
Ds has self absorbing interests (I wouldn't say more then any other child), lacks expression in his voice (not quite true), he has superficially perfect spoken english (his english is very good but I don't see it as superficial, he knows what he's saying and what the words mean except for swear words he hears at school as they are not the things we use at home), but he has difficulty in non verbal communication (I do agree with this). Ds finds it difficult to understand how his behaviour affects others and often shows no empathy (not quite true), ds finds making eye contact hard (not true now) and will tae some things literally (often true). Ds is exceptional reader and appears to be highly intelligent within some aspects of his school work (true ).

ds is to be placed on the SEN register at School Action, a multi element plan will be put into place to outline small and specific targets for ds to achieve over the next academic year. Ds will have support from staff to develop coping strategies and behaviour modification strategies to enable him to functon within the school setting in a more positive way.(none of this has been done)"

In all honesty it has been designed to be over the top in order for ds to get a referral. I was told by the senco that she needed to do this and ds probably has very mild aspergers, she had seen far worse.

I think that this would have been sent to them and that I need to appeal the decision to refuse him a place on the basis that this letter exagerated his behaviour in order to get a referral and was never designed to be used as a school reference.

I am so sorry you are going through all this pain - the timing is abysmal. I do think you should push the school to understand why they are not offering a place. You might not like the answer, but at least you will know what you need to address - or possibly that their requirements are not something you can ever accept.

Good luck to you and your son in finding a good solution that you are both happy with.

Sorry to hear things haven't worked out Fluffy. Only place I can think of is the private school in Beeston. I know it's not an academic powerhouse but my colleague's son has a few SEN-type issues and he's really happy there. I see the kids out and about and have never seen any eyebrow raising behaviour. It's also quite small so that might help DS.

Just had a look, they do the monthly payment thing too.

Hi Fluffy

I know I may be coming across as quite harsh and unfeeling but this really isn't the case. The letter your ds' school wrote could easily be written about my ds2 who has asperger's and a statement.

Very few private schools are set up to give SN pupils the support they need - I know you don't feel your son's current school is helping him but in most cases (not all) it's easier to access support in the state system.

Being honest with myself I have to admit that ds2's behaviour impacts on the rest of the children in the class - fortunately he has a statement and there is an LSA in the class so, as most of the time he doesn't need active input from her, she's able to help the other children in the class, so the net effect on the other kids is a positive one. In most private schools you'd have to pay extra to get that extra help - or the school would just not have him in the first place. How many children with statements (not just asperger-y traits) does the school you wanted him to go to have?

A term and a half really isn't long enough for a 10 year old with asperger's to get used to being at one place - and it's not long enough for the school to get a handle on him either. My eldest was at his new school for a good 4 terms before we felt things were starting to fall into place.

I have a couple of good friends with relapsing-remitting MS so I know how it can be - and if stress is a trigger, then stress over money and fees should really be avoided.

There should be someone from your LEA available - talk to them now, explain your situation and see what their take on things is. And can you ask your GP to try to expedite the paediatrician's appt as your ds is in a crisis situation at the moment?

Thanks. I have spoken to ds's therapist today who knows ds alot better then the current school and has been assessing him for the last couple of months, he has agreed to write ds a reference as we both know that the letter that the school has written for the doctor is extending the truth regarding ds quite alot. They really have made it sound alot worse then it is and the therapist has more of an idea about ds.

Beeston is really hard for us to get to, it takes 20 minutes to get into Not from where we live, the tram stop is directly by the bus stop and the school is three minutes away, it's easier and quicker for us to get there then the old school which was in the city where we live. ds is an academic child so needs to be somewhere that is the same. The potential school have a learning support team in place already and I know from the head's PA that there is already boys with Aspergers there, she showed us around and has talked to ds so she knows that the letter isn't accurate. I don't know whether to try and get in contact with her or go through an appeal with the head of the junior school. Hand on heart I know that his behaviour in class is no worse then other children without aspergers, he does his work really quickly, he participates and normally works well with others. The problems he has is in the playground as he doesn't always read situations well unless it's pointed out to him where he's going wrong, for example, a teacher was very quick to say that he annoys the other children in the playground but didn't say why, after talking to ds it turned out to be that he was joining in their games without being asked, it took me three minutes to go through the rules about being asked to join in with ds, after this he has not had the same problem again. He's been in trouble before as the teacher thought ds was trying to kill a worm, after speaking with ds it turned out he was trying to cover it over to stop the sun from burning it. I do believe ds, he's the sort of child that will pick a snail up off the path and move it so it's not squashed. He's a really lovely child, he's supportive and helpful to his friends but people are not always willing to get to know him. Teachers don't always believe me as I'm his mum and biased
The traits of aspergers he has is really not enough for a statement, the letter they have written for the GP is really OTT.
The poor lad can't win. I'm not prepared to let this go.

Does his therapist think he has aspergers or something else? Hopefully his letter will help.

Good luck!

I don't know yet, I have an appointment with him on Monday to discuss what he thinks. He's not given alot away apart from that he thinks ds is an incredibly bright boy. I know from the discussions I have had with ds after the appointments that ds is showing him the caring and supportive child I know but I also know that he has times when he struggles to understand how someone feels. He is only 10 though and this is slow progress. Ds has joined a club at games workshop and this is really helping him with teamwork skills.

Should I email the school and explain the contents of the letter and say that there is a therapists letter confirming that it is not accurate on the way?? It really should not have been sent to them.

until you know the reasons for his rejection you should just hang fire - you don't know that the current school sent the same letter to both the GP and the new school

the school will presumably be experienced enough in dealing with kids with SN to realise that you can't make judgments on a child's suitability on just one meeting - my ds1 can be absolutely charming most of the time - however if you see him on an off day you wouldn't believe it was the same child.

I think you have to accept that your ds obviously has problems getting along with other kids and sometimes when that's written down in black and white it's hard to take it in

I don't doubt your ds is a lovely child - so are my sons - but that doesn't stop them being really hard work. However I try very hard to be in sync WITH their schools.

Can I be absolutely blunt here? In every school there are some parents that teachers sigh about - they're always bringing problems of one kind or another to their attention, it's never their kid's fault, their child couldn't possibly be responsible because they're so bright etc etc State schools have to put up with them, private schools don't. Obviously I don't know you or your ds, but tbh from the stuff you post yourself, which is presumably giving a positive spin on the situation, I wouldn't be surprised if that was the schools' reactions to you. And if you go steaming in with emails refuting allegations which may or may not have been made, you'll just come across that way even more.

Sorry, I know I'm sounding harsh - I do really, genuinely hope your ds is OK, but I'm just not sure that the way you're approaching his education is in his long-term best interests

take care

I trained as a paediatric nurse so have seen all sorts of parents and all sorts of children. I am trying to be realistic about ds and his problems, I've been in situations with him where I have cringed and pulled him up very quickly on something he's said and I have always been upfront with his school, whether it has made me uncomfortable or not. I know he's far from perfect, he is rude, when I speak to him sometimes he does come across in a way that makes him sound precocious and obnoxious and he is never allowed to get away with this, however, the letter which was sent to the GP is not at all like the child he is, I have already been told by the Senco who wrote it that it was designed to portray ds in the worst possible was in order for him to get an assessment. I have not contacted the prospective school bar to ask them if they required any more information as I needed to give his after school club notice if he were to change schools. I am not in the school all the time, I don't side with ds over them but I do try to have an open mind about what's going on, I tend to side with ds 75% of the time though (but still support the school IYSWIM) because I know him well. If he's had a problem at school I do tend to go over what's happened with him and help him find another way to deal with things to prevent them happening again but I always try to talk to him about the part he has played in whatever it is that has happened. I may be wrong but I believe that this is the best way for him to see where things have gone wrong and it will help him in the long run. He is punished for things that he's done which are obviously out of order, privilages are taken away etc. I believe that he will benefit in the long term from being at a school where he knows the staff, he has friends and the teachers know him. I know there are parents that think their child does no wrong, I've met several. I can easily say I'm not one of them but it's the same as saying that "my child's bright", no one believes them. Maybe I'm failing him as a parent, the therapist ds goes to see was organised so I could find out whether it is my parenting that is also causing ds so many problems. I shall see on Monday.

This is the ds I know, a push over, kind to his friends and see's injustice in the world. I may have lovely rose tinted glasses on, I'm fully aware of this but he'll share his last chocolate with his friend. It does sadden me that he doesn't trust too many people to see this side of him.

What was the point of the exaggerated letter of referral? You say it was for the GP, but what was the eventual aim? It sounds like you want your ds moved to school action + and be referred to outside agencies by the school. If this is the case, by exaggerating his behaviours, the senco would be trying to goad the powers that be into action, because s/he would be assuming that your ds was going to stay at that school. Unfortunately this well-intentioned paperwork seems to have been used for other purposes.

Last year I received paperwork for a child due in my class in September that almost prompted us to build a cage in the classroom! He turned out to be a very mild-mannered and fun aspergers boy, with not a vicious bone in his body. His parents openly admitted that his previous senco had exaggerated his behaviour in order to get his statement.

Also, if written by people who don't know the child well, these reports are open to exaggeration by their very nature. For instance, the observer witnesses the child 'pushing in the line' and this immediately gets noted as anti-social behaviour. Never mind the other 10 children who are also pushing everyone out of the way!

From the paediatric training I have had I do recognise traits of aspergers in ds, I approached the senco in an attempt to say "I know ds comes across as abrupt, I know that in a playground situation he panics, I have always thought that he has a small level of aspergers, I am trying to get him some support outside school but I think he needs some help and some understanding inside school (IYSWIM)", she agreed with me. She wrote the letter for the GP as I was told that aspergers is now seen as a medical matter rather then an educational psychology matter (which is what I thought ds needed). She wrote the letter to make ds sound very bad as I was told he would never get a referral otherwise. I stopped my training a couple of years ago and was led to believe that this is the way the system works, Ds has spent a number of years in the private sector so I don't know how things like this work. I trusted that she knew best. I would have liked ds to stay there (when he first started), however shortly after meeting the senco the severe bullying started and I knew I needed to move him as he was becoming more and more anxious and upset. I really don't know what to do. He really is a lovely child, he's funny, rarely bad tempered, patient, considerate. I know his faults though and have always been there to point out the errors and help him make better choices.

So the GP would hopefully refer him to a paediatrician, and that would set further wheels in motion? So the senco was working on the principle, 'the more awful he looks, the quicker we get seen'!

It seems a real shame that the bullying has got in the way of this. Is there no way that you can sort something out with the school? Maybe talk about LSA help at certain times? Clubs he can join to keep away from the bullies? Maybe look at the school's bullying policy and then go and discuss what could be done? Have you talk to anyone at the National Autistic Society? They may be able to help you.

It does seem a little unfair to keep moving a child with aspergers, because, as you know, they love security and routine.