Sibling priority screwing over local kids

[SJ1987]

We missed out on getting in to our (extremely popular) local primary school. It’s an extremely good school, multiple ‘outstanding’ oftsteds, amazing pastoral/SEN provision. We live 0.38 miles and the max distance this year is 0.32 miles. The area we live in isn’t desirable for the amazing school. It would be considered rough by a lot of people.

Following a FOI request only 8/30 places went to children on distance criteria. 19 places went to siblings. Siblings are prioritised over distance.

We’ve submitted a further FOI request to clarify average and furthest sibling distance. But I know for a fact that kids attend the school from many miles away - often maybe having lived near the school before moving to ‘better’ places.

Are we able to challenge this? It seems grossly unfair that local kids are missing out to siblings who live in different towns. Is there a distance at which people are supposed to move schools if they move house? Or is this just the game when it comes to the best schools?

I agree it's unfair, OP. People saying "oh well you shouldn't have to move your child after they're already in school"- why not? Why shouldn't that be one of the factors you have to consider when moving? Personal responsibility for your choices. No one is forcing you to do two separate school runs, you can do one to the school that is actually local to your house.

We live in a tiny village. The school is so small that it's massive oversubscribed. We know several children who didn't get in from the village, including ones 5 minutes walk away. Yet a sibling who lives 13 miles away did get in. It's ridiculous, especially in a rural area where the next closest schools with spaces mean doing a 30-40 minute round trip twice a day.

If your LA/school publish that criteria, siblings are higher preference, then there is nothing you can do.

I actually feel more sorry for this situation than the one we are in. At least there are other schools that are accessible on public transport or driving, even if they aren’t as close or to the same standard as the one we missed out on. But 1 hour of driving when a school 5 minutes away couldn’t have you? Awful.

This exactly.
@CelesteCunningham if said single parent was forced to move then they could move their kids with them. Problem solved. If every kid was guaranteed a place in the same school based on their address then logically speaking no parent will find themselves in a situation with kids at different schools... Assuming kids live in the same house. SEN except obviously.

The real issue here is the massive variance in school quality. You only see this 'not wanting to move school' 🥺 when it benefits the child obviously...not when people deliberately move for better schools.

And the other issue is sheer numbers. A small number of people moving due to adverse circumstances is normal and expected. In cases where almost all places are taken up by siblings there's obviously some game playing going onz especially as most parents won't have that many children.

It indicates people moving tactically in order to secure their place.

Also to people moaning about school community.... What kind of community will a child have living miles away from their school and all their friends?
The mind boggles at this logic
I bet a lot of people don't want to admit that they themselves have benefitted from these policies at the expense of others

Did you really do two FOI requests to the school over this? What a nightmare for them!

No. I did it to the local authority. The first one is extremely easy - a breakdown of who got in with what reason. Information they have to hand. Maybe the request about sibling distances will require more work, but why shouldn’t we hold people accountable when it matters so much?

Same in NZ.

If you're in zone for a school, your child is automatically entitled to a place at that school.

All "out of zone" enrolments are heard on a case by case basis.

It makes for a better community and more children walk/bike to school so less traffic on the roads.

For England I don't think it's fair that any child living 3 miles away from school should be prioritised over a child who can see the school from their doorstep.

Children in catchment should be prioritised regardless of if they have a sibling or not. (After looked after children)

Remember (not directed at any specific poster) that if 25/30 places go to siblings or whatever, in (probably) the majority of cases, the family hasn’t moved and would still qualify under any catchment/distance criteria if that was first.

I don’t know the maths of it, but if it’s a “through” school with reception and 6 years above that, the probability of an applicant having a sibling in one of the years above them is going to add up (and as a couple of posters have said, there may be more siblings than spaces, especially if any higher year took a bulge class)

If you're in zone for a school, your child is automatically entitled to a place at that school.

What happens if there is a “baby boom” in an area , do class sizes go
up? In England, infant schools are restricted to classes of 30.

In Scotland, where a school also has to take you if you’re in catchment, there’s often more than one class for that year.

I was born in a ‘boom’ year and in one of my primary schools there was a P4A, P4B, P4C and a P4/5

It’s the same now, my nephew has three classes in his year group. Class size limits remain the same.

But what if there isn’t a classroom, does a portakabin go up?

Yabvu, you can’t expect parents to ferry kids to different schools during rush hour. It’s right that siblings go to the same school as the children and parents will be settled, made friends etc. You cant stop people from moving nor force kids to move schools when they are settled.

This is only true in cases where there isn't a revolving door of parents renting/buying in order to get the places.
If the original set of parents had stayed, it would've been their kids taking up places in the school and no more.
However, because they move away when they get what they want, they are replaced by another set, beyond the natural population demographics of long-term residents.

It would be really interesting to see whether this is a massive problem at many schools or only ... Wait for it ...erm, 'outstanding' schools.

Are people moving away from inadequate schools in rough areas wringing their hands about moving their child? Probably not.

So frustrating! We used to have this at our school (and lots of local schools) and they changed it so it was sibling priority only when they lived within 0.5 miles of the school - to stop people getting a place and moving out.

I'm not sure if that came from the local authority or the school, or as a result of pressure from parents (it was before mine started at the school)

Sorry birthday is a criteria???

The village that I moved to before I had dcs had an infants with 30 PAN. First places were given to cared for/ECHP kids (approx 5 each year) then around 20 spaces went to siblings (at infants or juniors). We lived 3 minutes walk but probably wouldn't have got a space as there would only be around 5 spaces left for first borns. It was a hot topic each year on the village FB group because if you weren't catholic spaces were offered in what was then an 'inadequate' rated school 40 ish mins walk away with no direct public transport route or wrap around care. It was well known that kids in the juniors in particular were coming from the surrounding villages which had their own schools.

Anyway, after we left, the admission criteria was changed and sibling priority only applied to the infants and juniors if you lived in the village. If you look at the admissions stats now the sibling admissions has halved.

People in my area do FOI requests all of the time—usually for the secondaries and grammars. It’s not unusual. It goes on the FOI website, so you can see them all.

Yes, oldest to youngest. Another friend's child was born on the very last day for his year, so was the last child placed in their town (fortunately in their lovely local school, but it was a tense wait for them). Not sure if it's still the case, or if it's a national/regional/just that school, I don't live there.

Move away and give up your space, it should be the rule.

I agree. My oldest is in her 20s I moved her school a couple of times . I don't think it done her any favours for her confidence or education. I made sure not to do it to my other children.

Also you can't be in 2 places at once.

Mine are in on sibling priority, my husband works at the school next door so he takes them on his way to work, it’s not reasonable to expect people with 3 children to go in several directions.

Should I start building my funeral pyre 😂

Please get over yourself. Think of the parents of those kids if they had to get multiple different kids to multiple different schools at the same time. There's a reason siblings are prioritised over distance

Why shouldn't that be one of the factors you have to consider when moving?

Ideally the local school is one of the factors that you consider when buying a house….

No one is forcing you to do two separate school run

Equally no one is forcing you to live in a place where you can’t get a school place that’s adequate to your desire

But there's no need for that to happen if the kids moved along with their parents.