Primary school offered place at C of E school

[Emma2021]

Morning

Our grandson who will be about 4yrs 6 months old in Sept 2021 has been offered a place at a C 0f E school. Presently he goes to a nursery within the London borough they live in but there are 10 others on the waiting list for that school so he has been offered this c of e school.

Two reasons why his parents inc us do not want him to go there. First is religion as we are not C 0f E and no disrespect to anyone and secondly he is used to the nursery and that is a non Cof E school.

We have noted that several of the ladies that take their children to the c of e school are quite vocal re relgion and 'born again' etc.

We are not ultra relgious, ie all of us but we do not want a C of E school or any other reglios school inc our own faith but a standard school ie one that does not inc name of a relgion/etc.

I do not mean cause offence to anyone and we are relatively open minded but I've met born again and other types of relg people that bang on about religon and we don't.

Many thanks,

It seems that the parents here did not qualify for any of the schools they listed.,

That is not clear at all. The OP has been asked several times but chosen not to comment on whether the child's parents put this school on the list, or how many schools they put.

My feeling is that in London there will be plenty of non-religious schools quite near with places free, but the family only want the school the child currently attends (nursery).

So he wasn't given any of the 3 options that the parents put down and was given a 'closest with a space'. Why did he miss out on his choices? There is the first round of offers done and then once they are all in a second round is done for others that didn't get their firsts etc or any of their list. The parents need to contact the admissions teams and talk to them about the options but need to be careful about blankly refusing his place as they may not be then obligated to offer another. It maybe that he needs to attend until another place comes up elsewhere and then switch schools.

(That is not clear at all. The OP has been asked several times but chosen not to comment on whether the child's parents put this school on the list, or how many schools they put.*
Yes, it sounds very like the old "I'm only putting down the one I want and then they've have to give it to me" scenario.
Never ends well.

[quote Emma2021]@Soontobe60

How is your point relevant to my question?[/quote]
We’ve no idea, cos you’ve yet to actually ASK one.

[quote Emma2021]@Soontobe60

How is your point relevant to my question?[/quote]
Soontobe60's post was completely relevant. The rude way you dismissed her tells us all we need to know...
You didn't get a place. You're not entitled to a place. You've probably made things worse than they needed to be by assuming you were going to get a place 🤷🏻‍♀️
Now, what's your question?

You haven't actually asked a question so I'm not sure what you hoped to get out of this thread.
Myself and other posters can praise C of E schools all day but I'm not sure there's any point in that as you seem to have formed a pretty firm decision on them.
If they don't like the school they can decline the place and the local authority will try to allocate another - this however will probably involve some travel.

@notgoodenoug

You haven't actually asked a question so I'm not sure what you hoped to get out of this thread. Myself and other posters can praise C of E schools all day but I'm not sure there's any point in that as you seem to have formed a pretty firm decision on them. If they don't like the school they can decline the place and the local authority will try to allocate another - this however will probably involve some travel.

That's not really how it works. If you decline a place, that's it. The LA have already fulfilled their duty to you. You can go on waiting lists independently, of course, but you won't be allocated anything else. Even if you don't manage to find a place by the beginning of term.

@Emma2021 the bottom line is you don’t have valid grounds for appeal ( from what you’ve written here ) and the LA a has fulfilled its obligation by offering a school place . If you don’t like the place offered then you go on the waiting lists for other schools , go private or home Ed .

I maybe misreading your OP and subsequent posts but if your grandson/his parents practice a faith other than Christianity I'm surprised they didn't think seriously about the best way to avoid a CofE school prior to putting in the application. Especially if (and I may also have misread this part, apologies if so!) you're saying that you also wouldn't want him educated in your own religion?...

Faith schools should be banned - there's no place for religious practice in schools - only theory ... ban religious schools!

I went to a C of E primary school as there was no other option in the village where I grew up. I was raised atheist and still am.

To be honest, I don’t know what your question is.

My only question is why do you keep saying that you wouldn’t send your GS to such and such a school. He’s not your child, it’s not your decision.

Leave it to his parents.

Surely the answer is to go and talk to the school, ask about how their church status affects their day to day operations.

All parents have the right to withdraw their child from collective worship if that's a problem, but equally, all schools will teach RE and will cover a range of faiths.

In my experience ( and I'm a church governor in a CE school) CE schools tend to be pretty light touch, and children of many different faiths attend them all over the country. The best bet is to talk to the school though, and discuss your concerns. None of us know the school you're referring to, so only you ( or rather, the child's parents) can make that judgement call

Ok Op - your son / daughter has a number of options:-

1. Go and talk to the school and find out how CofE it actually is. A lot of “CofE” schools are called that as back in 1822 when they were set up they were connected to the church but these days the connection is effectively limited to the name. A few evangelical parents wouldn’t put me off - my ds is best friends with a lad whose parents are strict Muslims - it doesn’t seem to have impacted his beliefs. (Although he was very cross that his mate got to “skip school” for Eid!)

1. Send child to school but have him withdrawn from all religious lessons / events

1. Ring round and get grandson on waiting list for all non CofE schools available. If you are willing to travel a long way in the mornings and / or accept an under performing school then it is very likely that there will be a place available. It just depends how much you are willing to compromise on other areas.

1. Homeschool (maybe whilst waiting for a suitable place to come up,)

1. Go private.

I think you need to speak to the school.
I am atheist and would never choose a religious school. However, when we moved to East Sussex all 3 nearest primary schools are c of e. In practice
They go to church service twice a year, the vicar comes once a month and they have singing assembly.
It seems no different to the secular primaries my others went to.

@Emma2021

Why are you so reluctant to tell us what your question actually is ?

I'm not sure what the point of posting is, if you won't engage with people trying to help you

You haven’t asked any questions.

I’m assuming they didn’t choose this school as one of their options, otherwise it wouldn’t have come as such a surprise that it has C of E in the name?

We have the right to express a parental preference with regard to schools, not make a choice. They should turn the place down if they feel that strongly about it, but the LA has carried out their duty and offered a perfectly appropriate school place.

OP the C of E run about 1 in 4 primary schools, for historical reasons. In rural areas in particular, they are often the only option so your grandson's position isn't unusual. Doesn't make it right but it's the education system we have so my advice is to make the best of it.

The CofE make much of being church schools but not faith schools, and of serving their community inc people of all faiths and none. There will be some practising Anglicans and practising Christians of other denominations among the families at the school but my guess is they'll be a small-ish minority. The children will come from families with a variety of faith and non-faith backgrounds, same as in any school. So far so good.

I don't quite agree that C of E schools are no different to any other school, unfortunately. That was probably the case until about a decade ago. More recently though, the CofE has sought to raise the profile and visibility of its faith in its schools and used its schools to raise its own profile in the wider community. None of that is to say there is any actual evsngelising. But religion and talk about religion and the practice of religion, through the prism of Anglican Christianity, will likely be very visible and more than in (some) community schools.

My DS is in his third year at a CofE village primary. DH is of another faith and I am an atheist (as is DS at present). We had the jarring and v distressing "first Easter" experience which others reported up thread - DS had literal screaming nightmares for weeks, school shrugged and blamed us/DS for being over-sensitive. And he feels "different" (in a negative sense) as a non-Christian in a school which self-consciously defines itself as Christian and bangs on about it A LOT to tick the Diocese's and SIAMS' boxes - which does not fill me with joy. We suck it up because he's otherwise happy and settled and we want him to attend the local school to make local friends.

I would say that from our experience, CofE schools are better at being inclusive and respectful of difference as regards families from other faiths; they are less at ease with people of no faith at all. It is our school's stated policy to nurture those of the faith, support people of all faiths and challenge those of no faith - nice and inclusive for the humanists and atheists (!) but if your grandson has a different religious background that will very much be respected and supported.

I have to agree with others. If they did t want a CofE school, as it's against their beliefs- why did they put it on their preference list? Seems daft to ask for a school you object to the way the teaching is done.

MN to parents agonising because of no/limited alternatives to a CofE school: "oh don't worry, they're no different anyway, it's all light touch, they're not actually faith schools"
MN to parents agonising whether to put their catchment (CofE) school as their last choice on their preferences list, despite not wanting a CofE school: "don't be stupid, you MUST put the catchment school down, you have to have a banker or you risk missing out on all your choices and being allocated a place in the school 20 miles away that nobody wants to go to"
MN to parents unhappy about some aspect of their non-CofE child's experience at school: "oh FFS, you shouldn't have chosen to send your child to a faith school then should you!"

The C of E runs a LOT of schools. There is often very little element of choice.

@SD1978

I have to agree with others. If they did t want a CofE school, as it's against their beliefs- why did they put it on their preference list? Seems daft to ask for a school you object to the way the teaching is done.

Has op confirmed they did list it? If they used their form to list six preferences where they stood little chance of qualifying for a place, on distance for example, or with a high proportion of siblings then this might have been the nearest available after those options were exhausted. Alternatively maybe the parents were less anti c of e than op and accepted it.

It's not 100% clear but I think by this the OP means that the school was not listed on their preference form:
"We were not aware there was a C 0f E school near us therefore did not mention of app form."

Hi @Emma2021, not sure if you are coming back, but anyway...

Your posts are not very clear, sorry, which is why people are not being super helpful, as you see it.

This is what I have:
A lot of primary schools are C of E (as others have said) esp in villages as it goes. IME based on friends whose kids have gone to one, they are not usually particularly evangelical, if that is your concern. My DC went to a non-CofE primary and still marked Easter with a play.
If the parents put six preferences on their form and got offered one not on the form, I can only imagine they put unrealistically distant schools. Is there a nearer school they would prefer?
They can put their DS on the waiting list for any schools they would like and places may come up.
Or they could send him to this school and see what it's like.
Or they could send him and withdraw from all RE
or they could home educate, or go private (tho time is getting short for that I think).

I am not sure if that answers your question tho, as I also cannot see a question, just statements.

@clary
thank you.