Would we be better off in Ireland or Scotland?

[PonderingAMove]

Hi,

I currently live in England in a very academic city, and my ds is struggling in school because he can't keep up.

The problems he talks about are that there are sheets of sums on the screen and he can't get them finished before they disappear and a new page of sums appear. He can't keep up in dictation class, he can't go fast enough in spelling tests, even though he gets all the spellings right. He does well with the questions given time to do them, and did well in his SATs. However, he can't go fast enough for the pace of the class and I worry that they are burning him out while he is still only 7.

I think the reason for this is partly that the work is very fast paced and he is surrounded by very bright children. Almost all of the kids have two graduate parents, and several of the parents are university lecturers. In addition to this, ds is young for the year, is behind because of health issues in his early years, and I think he may have some very mild SEND issues holding him back that have not been diagnosed yet. (He responds slowly when spoken to but understands written instructions quickly.)

I talked to a child psychologist and she said the school system in England is very driven at the moment and that there's no way to get away from it here.

However, my dh is job hunting at the moment and I'm wondering whether we should be seriously considering a move to Scotland (where I come from) or Ireland (where my dh comes from).

I was just like my son at his age and I benefited massively when I moved from a very driven English school to a move relaxed Scottish school. The flip side is that we are not very robust and I know I find the wetter climate very hard to manage.

I wondered if the difference in educational ethos is still there and whether ds would really do better in a different system? I really worry about him here because a lot of young adults around here have dropped out before university because they couldn't take the pace. These are kids whose parents are academics themselves.

I would be glad to hear from any teachers who have worked in both England and either Scotland or Ireland.

Thanks!

And I would second what other people say about the education system here. NI consistently outperforms the rest of the UK yet I have never experienced the angst about school that seems to be prevalent in England. I've never heard parents comparing reading groups or book bands (in fact I don't even know what a book band is), they just send their kids to school and let them get on with it.

The grammar school system works well here too. Kids are not written off and painted as failures at 11(despite what critics might say), as the non grammars by and large get excellent results too. I am in my 40s now and my friends and colleagues went to a wide variety of schools and I've never met anyone who feels that going to a non grammar failed them or damaged their confidence. I'm not saying that it has never happened, but it's not something that bothers most people.

I'm not sure there would be any jobs he could do as he's in rather niche computer stuff.

If it happens to be IT security or anything like that, Belfast could be worth considering, it's a huge growth area here at the moment.

I would look closer to home and consider a move of school, if they are not taking your concerns seriously..

Very few schools are as driven in primary as the one you describe.

Yes @Treacle. I've never heard any talk of tests, never anything from the school about league tables, we get a manageable amount of homework, thankfully without any of that 'build a Roman fort' business. Kids are streamed within each class and it seems to work well, certainly DD isn't discouraged not to be in top sets.

Come on over OP!

Jumping fron first page to third so apologies if already said. Glue ear can be recurring and just because it cleared up once doesn't mean that's it. So he could suffer from recurring glue ear. Does also sound like an auditory processing problem. If you give him verbal instructions can he follow them or does he get lost? National Deaf Children Society has some very good information on glue ear and different kinds of hearing problems.
Also change schools. This one seems an example why OFSTED doesn't always work in the children's best interest. Sometimes a failing school is better for kids mental health.

Thanks, yes. He's having some tests at the moment so hopefully we'll get an idea soon.

My dd has a visual processing disorder. And overall slow processing. Once given time she aces everything but before diagnosis was really struggling. We ended up having to pay for ed psych though as wasn't bad enough to get assessed through school. It has massively improved her confidence.

Gosh! Didiplanthis that sounds just like us. If you paid privately for the assessment did the school accept it and did they start behaving kindly towards your dd after the diagnosis? I'd be so glad to know how this all worked and what you had to do. I think we're on the same path.

I think you asking whether a school would start behaving kindly towards a child after a diagnosis speaks volumes about how warped your view of schooling is due to the bad experience you're having. Children should be treated well and kindly regardless of their abilities in school, and if they're not there are serious problems with the school.

I know you said you're not a robust family but a 7 year old being made ill due to overwork at school is really not the norm. DD is 7, academically average, and her concerns about school are what's on the menu for canteen and does she get to be the leader of the playground line.

Yes that's what I think too.

Are there no good schools in your area with places, Pondering?

People keep saying that it's the curriculum that's the problem, so it's largely the same in all the schools including the independent ones. I asked the psychologist and she said it absolutely definitely was. This is the problem.

Whether that's true or not, I'm not sure. One of the other posters is going to ask her headmistress and get back to me so I'm crossing my fingers.

Didiplanthis Can you tell me more about how it all worked out for you? Your story sounded quite encouraging and I'm going white-haired here so encouragement would be good.

Pondering I've not read anyone saying anything but the problem is the school, you say yourself the school has a bad reputation locally!

Why, when you have experience of just one school, you're contemplating moving countries rather than simply moving schools, I can't understand at all.

Your descriptions are nothing like the descriptions of any English school I've heard of.

I'd move school too, before I relocated altogether. You could just have a desperately ambitious head/teacher set desperate to climb rankings.

Your school is the problem here. I'd seriously considering moving schools before countries! Moving countries is way OTT.

I'm a school governor in the Cambridge neck of the woods and we don't have anything like the bonkers pressure your poor DS is under. NI is not a panacea - I went to school there and you have the 11+ (multiple varieties thereof) and segregation by religion.

If you can face it, you need to really make an issue of this with the school. To be honest they don't seem to be listening to you so it would probably be easier to move.

I also disagree that NI has a much more gentle start to primary - P1 is less playbased than reception.

I also disagree that NI has a much more gentle start to primary - P1 is less playbased than reception.

Although I was singing the praises of our education system earlier I do agree with this. P1 is the formal, sitting at the same desk every day type of schooling. They do learn through play though.

NI also has the earliest compulsory starting age for primary school, at 4 years and 2 months. People have been campaigning for years to increase the age limit in line with other places.

But you don't have compulsory segregation by religion. State schools are available to all. A lot of the non Catholic voluntary grammar schools are very mixed, particularly in areas where there is no Catholic grammar school nearby.

Try the west of Ireland.
We moved here 4 years ago when DS was five and had already spent two terms in a UK reception class and then started again the following September in Junior Infants in a Catholic primary (although we aren't religious and DH was brought up as a Scottish Protestant!)

He's absolutely thriving and last year there were just 15 children in the classroom.
I'd rather he had a fun happy experience of school at primary level than be forced to jump through the hoops that the English government are so fond of imposing.
Also, suggest your DH googles Ludgate.ie

Moving schools is quite a big step to take just because MN thread tells me to, and there are other big factors here that I haven't mentioned.

I had a good meeting at the school today and made all the points from this thread and I think we made a bunch of progress.

It turns out that the thing about not being able to go to the toilet during the sats at least was not correct, so that's a help to know that.

The teacher picked up already today about the anxiety about not finishing quickly enough with written work, so that's good, and I'm going to go into once a week with ds and look at his books to see what he's actually doing in class, so that's good too.

This thread has been good for getting the issues straight. I'm going to take the things I've got from here and try to be more pro-active about talking to the school instead of talking to MN. Hopefully we can make some progress and improve communications.

Thanks for helping to get it all straightened out.

Moving schools is quite a big step to take just because MN thread tells me to

It's a significantly smaller step than moving to another country, which also obviously encompasses moving schools.

Yes, clearly, but if we could sort the problems where we are then that would clearly be the best option. I'm talking offline to a poster who had similar problems and solved them without moving school and that is proving very helpful. It's all offline though so that's why my conclusions are not necessarily following the logic of the discussion any more.

Have you looked at the other schools in your area. Forget Ofsted. Go and see them and see if any have an ethos that would suit. Also ask to talk to the SENCO at each school. Just because it's a national curriculum it doesn't mean it is applied in the same way.

It's okay, I think I'm going to start-afresh with the new teacher and work on the ed-psych tests and see where we go. The tests are still ongoing to it makes sense to wait and see what they show.