Being a black child in a private school

[harunsmummy]

Hi, I hope this doesn't come across in any way prejudice or wrong. DH and I have recently been looking at schools and trying to choose whether to send our DS into a really good state school or a pre-prep. The main concern we had was that most of the pre-preps we visited had mainly blonde haired/blue eyed children. Our son is very confident, able and sociable but I feel that if he is in a school were he is in the minority that this may effect his self-esteem and development in some way.

I also found that a lot of these schools the children tend to "stick together". As in, all the white children were in a group and the ethnic minorities such as Asians, Chinese etc also stuck together.

So, now were are thinking whether it would just be better to send him to a really good state school (West Dulwich) where he can have a mixture of social backgrounds and be able to connect with other people that "look like him".

Does anyone have any experience of sending their child to a predominantly white school? If so, what's your thoughts?

p.s I went to a predominantly white school until I was 9 but this was not the same social class, as most of the kids came from working class backgrounds so the parents were we could say less "stuck up". I might also mention that this was in Kiev, Ukraine back in the 80's.

Of course all private primaries will be less socially diverse than a state school

^ This is complete rubbish

My DS is at a private prep and out of a class of 16 there are 5 children with white british parents. The rest are made up from indians, pakistanis, eastern europeans, afro caribeans and all sorts of mixtures of one or t'other. Hardly a homogenous group !

Socially we all have our children's best interested at heart regardless of religion and colour and as far as I am aware there are no issues. I love it !

I think you may find your DS wont see race the way the way the older generation do. My DS (10) never even thought to mention his new friend who had just joined his class was of Asian origin. He just said, short, funny, clever and really good at sport.

You will find many private primaries are very diverse as they have children from all over the world in them. At DS's there are Chinese, Nigerian, Russian, Asian, Japanese, etc. The children don't give it a second thought.

Some private schools are more racially diverse than the state schools in the area - my local school is predominantly white, the closest private school is much more mixed.

I also found that a lot of these schools the children tend to "stick together". As in, all the white children were in a group and the ethnic minorities such as Asians, Chinese etc also stuck together

I'm surprised at this tbh, in our experience both DDs mix in racially and religiously diverse groups. The only schools where I've noticed that sort of segregation is at boarding schools with significant numbers of foreign students, where I think for language reasons (and familiarity etc) the Chinese or Russian children for e.g. can tend to stick together.

DC went through one of the schools you mentioned and we know DC who were at the other schools. Skin colour never struck me as an issue. Where separation exists it may be more cultural, as ex-pat French mums tend to hang out together, as do Americans. If you could get hold of a class list you would be astonished by the diversity of family names.

Honestly it should not be an issue. Now at secondary DCs friends are a real mix and I doubt if they ever give it much thought. Of the three schools you mention, Newton probably has the more Sarf London catchment and artier parents, Eaton Sq will be more ex-pat and Eaton House has more of the banker brigade. Go with what feels right to you. They all get kids into good secondary schools. Newton's Head came from Dulwich.

There are a good proportion of mixed-race children at my dcs' prep and - even if they're not BME - the majority are not British in origin. The children pay no attention to each others' ethnic origins whatsoever and nor do the parents. I find it very sad that a child might be deprived of a private education because of such misfounded fears, though having said that most London state primaries are fantastic too.

In my experience children see friends and potential play dates. Not skin colour.

It's not necessarily the children...I find that when the parents are open minded and accepting so will the children. However, the issue with a number of these schools is that the parents from wealthy upper middle class tend to be very stuck up. There was once school (I won't mention which one it was) we were invited for an open day and when DS went to play with one of the kids, she snapped at him told him to go away (in a very posh voice) and then huddled together with some other kids and left him out. For any parent that is quite concerning and maybe a warning sign of what may be to come. We are mixed family (black and Arab) and come from working class and middle class background, so our son has been exposed to different cultures, languages and social environments from an early age.

bbkl you made a valid point which I completely agree with regarding that fees and selection process meaning that some private schools would lack that representation of social diversity.

S London state primaries are so diverse that no-one is a minority or a majority, I find.

I have not-white DC and do not find that it is a disadvantage at all in S London primary or secindary. At DC secondary the top sets and Prizegiving night are completely representative of the demography of the school, with black children achieving very highly.

I am very surprised at your experiences, tbh.

I think you'll find it better in SE London. I know for sure the school we're at is different to that. But only ime, of course, in my year and the parents I know.

I would say everyone feels they benefit from a mix, from around the world, why not, it's a good thing. But yes not as socially diverse, it's true.

It really depends where you are. DD's private school is the most ethically diverse school in the area she has 34 children in her year group from 19 nationalities. The children between them speak at least 7 different languages. It is the only senior school locally that allows the hijab, floor length skirts and has a PE option to accommodate this.

DS was a very small minority in his old school. He was the only child in his year with engish as his first language as mother tongue (plus 2 bilingual children - the rest having english as an additional language). He was one of 2 in his year with a british passport.

Kids of all colours and creeds and no issues.

If its a 'colour' thing then I think you are onto a red herring.

Check Newton again. If you look you will see a big mix of origins, and it not being an issue.

Hi OP, we are of African descent and have moved DS1 & 2 from a state school where they were the only black people in class but not whole school (think there might have been 6 or 7) to a private shool where they were the only ones in the entire school. We are not in London though so we knew that diversity would be a problem.

It did worry us but I can honestly say that we have never had a problem at all. Children DO notice skin colour but they do not attach any negativity to it. I think it starts to go wrong the older they get.
We try to expose the DCs to our culture as whilst I want them to be integrated I would hate for them to lose their identity which so far they are very proud of.

My problem really is the portrayal of BME or lack of in the media. Its just a single story of negativity and DS1 (9yrs) has began to notice. There is hardly any diverse stories about people of colour so we work hard and select positive personal stories to share with the DCs. Its hard work but I dont think the schools are the problem. Its the wider world.

DD1 is the blond, blue eyed girl in a Central London private school where there a lot of other white girls, some Asian and very little black girls.

Her best friend's dad is from Africa and my girl feels envious of her friend's hair and skin color - she says her friend is "popular" because girls from other classes know who her friend is because she is not the same like ever one else.

As some one said, kids at primary age don't see color the way some adults do, unless parents make it an issue.

I don't see why you think parents in private schools would be more racist - many of us are well educated and are/or have been professionals and worked in multicultural environments, where no one is not judged by skin color!

So, as others have said, it really down to the school that you feel would work best for your child's ability and temperament.

Good luck

OP what fortunate position you are in to be able to have the option to send your child to private school. Don't be put off by issues such as the ethnicity or social backgrounds of the children in the school, instead look at the fantastic opportunities your enabling your child to potentially have. Children these days have so much in common through the classes and ethnic background and also I am assuming your child will have a great command of English, so should have no issues. Also they will form friendships and network that will help them in the future. Good luck. Xx

Whichever school you choose, I hope you will go into with an open mind. Not all wealthy umc people "tend to be very stuck up" you know. Perhaps you need to be a little more broad minded yourself?

My boys went to state schools where the majority of children were from middle class white backgrounds. The very few BME kids in the school were universally well-liked and didn't suffer any problems at all. The only Black Nigerian child in the school had come from an ethnically diverse school in Camden where he'd suffered racist bullying.

Thank you all.

I guess different people would have different perspectives. I spoken to a few family friends who have mixed and white children in private schools and depending what racial side they're from they tend to report different experiences.

For us we don't see race or class as an issue. DH being Arab from a working class background and myself being black from a more middle class family (one parent a diplomat and the other being my countries ambassador). We both run international companies henceforth we mix with different people from different cultures and class, so have an adequate enough experience.

My concern is not the children per say, but more if anything it's the parents and what views they may pass on. DS has no choice really but to be accepting of everyone and we wouldn't have it no other way. He has Polish, German, Chinese and Half Jewish cousins and in our social surroundings we have friends that come over to the house for dinner and social gatherings from pretty much all corners of the world.

I have a very open mind about classes but from my experience a number of umc tend to stick together in very close circles. To an extent this can be explained as psychologically we tend to create social bonds with people we can relate with. What I don't agree with is the pretentious types who think they are above everyone and smarter than everyone because they speak the Queens English. And unfortunately, this is was also the view of a few ladies I made friends with from a class I take my DS to. One in particular who is white but from a working class background told me of her experience and where she felt as is she was an outsider and no longer felt comfortable attending that class because all the other mums would stick together, go to cafés after the class and not invite her etc. Another mum whom I met in a children's cafe, she was white and middle class with a mixed child said she'd visited a few pre-preps in Kensington and wouldn't feel comfortable sending her DS there has he would have barely no other child to culturally or socially relate to.

As I said different people report different experiences. For those who have positive experiences, it is a wonderful thing and the child would make great friends and probably have an invaluable experience but those who don't it can be damaging to their self esteem and development, which is what we are trying to avoid as best we can.

So its not really racial, more class?

I found that irritating cliques formed mainly from 2 very particular ex-pat communities. One from a culture/language side and the other from 'rich bankers and idle wives complaining about the size of their tiny 5 bed town houses, 'the help/maids' and their titchy estate cars'. I would nod and smile and chat to he many other 'normal' people. Our main issue was the constant changing of children - people came and went all the time due to jobs, projects, re-calls etc.

We found Newton to be absolutely normal. Less transient too. And the 'mums coffee mornings' were 'champagne elevenses' at swanky hotels or 'nibbles' at a rediculously expensive deli at £28 a head (for cheese! Cheese tells ya!).

harunsmummy - I honestly think you'll find small minded people wherever you send your ds, and also people who are open minded and welcoming. It really depends which sorts of small mindedness bother you the most!!

Even as a white, British person, born in the UK, I have sometimes found it hard when moving to a new area to make friends and find a "way in" to a new community - some people get comfortable with their pre-existing friendships and often don't make much (any...) effort if they've lived there for years and have all the friends they feel they need. At primary level, this can impact on children's friendships, as some people will quite happily stick with inviting their own friends' children round to play and encouraging those friendships, rather than inviting some strange new child from school that their child has attached itself to and whose parents they don't know very well... Basically, given that parents have more control over their children's lives at primary level, I think however open minded the children, you are still a little bit at the mercy of their parents! For a socially confident child, it has less effect actually in school, however, where my experience is that children will play with whomever they find the most funny/ cheeky/ naughty/ good at football/imaginative/ whatever it is that floats their boat, which doesn't tend to be skin colour, ethnic background or religion at that age! Parental attitude can make it harder for the less socially confident children, though, just on the basis that not being able to extend friendship opportunities outside of school can make it harder to cement real friendships in school.

ps my experience is with state schools.