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Original poster

Phonics versus Biff, Chip and Kipper

405 replies

Lukethe3 · 31/01/2013 14:09

I find it slightly irritating that at DS school he is taught phonics but then sent home to read the old ORT stuff which has tricky words at even the easiest level. Is this purely because the school has no money to buy new books or is there actually an advantage to be taught like this?
I have bought some Songbirds books for DS and these seem to make far more sense to me as they include the sounds that DS is learning.

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learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:33

That's not my question. My question is how do children learn to read the words one and two. And you are doing everything that you possibly can to avoid saying they learn them as whole words.

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:35

[sigh] by association with the numeral on the classroom wall which they look at day after day and think to themselves those letters must be the word one or why would Mrs Mrz have it on the wall

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:38

What on earth are you whittering on about now ffs!

Why don't you just say they learn them as whole words. It's not going to kill you. You've said it before.

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:39

now if i wanted to be really mean I could display the word one next to the numeral 5 and see what happens

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:40

learnandsay I take back my earlier question ...you really are that obtuse!

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:41

mrz, all the insults in the world aren't going to make your argument better.

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:46

The word one is related to the numeric one. But it does not mean "the numeric 1"

Reading is about knowing what words mean not what they're related to.

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:50

Learnandsay I have already stated that I do NOT teach the words one and two as sight words ...I do NOT teach any words as sight words is that clear enough for you?

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:52

No it isn't because you haven't explained how you do teach children to read the words one and two. All you've done is evade and now you're starting to insult. But you haven't explained.

I'll do it for you. It's much easier.

The words one and two are taught as whole words.

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:59

If I needed to teach the words one and two I would explain that in the word two the letters represent the sound "t" and that the letter is a way to spell "oo" with one I would say that we expect the word to begin with but it doesn't ...

and as I've now repeated a number of times I do not teach them as whole words.

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 20:05

You'd teach it like that? OK. I'd rather my child was simply told two is how we spell the word two. No doubt your version of how we read one is equally as tortuous. I don't know how remarking that it doesn't start with w teaches us to read the word one. How do we actually read what it does say?

simpson · 01/02/2013 20:11

Are there any other words that would have the tw sound in it though?

simpson · 01/02/2013 20:12

Sorry not the tw sound but tw making t...

mrz · 01/02/2013 20:12

I think everyone is aware of how you want your child taught learnandsay you have continually told us!

mrz · 01/02/2013 20:16

It's a through back to Old English so the etymology would interest some children

mrz · 01/02/2013 20:21

throw back even

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 20:24

So how do we read the word one?

mrz · 01/02/2013 20:27

easily

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 20:28

rhymes with bone?

mrz · 01/02/2013 20:30

are you confusing spelling patterns with phonics again learnandsay

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 20:31

OK, no problem. How do we read it?

simpson · 01/02/2013 20:31

I am a massive phonics fan and always wanted my DD to learn to read phonetically (which I believe she does although she has not sounded out any words aloud for a long time and actually does not like sounding out words she struggles with because in her words "it takes too long" however, for a word that is the only word to follow a phonetic pattern surely it would be easier to learn it by sight??

DD learnt several words by sight (said, like, to, any) because she learnt to recognise them before she learnt out to decode them iyswim.

I remember DD saying "that's why like is like" (she had just taught herself the magic e after watching alphablocks).

mrz · 01/02/2013 20:39

simpson the idea is that children only sound out words when they need to (if they come across an unfamiliar written word - which most words are when you are just 4 and learning)

the words one and two are throw backs to Old English spellings

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 20:42

Throw backs or no throw backs that doesn't explain how we read them. You've explained how you'd teach the reading of two (for which I thank you.)

Now please could you explain how we should read the word one.

simpson · 01/02/2013 20:44

Mrz - I get that. But in DD's case if there is a word she struggles with then she will just mumble it very quickly (hoping I won't notice I guess!!) because she is desperate to keep reading the sentence to figure out what the word is, rather then sounding it out.

I was exactly the same (although I don't remember sounding words out, but I did rush through certain sentences to figure out words).

She does not do it very often, so it's not a huge problem (maybe one word every 3 pages of Flat Stanley) but I just remind her to sound it out.