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Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

Primary education

Phonics versus Biff, Chip and Kipper

405 replies

Lukethe3 · 31/01/2013 14:09

I find it slightly irritating that at DS school he is taught phonics but then sent home to read the old ORT stuff which has tricky words at even the easiest level. Is this purely because the school has no money to buy new books or is there actually an advantage to be taught like this?
I have bought some Songbirds books for DS and these seem to make far more sense to me as they include the sounds that DS is learning.

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mrz · 01/02/2013 18:22

Usually because they are prominently displayed in the classroom alongside the numeral.

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 18:24

Are you saying that simply by looking at it along side a number they learn to recognise the word and know what it means?

mrz · 01/02/2013 18:30

Hardly learnandsay. Children are taught to count and recognise numerals you know.

teacherwith2kids · 01/02/2013 18:31

Very much as a non-reading child can look at a road sign and know that it means 'no U-turns' .. . or indeed look at the numerals themselves and know that they are written code for the concept of 2 things...

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 18:42

I'm not talking about numerals. I'm talking about the words one and two.

mrz · 01/02/2013 18:44

The word and numeral are usually displayed together in classrooms learnandsay

Alibabaandthe40nappies · 01/02/2013 18:49

learnandsay - do you really need to make such a meal of this reading thing? Your daughter is clearly reading well, school seem to be prepared to support your approach and she is making progress.
I could understand your obsession better if she was struggling :)

DS1 is being taught phonics in school and reading look and say books. He is managing fine, more than fine actually. He brings a new book home and can read it with only a little help sounding the odd word out, and me reading the occasional 'tricky' word out to him. He is already sounding and blending in his head rather than out loud for a lot of the time, and seems to be able to make a stab at things like 'ea' which I don't think they have been taught formally at school.
He does have a fantastic memory though and pretty much only needs to read a word once before he memorises it.

I don't particularly worry about how he is learning, that is school's job. We work on comprehension and expression at home. I go in and read with other children in his class in the morning twice a week - and in these areas he is streets ahead of all but one other child in his class.

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 18:49

You're not answering the question. The two may be displayed. You've said that several times.

But how do the children learn to read the words one and two?

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 18:52

Aliba, these questions have nothing to do with my daughter.

mrz · 01/02/2013 18:54

www.educationsupplies.co.uk/DetailsViewInset.aspx?image=250023.jpg&name=Number+Frieze&itemgroup=80658

Have a look at an example number frieze and tell me how do you think they know the letters o n e is 1 and t w o is 2 learnandsay?

Alibabaandthe40nappies · 01/02/2013 18:57

learnandsay - they are just memorising it.

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 18:57

Please don't set me homework, mrz. Just answer my question. It's simple enough. How do the children learn to read the words one and two. If you won't tell me then I'd be happy to tell you and I don't have to send you off to a webpage either.

mrz · 01/02/2013 18:59

I've answered your question learnandsay ...it's simple enough!

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:00

No you haven't.

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:01

Since you won't tell me I'll tell you. They're recognising the words as whole words. As aliba says, they're memorising them. That's sight reading.

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:04

It isn't teaching sight words learnandsay!

They associate the written number with the numeral just as they associate a picture of a boy/girl with the correct toilet!

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:05

or a big golden m with McDonalds

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:06

I'm not talking about numerals I'm talking about whole words, specifically the words one and two.

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:12

They associate the written number with the numeral

which bit don't you understand?

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:17

Numerals are irrelevant. It's about knowing that the letters in one relate to a single unit. A numeral is also an abstraction. A child who thought one meant only the numeral one would be confused a lot of the time.

The word one means a single unit.
The word two means a single unit and another unit together.

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:18

are you really that obtuse or is it an act?

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:20

Do you think the word one means the numeral one?

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mrz · 01/02/2013 19:24

can you read learnandsay?

learnandsay · 01/02/2013 19:26

Do you think the word one means the numeral one?

mrz · 01/02/2013 19:29

The word one has a number of definitions but your original question was how do children know one and two and as I've explained is is often by associating the written word with the numeral which they see every day in the classroom.

Do you want all the definitions of one?

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