How do you argue with a Head?

[RationalBrain]

No, its not a riddle, its a genuine question! In fact the question should be can you even argue with a Head?

In a nutshell, our DD has food allergies, started school lunches under the assurance procedures were robust, they take allergies seriously etc etc. First day, she was given something with her allergen in (thankfully didn't react). Since then we have been seeking more information to confirm it did have the allergen in, which we now have.

So emailed the Head very politely to ask about procedures, not robust enough (not identifying DD as a child who needs a special diet) etc. Head point blank refuses to acknowledge that DD ate the offending item, or that the procedures are in any way deficient. ("there is no way the staff would have served her that" - well, they did!)

So what do I do now? Can I argue with a Head? I'm assuming her word is law, and the reason this school doesn't have any problems with breaches of procedures is that she refuses to accept they have happened. Next time, a child could be hospitalised or worse. Apart from DD's word (which is 100% reliable in this case), I have no proof though.

I am at a loss. And also a bit concerned for DD's future at the school if we get earmarked as 'troublemakers'. (heaven forbid we are concerned that they could have killed her ).

Update

Just had a copy of the flowchart procedure the catering company use when an allergic child wants school lunches. It is brilliant, covers all our concerns over identification of the child in the school hall, provision of alternatives etc.

The head/the school haven't followed this even from step 1. This is why we have a problem.

I am utterly utterly livid.

Easy win then. You can bet your bottom dollar they will follow it now, and no harm done.

Yes, I suppose you're right there. The result could be good (although we decided last night to do packed lunches, I don't know if this will change our minds).

I might be able to appreciate that one day, if I ever calm down. How very dare the head treat these issues so lightly.

It's just a policy thing. She obviously thought the policies were in place to safeguard, and it turns out the catering company have a better one. It's no big shakes. In truth, the lunchtime serving policy is probably the least of her concerns in running a school. It's obviously absolutely paramount for it to be in place, but once it is (or she thinks it is) really? It's pretty much down there at the bottom of the heap. Ticked off as done. She has way more on her plate than monitoring the dinner ladies who should be more as fair with this stuff.

Sure, she takes responsibility as the head, but really, the catering company and the lunchtime staff are the professionals in this area.

Look forward, not back. Nothing happened, and now it won't, because the policy will be adhered to. Pat yourself on the back (have an indignant shake and tut and whatever to get it off your chest) but at the end of the day, this is finished. Disaster averted safely. Policy in place to prevent recurrence. Job done.

Are most of the kids in your DDs class on school lunches as my DD has just started reception and the majority are on packed lunches... are you sure your DD would feel 'excluded' on the basis of having a packed lunch especially as it means she gets to choose what she eats?

My DS (16 months) cannot eat cows milk, no anaphylaxis but it gives him a delayed asthma attack, so we avoid it as much as possible. He also has a serious peanut allergy for which an epipen is required. My experience is that dairy is more of a bugger to avoid than peanuts. Good luck if you decide to persist with school lunches because I would feel that she would almost certainly be (knowingly or unknowlingly) served something with milk in it... it is literally in bloody everything these days.

Do you have a care plan between yourselves, your local PCT, and the school? We have one for when DS starts nursery, it lists my responsibilities, those of the nursery/school and those of his healthcare providers and has to be signed by everyone. Incidentally, one of my responsibilities is to provide a packed lunch which is definitely what I would prefer to do anyway rather than wing it with school dinners.

To be honest whether there are procedures in place or not if my child had a life threatening allergy I would not risk putting then in a situation where an error could be made. I wouldn't even contemplate letting my child have school meals. I would see it as 100% my responsibility to ensure my child was safe - no one else's. it is a school not a restaurant. Even on the back of food packaging and restaurant menus there are disclaimers about allergies etc. I just would not take gust risk with my child's life.

cleef et al - there is no way of totally mitigating the risk. Up until now it has been 100% my responsibility (by the way, how do you think she currently eats if not by checking allergy statements on packets?). Now she is at school, for those hours, it is unfortunately their responsibility. Even if she has packed lunches, the school don't appear to think it important to supervise to make sure no food sharing or cross contamination appears there either. The solution isn't as easy as that, it is trying to make the Head (whose attitudes filter down the school) realise that this isn't an issue she can abdicate responsibility for.

In my child's primary school there are 400 children and there are 2 daily lunch sittings. Teachers are not expected to cover lunches so it is dinner ladies paid minimum wage expected to ensure there is no shared feeding of 200 children. It's not going to happen - each dinner lady must have minimum 30 children to watch. You need to ensure your child' knows not to share her lunch. I agree the serving staff do need to know that a child has allergies though but human error will always happen.

Perhaps ask if you can go in and observe the lunch process and then discuss with HT how they can help your child stay safe. Good luck though HT are like gate keepers to a school it is very difficult to get things changed. :-)

I agree with cleef that the role of ensuring that your child doesn't 'share' with a friend is mainly your role.
School has the role of making sure the policies and procedures are in place to limit the exposure to the allergen. What they cannot do is police your DD in the playground for every minute. There's nothing to say that another child might not have a half eaten packet of chocolate buttons etc in their coat pocket and offer them round.
fwiw, I have 3 DS with food intolerances. They have packed lunches so that I know that they have not been given anything they should not. I have never yet had an incident where lunchtime caused an issue. I have however had several incidents where the incident occurred in the classroom. I have always found this to be more unstructured than the dinner service.

Do you honestly think my poor dd doesn't have all this drilled into her? Fgs. She is only 5, and although she is necessarily very mature around food, she can't be held 100% responsible - for example if another child reassured her something was ok, she would probably believe them. The school need to help minimise the risk by, for example, having a no sharing policy, explaining to the children about allergies and why it is important, making sure dinner ladies are trained in tecognising the signs of snaphylaxis etc. It's incredible that so many people here think that schools shouldn't be accountable for your child's safety.

I think that some of us are saying not that the school isn't responsible but that no system will be foolproof and as cleef has said you can't realistically expect the dinner ladies to police this.

If you've drilled food safety into your daughter why would she take food from another child? I know she's only 5 but if that's the case unless a member of staff stands next to her all day you're never going to be sure that she eats something she shouldn't. I know it's not what you want to hear but it seems to be the reality of the situation.

Apart from DD's word (which is 100% reliable in this case), I have no proof though.

Fgs. She is only 5, and although she is necessarily very mature around food, she can't be held 100% responsible

I just knew someone would try to pick holes with those two statements, and I'm not surprised it is you mrz. I know my daughter and you don't. She is honest, but her judgement is still that of a trusting 5 year old. The two are not exclusive. I would expect you, as a teacher, to be able to apply that basic logic.

Here, have a back. You aren't the Head in question are you?!

No but I've taught "responsible" 4 year olds who are quite capable of knowing what they can and can't eat ... I also know parents who might pause to ask if their "reliable" 5 year old would know the ingredients the cook has used

I give up, you are determined to pick a fight for I know not why reason. I've enough on my hands at the moment to bother, so I won't be responding to your posts I'm afraid.

*what

That is up to you ...for some reason you won't consider the possibility that the head is telling the truth when he says your daughter has not eaten any dairy produce even though she has had no reaction to what she has eaten. Could it be possible they are both telling the truth ...she had chocolate crispie cake - it didn't contain dairy.

and frankly if anyone is determined to pick a fight it seems to be you (with the school).

mrz, I'm assuming from the OP that means more than just asking her DD....

From what I have read she is basing her assumption on a printed menu

Perhaps both are telling the truth and that simply the crispie cake didn't have dairy in it hence no reaction?

The allergen sheet, the head and the canteen staff all confirm the chocolate crispie cake contained dairy. It is not up for dispute.

Please for your sanity just do packed lunches and be done with it, and just ignore some of these unhelpful comments on here.

Also can I give you a tip...what a school says they do and what they actually do are two different things entirely. I have worked this out eventually - it took me until year 3, with much anger and frustration along the way.

As soon as something happens in a school you don't like/isn't right... just forget about bringing it up with the school - it won't make a blind bit of difference...just make sure you take whatever counter-action you feel appropriate.

As a parent of a child who has allergies, carries an epi-pen and has had problems with a school - I will tell you you MOST certainly can and should complain.

DS Infant school refused him antihistamines one lunchtime when he asked (aged 5) as "he looked fine" At hometime 3.15 he asked them to give his AH to after school club for them to give him some. They said he didn't need it.

I collected DS at 3.30 from school club and could tell immediatly he was agitated. By 4pm he was at the surgery covered in hives with his face swelling.
Heads rolled - especially after the school dr secretary said she wouldn't dose my DS "willy nilly" when I rang to say GP says DS requires puriton 4 times a day now and what did I need to do to get a dose administered by the school at lunchtime? I had to get another bottle from the GP of the same AH that stated 4 times a day to be used for the week and then they refused to give me the bottle of AH already at school that said "as required" because that for for reactions. Even when I said it was the same meds, I'd swap after a week and needed some at home as now regular and home bottle wouldn't last for 3 regular doses extra at home.

All I will say is though - I'm surprised your DD accepted and ate something that could potentially contain her allergen. Surely she knows chocolate treats/ cakes etc contain and milk and egg and that the school aren't providing her free from stuff? I've always ensured DS is educated as I never just relied on others to keep him safe.

For those questioning why she didn't react - allergies are hard to understand. Somedays there can be a minor rection which may result in some small hives or itching. Other times the same allergen can cause anaphylaxis.

Please PM me if you want to chat. I have been there and found educating others sometimes hardrer than dealing with DS severe reactions!