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Primary education

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Fund-raisers that won't offend Muslim families

167 replies

MrsLadywoman · 19/10/2011 16:48

My kids go to a secular state primary school in a multi-cultural area where just over 50 per cent of the children are from Muslim backgrounds. We are about to have a PSA meeting about fund-raising events and there have already been a few raised voices over certain suggestions, for example a roller disco (no music should be played), a barbecue (no pork, no wine) and a bingo night (no gambling). Could anyone offer any suggestions that won't offend?

OP posts:
LaLaLaLayla · 20/10/2011 10:52

There was an issue with eggs and butter, then people with nut allergies wanted no nuts, and then it got a bit out of hand because it started to stretch to red foods (cochineal? From insects?) and red smarties... then maybe pink smarties... so to avoid any trouble it became all smarties...

FFS Grin

Sorry to laugh, it must be tremendously difficult. Could you have a vegetarian BBQ? That would be suitable for everybody. As for dessert, you could ask the individual people with the allergies to make a suitable dessert for, say, 20 people. Then every foible and allergy would be catered for.

LaLaLaLayla · 20/10/2011 10:53

Oh, and 'mocktails'. These are cocktails without the alcohol. They are really popular with the Muslims out here. In fact, that would probably be best for everybody. Not sure alcohol would be such a good idea.

MrsLadywoman · 20/10/2011 11:00

Oooh. I really like the 'mocktails' idea. I will def put forward that we do an event where all the food is Halal and veggie. But the mocktails would be a really fun touch!

Yes, the cake thing was mental. I think they scrapped it because it started to affect birthday celebrations. Kids suddenly weren't allowed to bring in cakes/biscuits for the rest of the class as they had done on their birthday and it all seemed a bit crazy. So I think cakes are back on again!

I actually really like the cards idea. Perhaps they could do all sorts: Christmas, Eid, birthdays... a whole range!

OP posts:
CobOnTheCorn · 20/10/2011 11:12

DS1 has only just started school so I don't have much experience of fund-raising activities. There are a couple of things that have already come up though:

disco and cake sale - which I see has already been mentioned
art gallery - dc paint a picture at school and the fund raisers organised someone to frame them all and display them all. Parents came to coo and weep and have the option to buy their dc's masterpiece. Surely noone can get upset about that?
Fireworks night - quickly approaching

Someone has already mentioned that it's ok to do things that not everybody agrees with, just as some people won't be able to attend the events as the date doesn't work for them. Trying lots of different things will hopefully appeal to lots of different people.

coccyx · 20/10/2011 11:29

Why not a winter fair if you are not keen onChristmas one. If I had children at school I would be a bit miffed about over emphasis on offending one section of the school. Works both ways surely

MrsLadywoman · 20/10/2011 11:40

coccyx Yes, that's exactly the delicate balance!

I guess what I'm thinking of suggesting is having an event that's all Halal and mocktails etc, and then one where there is mulled wine and mince pies. You know, so everyone gets a go?

And the cards could cover all bases.

I'll let you know how it goes down!

OP posts:
Ephiny · 20/10/2011 11:41

Surely it should be possible for both sides to compromise - e.g. have the barbecue but have a non-pork option for those who prefer (presumably you'd have a veggie option anyway?). Similarly with the drinks, plenty of people might not want to drink alcohol (for various reasons, not just religious) so have plenty of soft drinks available.

Not sure about the 'no music or pictures' stuff. If anyone is really so strict as to be offended by those things, I think it's going to be very difficult to accommodate them!

MrsLadywoman · 20/10/2011 11:50

Ephiny This was covered earlier. Of course there are soft drinks and veggie food provided. The problem is that they are threatening to boycott if there is any alcohol or pork there at all. And we really don't want 50% of the school to feel unwelcome/not come!

OP posts:
alemci · 20/10/2011 12:11

I really feel for you. mind you I don't like the way you are held to ransome. ie. boycotting things. Perhaps you should let them get on with it and do what you want to do.

Are any of them involved with the fundraising. Why don't you ask some of them to attend a meeting to help. do they turn up to events.

catsareevil · 20/10/2011 12:40

Are you sure that 50% of the school would boycott an event with alcohol? Often the people who sit on school committees arent completely representative of the school as a whole, and have stronger views.

Lizcat · 20/10/2011 13:04

Gosh - stands back in stunned silence. My DD attends a school that the children of a certain royal family that is well known for being very strict Muslims, as a result of the uniform variations that have been allowed there is now a large number of muslim girls at the school. Our PTA has none of these problems. BBQs have pork in different physical BBQ to veggie option, we had a wine tasting. Tomorrow night there is a Hallowen disco.

crazymum53 · 21/10/2011 08:15

I have had a brainwave - how about having a curry night instead of a BBQ which chicken and veggie curries. Surely they can't object to that !

Majestic12 · 21/10/2011 09:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Fifis25StottieCakes · 21/10/2011 09:22

Our school do the cards and tea towels.

all the kids draw a picture of themselves including the teacher. There then printed onto tea towels and cards. You can also get oven gloves,chopping boards and mugs which we done in nursery.

lovely keepsakes and the grannies love them

Fifis25StottieCakes · 21/10/2011 09:24

heres one

www.fundraisingforschool.co.uk/

if you google school towels for charity it brings a load up who do various things

Himalaya · 21/10/2011 09:59

MrsLadywoman

We had these kinds of issues and tensions at our PTA too.

My advice would be to try not to think about it in terms of 'not offending muslims' as this leads to the kind of resentments and stand-offs you've talked about. The non-muslim PTA volunteers feel like they are bending over backward not to offend, the muslims feel like the PTA is run by a clique that has a bad attitude towards them and it spirals down in a bad way.

I would first think about what your PTA is for. People tend to think of it in terms of fundraising, but the truth is it is a hugely labour intensive way of raising funds. If you were really a fundraising machine you would just ask the well-off parents to donate £200 each and be done with it. PTAs are about fundraising, but also about bringing people together, creating a community, raising the school's reputation and profile in the community, having fun, making memories etc...

Things like printed towels and cards are ok, but they don't bring people together and they are quite expensive for parents compared to the money raised, because the company make most of the profit.

I bet if you asked your Head would s/he prefer you raised more money or did more to bring the school community together it would be the latter.

On this basis think about your events, and the way you run the PTA (timing of meetings etc..) in terms of whether it is inclusive to all the different families at your school -- WOHPs, SAHPs, People who don't work 9-5, Muslim and other minority religions, people with English as a second language, people with not much education, families with not much money, families with a lot of money (but not much time), new entrants, single parents, young parents, grand parents etc...

If you always have committee meetings in the evening, at someone's house with a bottle of wine not everyone will feel welcome and able to come. If you have them in the day WOHPs wont be able to make it.

It is a pain to do, but I think it is worth having meetings at different times, getting someone to translate if necessary and inviting people personally beyond the usual suspects, so it doesn't develop into the perception that 'we do all the work and no one else volunteers' vs 'the PTA is a clique of middle class white SAHMs' (this is my experience...it may not be the case at your school).

It doesn't mean every event has to be inclusive to everyone, but some (particularly the big iconic ones like the xmas/summer fair) should be. If you do a quiz night for example you have to recognise that only minority of parents who will feel comfortable coming to that - you have to be confident, educated and it helps if you drink alcohol.

In our school the Muslim parents were quite happy to come to, and volunteer at the xmas fair, carol concerts etc.... The things that worried them were events where drinking alcohol was a major part and events where their children might accidentally eat non-halal food.

While they would come to general family events, in general they wouldn't come to mixed events that were just for parents, since mixed sex socialising outside of the family is not part of their culture.

Positive stuff:

When invited one-to-one a lot of muslim dads joined the dads kickaround football team (but didn't go to the pub afterwards...)

One suggestion that came from some of the muslim mums was to have a 'women's pamper session' - they said to have it in the afternoon, at low cost rather than in the evening with alcohol and high prices. Some muslim mums did henna hand painting and eyebrow threading and we also got in masseurs and had a fruit bar. What was very successful about this event was that it was women only, so that nicab wearers took off their face veils which broke down some barriers between the muslim and non-muslim mums.

We also had a long and involved discussion about whether we could have a disco. The feedback from many muslims was 'if you call it a disco I wont be able to send my kids because MIL, GPs etc.. wouldn't approve'. We called it a summer party and had a children's DJ playing music and doing party games and almost everyone came.

I hope this is helpful, i am not suggesting these as rules of what-to-do and what-not-to-do but just my experience of how we managed to get over these tensions.

Fifis25StottieCakes · 21/10/2011 10:28

Im curious about this

Do schools like yours and ops do the whole Christmas thing. Christmas fates, carol services and Christmas crafts etc. Christmas discos with a visit from santa.

Do you have them but other faiths dont come or do you not have them at all? Im sorry if i sound ignorant as my kids are at what would be classed as a preominantley white british school iyswim

Majestic12 · 21/10/2011 12:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Himalaya · 21/10/2011 17:58

Fifi - yes to Xmas fete, Santa, father Xmas, Xmas lunch at school.
At my DS's multicultural school they did some kind of nativity every other year, and some other Xmas/winter show on the other years.

He now goes to a more predominantly White British school and I notice the difference- Xmas carols in church rather than Frosty the snowman in school hall, Harvest festival involves as vicar etc...

To be honest I think in ethnically mixed schools it can give teachers the chance to pick and choose which traditions to stick to. Where I think in my sons school now they assume that because most people are white they are Christians, where in fact many would be happier with a more secular approach to religious festivals (more eggs, less crucufiction... Grin)

Fifis25StottieCakes · 21/10/2011 18:08
Grin

thats like my school including the vicar and the church although one year they did do a really strange xmas play about aliens

I used to love the whole winter thing at school, halloween, bonfire night and xmas. Not so much now though when i realise how much hard work it is and how much money i shell out at the fete.

Mine would say a definate yes to more eggs though Smile

nailak · 21/10/2011 18:51

in my very mixed junior school, the minister would come evry easter and tell a story about a teddy bear that broke and was sewed together...

YorkshireRobbo · 21/10/2011 19:55

All,

I make my point on a pragmatic basis with a problem / solution. I am white and English. I am a devout atheist.

I have friends from muslim families who do not practice.. muslimism (?) and do nothing different than I or indeed act any different than I.
I have moderate muslim friends who do practice but certainly would not be offended if I roller bladed around them, music blaring out whilst eating a pork pie, swigging a glass of wine and drawing pictures.

I despise racism, my pionts are harsh and concern 'belief'.

Remember we live in a world where the PC brigade come Guardian readers come do-gooders assume they know what we are all thinking and will think.

Has any muslim at any point complained about music, pork being served, wine being drunk, kids painting pictures....the PC brigade would have us think so but in all actuality problably not - as most common, middle of the road muslims would agree.

It is not they who cause a furore and it is not they who actually care.

IF you have a muslim parent who objects to music being played at a kids party in England then let them complain and ignore every last word of their complaint...Did anyone put a gun to this persons head and make them read the koran and believe that 'god is good' and that eating pork is bad and music is bad and drink is bad and fun is bad - NO, they CHOSE themsevles to believe that. Why the hell should everyone else suffer just because of their warped beliefs?

Why on earth should we continually bend over backwards to support the BELIEFS of others. Remember you are not discussing holding a party where only people with white skin can attend. That of course would be, well simply beyond comprehension.

You are talking about holding a party that is no different than any other kids party held up and down our beautiful country. As before I have friends who come from a muslim background and are moderate. OK they choose not to eat meat but they certianly would not stop me from putting on a BBQ and they certainly would attend, they would just skip on the pork ribs.

Equally if I went to a vegetarians party I would just make sure I had a good steak before I left home rather than tell the host I will be deeply offended if no meat is served and I have to look at veg and pulses all night.

I mean this really is crackers. "When in Rome..." why are we the only country that gets so pent up about making sure someone is not offended? Someone is always offended by something with everything no matter what you are doing.

I will work on the assumption that no one has told you they would take offence to what you suggest in your first comment about the party. I would go ahead just as you would do normally. If anyone on the day takes offence at children drawing pictures then tell them to sling their hook.

If anyone in your meetings takes offence at the ideas you suggest for your childrens party then also tell them they are being utterly irrational and they ought to move to a country where there fellow countrymen will be of the same opinion and they can all live their miserable lives together safe in the knoweldege they never again need to face music, laughing children, food (proper food), drink and fun.

This is Britian, we are British and proud to accept and tolerate others who are not. Our tollerance has to go hand in hand with common sense though.

If I saw someone bullying someone else because of the colour of thier skin then I would be first in line to put a bullet in the skull of the racist bully. We are all born into our skin and we cannot change that.

We have to start remembering though that just because someone CHOOSES to believe in something does not make it right of acceptable.

We have to stand up to the 'over the top religious mob' and say that enough is enough, last time I checked we live in Britian not an arab state.

alemci · 21/10/2011 21:13

I have to agree with Robbo. why are we always so accommodating towards Islam. would anyone on the PTA bother if some of the kids were Jewish. They don't eat pork. Would the meat have to be Kosher etc.

What is it about Islam that has GB in a stranglehold. I think the schools should celebrate the nativity etc and the other cultures are interesting but they should not cause our traditions to be fizzled out.

seeker · 21/10/2011 21:18

Are some of your best friend's Muslims, by any chance?

Feenie · 21/10/2011 21:20

Hi daftpunk. I claim my £5 Sad