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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Original poster

Why do all the naughty kids get awards in assembly?

103 replies

daffodilsinspring · 20/02/2011 07:00

" Do I need to be naughty to get a certificate?"
Asked by friends DD (aged 5)

Anyone else had that experience?

OP posts:

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jenandberry · 21/02/2011 16:21

Many clever children work hard and therefore deserve rewards.

hmc · 21/02/2011 17:44

Whatever!

I think you'll find that many average children work equally as hard, if not more so

jenandberry · 21/02/2011 20:01

I did not say thet didn't. I was just stating that just because someone is clever it does not mean they do not work hard.

There are very few naturally clever people who do not need to work, especially in a good school where challenging work is set.

gaelicsheep · 21/02/2011 20:36

Hopefully I can drill into my DS before he starts school that any system of awards/rewards is a nonsense designed to bribe the bad kids into behaving well enough. I suppose that in itself is prety good preparation for real life where there is rarely any benefit from doing the right thing. I can foresee big problems though and I wish we didn't have to send him to the excuse that passes for a school quite frankly.

jenandberry · 21/02/2011 20:49

That is not how rewards are used in the school my dd attends or the school I teach in which my son also attends.

AbigailS · 21/02/2011 20:50

"I wish we didn't have to send him to the excuse that passes for a school quite frankly."
Oh, gaelicsheep, you sound very down! I'm new on here, so is it one particular school you are refering to, or schools generally?

jenandberry · 21/02/2011 20:53

I am not denying there are awful schools. My children attended a primary where naught children got rewards, the same kids had the key parts in the schools play etc. Not all schools are like that though.

I do get how frustrating it is when your only option is a poor one.

gaelicsheep · 21/02/2011 20:57

I am just profoundly depressed by everything I hear about today's education system AbigailS. He will be part of the big "Curriculum for Excellence" experiment. He's in a nursery which is not even starting to teach letter recognition or telling the time at 4.5 . They are so "child led" that they are apparently unable to tell him to finish his snack time drink, despite my worries about his liquid intake, because it has to be his choice.

I'm not impressed by what we're experiencing and even less by what I'm hearing about what's to come. And this school has a good reputation.

As for the subject of this thread. There was a time when it was recognised that something that every one can get has very little value indeed. My DS is well behaved (at school ) and bright and I am desperately worried about him becoming demotivated almost before he's started.

AbigailS · 21/02/2011 21:06

Poor you!
I'm luck that both mine are well into the primary phase, as I'm not sure they really thrived in FS. They were happy and made some progress, but were certainly really ready for the Year 2 expectations and style of working when they got there (or before?)

While I agree with you that something that everyone can get has lesser value, there would be a queue of parents breathing down my neck (I'm a Year 2 teacher as well) if there child hadn't received a "well done" certificate in assembly at some sort of regular interval. So our school policy is fairness, and using stickers etc. to motivate.

TwoIfBySea · 21/02/2011 21:08

Hmmm, well the curriculum for excellence is nothing of the sort!

That is what has led my dts schooling at to be honest I'd rather they just learn how to read, write, do sums and then all the other stuff. Plus this also seems to encourage the little sods that make everyone else's life a misery.

Um, that didn't help at all did it? If it wasn't for the social aspect (even the bad sides) and the fact that I need to work then I'd home school them.

janet41 · 21/02/2011 21:17

There are a couple of 'naughtier' children in dd's reception class; the teachers have tried various strategies and have now settled on letting those children chose a toy on a monday that they want to 'earn' that week - and then the teachers buy the toy for them on the friday and give it to them in assembly if they have been good. The toys are very substantial ones, not tokens at all. So DD (who is extremely well behaved) is quite outraged and i heard her talking to her friend at tea about what they could do to be naughty enough to get the chance to get a toy, and discussing what toy they would pick! I can see the benefits of reward charts etc but i think the school has gone overboard one this one and it is surely going to backfire soon (and yes i talked to DD about all this so try to stop her heading down this path)

gaelicsheep · 21/02/2011 21:20

Do you mean not an experiment? Or nothing to do with excellence? I think the latter?

I agree. The only reason DS will be attending school is for the social aspects.

Now I think stickers are fine IMO Abigail. No ceremony, just recognition from a teacher directly to the pupil concerned. DS used to frequently come home from his previous nursery (private) with stickers and he was really proud to tell me why. Then they introduced this god awful star child and class teddy bear crap and it all went to pot. Suddenly he's upset that he's not the "star child", that he never got the bear, etc. It was openly admitted to me that they have to be careful not to exclude the bad ones who apparently need to be publicly rewarded for actually doing as they're told once in a while. What was wrong with stickers, that's what I want to know?

TwoIfBySea · 21/02/2011 21:32

The latter!

TwoIfBySea · 21/02/2011 21:35

I remember getting sticker stars on my forehead when I had done well in primary school (mid 70s-early 80s) and yes, dts did get stickers and stamps on their work early on.

In P5 they get nothing. In fact dts1 was given in to trouble for refusing to write an answer to; would you kill an elephant if you had to?

WTF?

Dts both love animals, all sizes. That question was a complete anathema to him.

gaelicsheep · 21/02/2011 21:37

I can see I am going to be a nightmare parent!

jenandberry · 21/02/2011 21:42

You are the key to motivating your children. If you are negative about your children's education they will be.

My children are both reasonably bright, well behaved and very motivated. Their schools have played a part in that, but most of it comes from DH and I - not least because they have had to move around a fair bit.

Supporting your child's school does not mean blindly accepting whatever they do without question, believe me I have been sat in the head's office of my chidren's school making it clear where I think they have gone wrong. But if you provide your children with a drip drip supply of constant negativity about their school they are unlikely to do well.

Most of the rewards that students get in both primary and secondary take the form of stickers or merit points. There is nothing wrong with combining that with certificates or something else for outstanding achievement or effort.

I do agree with you it is ridiculous to publically reward children who are naughty for simply doing as they are told for a lesson. However you saw fit to criticise that as well, so I am not sure what you want schools to do.

If this is about one school, I sympathise as I have been there. Get yourself onto the governers or PTA and try and make changes.

gaelicsheep · 21/02/2011 21:49

I agree that there is nothing wrong with certificates for outstanding achievement or effort, But if every child gets a turn then there is nothing outstanding about it. It all seems rather pointless in that case.

Don't get me wrong, we will fully support DS in his schooling, but I do foresee myself being a frequent visitor/caller.

TwoIfBySea · 21/02/2011 21:58

It is about creating a good atmosphere for your dc where school is concerned.

Believe me they don't need to hear the grumbles and the teacher doesn't need to deal with the fall out from children knowing their parents don't agree with what is happening.

We are there as a parent to explain such injustices to our children, not the teacher.

I wouldn't be mad enough to let my dts know how much I disagree with homework! They would love to know I think that.

jenandberry · 21/02/2011 22:07

We agree then gaelicsheep.

I am a frequent visitor/caller and a governor at one of the schools that one child attends and a deputy head at another! I suspect I could outdo most parents when it comes to being pushy/critical involved.

Asinine · 21/02/2011 22:09

My ds1explained to ds2 that you got a mention in assembly "if you got better at something that you were't good at " so not to feel put out if you didn't get a mention.

Anice · 22/03/2011 18:02

My school does that too generally i.e. the naughty children are praised to high heaven in assembly for the smallest improvement in behaviour or work (presumably so they will be encouraged to try to be good) whilst the higher achieving, and better behaved children tend to get honoured less.

I can see what the school is trying to do, but it does prompt some difficult questions at home such as "Why did he get the award for starting to hand in his homework when the rest of us have always handed it in on time?"

HouseTooSmall · 22/03/2011 18:24

I see my little one who is not in the top group or the bottom/not the best behaved but not the worst slip through the net with 'special mention awards' in assembly. Sometimes I think bloody hell surely he has done something special as I see child after child get awards each week. Too pushy to ask the teacher I guess...

MrsDaffodill · 22/03/2011 19:38

"In fact dts1 was given in to trouble for refusing to write an answer to; would you kill an elephant if you had to?

WTF?

Dts both love animals, all sizes. That question was a complete anathema to him."

Am I missing the point? Why didn't he just write - "no, I never would, I love animals and the very idea is awful to me"

That said, even if he loves animals, would he not kill one to stop it crushing another human to death? To put it out of its misery if it was very hurt?

flippinpeedoff · 22/03/2011 19:51

In our school the naughty children are neglected. They are not motivated and praised, they end up being more naughty, always being punished and failing, basically. It's always the girls who get given stuff and who win competitions. It makes me angry.

Kaekae · 19/04/2012 00:40

The awards should be scrapped if they can't make them even and fair.
My DS 4, is a gentle little boy loves learning and loves school. However, he is being bullied by a boy who last week received a Governors award, total slap in the face for my son. Tonight he asked me whether he had to be naughty to receive an award. My son is desperate for some recognition, he is always comparing his class star chart to see who has the most stars. I don't like it, forcing children to be so competitive at such a young age. The quiet children get overlooked fact, but it isn't fair and should be stopped.

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