desperately sad..nursery sent home Eyfs specialist guidance and assessment inclusion officer report. why.? what does this mean?

[samzaffar123]

Please help. I have one 3 year old boy recently starting day nursery eg 4 months ago. He's just had a specialist guidance assessment from the county councils assessor. Why.? Is this normal for all children.?the report states he doesn't use words doesn't communicate and just relies on waiting for adults to help him. He's the exact opposite at home and am very upset to read the report, and to learn he was undergoing an assessment without my knowledge? Please advise. Is this normal due to recent government changes or is there something wrong with my baby that I don't know about?

I'd be furious and certainly if any other choice would withdraw him from that nursery immediately.

4 months at 3 with no speech and they haven't asked you questions that gave away he wasn't speaking there??? That's insane. They haven't asked you simple stuff like - he doesn't verbalise when he needs the toilet, how does he express this? Or, because he doesn't use speech we've been using makaton with him here, do you use it at home ever? Etc

They should have been asking questions about how they could perhaps get him to communicate or understand his communication. I was asked on our very first day how DS usually expressed needing the loo, or if he would tell them/show if he was unhappy etc.

It really doesn't sound like they have bothered to cater for his needs much if they haven't included you in any discussions that alluded to him not speaking

They haven't made me aware in the slightest that he's mute. Good point about needing the toilet. Thinking back now there was an incident when he came home soiled around two months ago. I queried this and the staff there said oh he must've wandered off his own accord to the bathroom. It seems he sat on the toilet but wasn't cleaned. I was told well we'll ensure to remind him to tell us whenever he needs to go or be cleaned. But reality was that he didn't speak so how would they have known or what exactly would they have said to him. Do I pull him out of nursery now and make do for six months with play centres etc or do I still send him to nursery up until the second placement in September. I would think and am already thinking what a massive failure of a mother that I couldn't recognise or see this coming. He must be unhappy about something. Also valid point noted red dinosaur About not belonging. He's the only mixed race child there. Does that have any impact on anything?

I took him yesterday to the potential new nursery and he cried saying i don't want this nursery i want to go to my old nursery but then immediately retracted whilst sobbing that he doesnt want to go to any nursery and he just wants to go home I note the point about reduced hours and think it's crucial I act upon that. Have I pushed him into something too much too soon? My nieces and nephews all went to nursery very earlyon and are now thriving. I still left him until 3.but maybe I was naively wrong with my own child.

One thing I forgot to mention was we've actually planned a family holiday for 3 weeks. Planned six months ago. fly out next month. Is this a good time to pull him out have the holiday come back and then take it from there.?

I'd keep him out until September.

Thank you so much for your continued unwavering support. I felt alone in all of this and am really bad with computers actually. I will take him out go on holiday and enrol him into the new nursery for September. Thank you xx

Hi Op,

Sorry if I'm repeating what some others have said but as the Mum of another very very quiet little girl (barely spoke at pre-school) these are some things we did:

• Firstly, arrange some playdates with friends from nursery. Either at your house or theirs (find out from your DS who he plays with/likes). Encourage your DS to take the friend to his room to play with his toys and listen to them. Does he talk to his friend when there aren't adults around? Does he respond to questions that the other Mum asks him directly or that the child asks him?

• If he is happy to communicate with one child, increase the number (preferably not 2 children though because 3 tends to be a crowd and he may get left out if he's quiet). Arrange for a small group of them to have a craft day at your house. Not somewhere like a park where they can all run off separately. Again see what he does and how he communicates.

With DD they said she hardly spoke (but wasn't mute) but they just said she was very shy. She would talk ten to the dozen at home so like you, we weren't worried.

When we decided on a primary school the Manager of the pre-school advised us against a large school saying that because DD struggled to communicate effectively, she wouldn't get the best out of it. So we chose a small village school.

DD is now 5 and in Yr1. She happily speaks in front of the whole class and will put her hand up happily to offer answers to questions. She's still one of the quieter ones but the school have done wonders to bring her out of herself. She also does singing lessons and sang, with 3 other children in the middle of town at Xmas, on a stage with her own microphone and had no fear whatsoever. It was amazing to see how far she's come.

Advice I would give (that I needed to take myself) was the following:

• When he gets comfortable with a new friend and you are comfortable with the Mum, try and leave your DS with them at their house for a couple of hours and have the Mum monitor his communication.

• Don't answer for him when others ask him questions. I always used to answer for DD when people asked her questions (and I still do sometimes if it's a new person and she gets really shy).

• Encourage him to speak to adults that he doesn't know. Eg. Give him the money in a sweet/toy shop and stand next to him at the till while he pays for things saying 'Please' and 'Thank you'. DD now asks for our bread to be sliced in 'Asda'. It's her favourite job when we go shopping (but probably a bit much for a 3 year old ).

Try anything to get him to communicate with people he doesn't know.

It could be that it's the number of children/adults in the setting that is causing the mutism and any help they can give with that can only be a good thing. But if it turns out that it's that 'particular' nursery that is the problem, then maybe moving him would be the best thing or alternate the days with a CM so that he gets different sizes of social setting.

Good luck OP.

I also think his nursery sessions are quite long if he doesn't need to be there. It's a huge chunk of his week, and the independence thing usually comes in its own time- he's still quite little.
At his age, half days would be something to consider.

Mm, samzaffar123, can I suggest you handle DS's withdrawal from this nursery cautiously?

They sound like they combine unprofessionalism with high-handedness with quite a patronising attitude towards you (expecting they don't have to tell you anything, but you're supposed to go off and write a diary for them).

I'm also getting the slight itchies round them behaving like this to the only mixed race child in the nursery.

It may be nothing. And certainly DON'T PANIC!

But I would just plot a slightly defensive route for this withdrawal.

When you're ready, state your intention to leave IN WRITING. Keep a copy. Outline the events above. Thank them for their concern for your DS, say that you are extremely disappointed that they got as far as three external assessments for your DS without even mentioning to you that he was mute at nursery, never mind asking you how he was at home or giving you the opportunity to work together on any needs DS might have. State that it is their lack of communication that is the reason for you changing DS's nursery, as you are not confident they are behaving in a way that is best for DS. (If you like, cite the toileting issue as a way your DS has been disadvantaged by their failure to tell you what was really going on so you could effectively work together.)

Phrase it in terms of best care for DS, not in terms of "how dare you do things behind my back".

This is probably overkill, but it won't hurt to do it.

Because if the nursery takes umbrage at you having challenged them (in the mildest way) yesterday, they could cast you as an unco-operative parent removing your child from the caring professionals who are doing their best to help him.

OP, obviously I don't know if this is relevant, but in my experience nurseries can be very reluctant to raise developmental issues with parents. I think they worry about what we're going to say, or how we're going to react.

My dd was nearly four but being a September birthday wasn't due to start school for a year. I realised that her speech was significantly delayed (as in, she couldn't talk). Rather than simply going to the HV, I thought I'd get the nursery to raise concerns - I thought this might be more effective. As soon as I spoke to her nursery I got a very shame-faced response: "Yes, we've been meaning to speak to you about her speech for some time... she is very delayed." I definitely felt that they were scared of raising such a sensitive issue with me... and I really don't think I'm a scary parent.

I do think that the nursery have acted in an unprofessional manner - but on the whole it's probably a good think that assessments are being carried out. But don't be afraid of giving your perspective on your son's abilities - that's just as valid as his nursery's views.

To get to the point where they don't tell people external professionals are coming in to assess the child is a whole different level of bad communication, though, jeee.

If you're a child care professional, communicating with parents is an important part of the job. It isn't always going to be nice things that need to be communicated, and if the nursery can't manage such straightforward communication then they are very poor at their jobs. I don't think it should be accepted as excusable.

I also don't think you need to worry about what PausingFlatly is raising. If you withdraw your son, they're aren't going to cast you in the light of an uncooperative parent! Especially if you document it all clearly, and then take him to the GPs to ask for your own referral/assessments, and if you take him to another childcare provider or playgroup.

Absolutely, capsium. It's unjustifiable. But given the threads on mumsnet in which parents are fobbed off, and refused external assessments, I think that it's worth the OP seeing the assessments as a useful step forward. That said, I'm pretty sure I'd remove my child from a nursery where communication was that bad.

What Elsa said.

Also, concentrate on helping him make friends, playdates etc., Nursery/school is always easier to face with a friend by your side.

I really think the nursery you are using is awful. If he does not need to be there, reduce his hours by half.

Good luck

jeee You want good quality assessments that do not ignore the parents' experiences of their child though.

Assessing without the primary caregiver's input suggest they are assessing to cover their own backs concerning the child's lack of progress, rather than any genuine concern for the child. If they were genuinely concerned they would have communicated their concerns before now, in order to work together with the parents to tackle any difficulties.

There is a possibility that it is this particular setting causing anxiety in the child. If they are this bad at communication it would raise my suspicions concerning how professional the nursery are in other areas.

Update guys...I carefully worded a detailed email following the meeting yesterday and my concerns to the nursery. The SEN coordinator and manager have now responded with apologies and almost embarrassment but put tactfully by them. They first assessed him in the first month he was there then twice this year. They apologise for lack of communication but didn't want to worry me. They say it's under control now ...didn't want me to panic but they will get there with him in the end. He's built a relationship with them apparently. They want to reassure me his hours are fine he needs long hours for routine and consistency and if I pull him out or reduce his hours this could affect him more negatively rather than positively. They don't know why he doesn't speak. He doesn't laugh there either. But if he finds something funny or hilarious he smiles but stifles his laughter. He hasn't laughed out loud with them yet. With respect to play dates ...dad does most of the pick ups and drop offs and he doesn't speak to the others... mostly mums. I need guidance how to build a rapport with the others considering am rarely there for pick ups and drop offs and also all the other children's times vary. i will however ask my darling spiderman about who he would like to have round. Madrigals thank you for asking about food. ..I didn't actually have any food today because am researching mutism at every possible opportunityou. ..mornings lunch breaks etc but am very hungry now. ..I feel I need to rush home I feel excited about seeing my baby. ..right now on the way back home I feel I have a date with my baby...hunger surpasses with this excitement... By the way what's a Salt please? Apologies for my naivety.

Speech And Language Therapy - SALT

Glad you've got a more reasonable response from them today. They didn't want to worry you is a shit excuse though - what on earth did they think the assessment report in his bag was going to?

I would remove him and try the other place in September. I think the nursery are covering their backs by saying-
They say it's under control now ...didn't want me to panic but they will get there with him in the end. He's built a relationship with them apparently. They want to reassure me his hours are fine he needs long hours for routine and consistency and if I pull him out or reduce his hours this could affect him more negatively rather than positively.
Personally I think it sounds like a poor environment for your son to be in, and I'd be surprised if you can list any reasons to continue, knowing what you know of them. At age 3 they should be gently encouraging your son to feel comfortable, explores his interests, express his needs and have fun. I'd be worried that being in this environment for most of the day is actually reducing his self-esteem, not building it. Up to you of course but I'd have no trust in them.