Prepping for pandemic...

[wheresmymojo]

I was quite blasé about the novel corona virus outbreak but things I've read today have changed my mind.

I'm not usually a prepper but best things to stock up on for a pandemic?

Surgical face masks?
Latex gloves?
Anti bac wipes and hand wash?

I’ve been worried about an old school friend who moved to China a few years ago

His wife is expecting a baby in 2 weeks

He’s a prolific Facebook poster as he’s into marketing , art, photography etc

And he’s been silent since Monday

Hoping it’s just from the social media block they might have on at the moment

Median age of cases outside China is 45.

"Critical demographic data that seems to suggest that the novel coronavirus can be dangerous for people of any age, can be derived from what has been reported about 2 patients in France who are now being treated in intensive care in Paris: it is a young couple aged 30 and 31 years old, both Chinese citizens from Wuhan who were asymptomatic when they arrived in Paris on January 18"
www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

How’s anyone to know the truth?!

You’ve hit the nail on the head. In a time of crisis, it’s really important that we are able to rely on the quality and integrity of our leaders. When our political leaders are inveterate liars, or when they are not elected but appointed by a totalitarian regime, there comes a point where there is no confidence left. In fact, people become very cynical, and eventually tend to assume that whatever the government says is a lie. This creates a vacuum of information and a fertile ground for rumours (and conspiracy theories) that can be very disruptive.

One of the things that is really annoying Hong Kongers right now is the way the WHO seems to be kowtowing to Beijing, especially the lavishing of praise over the way they’ve tackled the epidemic. In fact, they did try to cover it up for a while, and many epidemiologists are saying the real number of cases is much higher than reported. Many people think the WHO is playing an overtly political game to remain on China’s good side, by telling other countries to keep their border open.

People will believe what they want.

For brexit now read coronavirus.

There is no proof whatsoever to substantiate your fears and panic.

The posters of MN are however terminally insane. Of that there can be no doubt. It’s in the Lancet.

Poppy, people having 1 months worth of food means if something goes wrong, they are not joining the people panic buying or those that couldn’t afford to stockpile. It helps in those situations.

In an outbreak, having enough medication to treat at home, stops sick or infected people going to the chemist to then buy their lemsip, so that helps hugely as well in reducing infection.

Great if you’re fit and well, some people aren’t. Swine flu killed healthy people, pregnant people etc.

Surgical face masks that you can just buy over the counter last 14 minutes. I wouldn't bother!

None of the healthcare workers that died from SARS in Canada lived in Canada all their lives or for even half of it, there's nothing to say any of them didn't have an underlying condition already and all of them were 50+. I don't think the vague reports on those 3 people mean healthy people that lived in the fresh air of Canada died from SARS. It outbroke in a hospital after a woman returned from Hong Kong and spread it to her son and others. Generally people that are in hospitals are not well.

I don't think it's an assumption to say that China has bad pollution and a lot smokers so this is why a respiratory disease might be hard to contain there and treat due to the amount of poor quality respiratory systems many citizens already have.

If it breaks out somewhere that people generally have good respiratory systems, they will stay at home and treat it like a common cold or mild chest infection. But if it breaks out somewhere that there's a lot of people with poor respiratory systems, this increases the amount of medical help they might seek so they venture out and go to hospitals and infect others or they may think it's just part of life as they're used to respitory complains so they still go to work etc in the early stages.

I think more will come out about how the pollution issues and amount of smokers keeps giving China these epidemics with coronaviruses and making people living there far less likely to battle it. Also other highly populated and polluted countries around the world.

It's basic common sense that if an area of your body is not working as well as it could, any infection or virus to it will be harder to fight off. Pollution already kills 1 million people a year in China without any coronavirus doing the rounds. It's being kept all hush hush because there's already an enormous weight on China's shoulders to drastically cut it's pollution and mass emissions. The people there are breathing it in everyday, it's not right. They deserve better

YappityYapYap I think you’re massively reaching there; and wild theories about how everyone is going to be absolutely FINE is just as ridiculous and unhelpful as the theories out there about how we’re all about to drop dead at any moment.

Most of the discussion on this board has been about sensible preparation and how caution (not panic) is advisable. Posters have given their experience of how other governments have responded to this issue - other countries have imposed quarantined and effective house arrests - surely there is valuable insight to be gained here?

I haven't said everyone is going to be fine, I said immune compromised people, the elderly and now smokers will need to be careful in the UK. China only banned indoor smoking in Beijing less than 5 years a go so that's another factor to take into account, that many people have been subjected to second hand smoke most of their lives where as we've had a total ban for almost 14 years here and there was phasing out in a lot of places for a decade before that.

People know the whole truth of all the cases hasn't came out in China just like in the SARS case. In the UK though, we seem to get the facts within hours. You don't lock down social media and things because you're happy for everyone to know your business....

I don't think we need to put our gas masks on just yet though as there's only two cases and neither have been fatal

Neither have been fatal yet, it’s early days to declare they’ll be fine. Hopefully they will but no one can say for certain

FFS @YappityYapYap, you are talking complete bullshit about SARS in Toronto. I can’t even be bothered to refute, I can see you’ve made up your mind about it.

For those who actually care about facts rather than fiction:
www.nytimes.com/2003/05/15/world/the-sars-epidemic-canada-toronto-is-stricken-from-warning-list-issued-by-who.html

The posters of MN are however terminally insane

Speak for yourself mate...

What bullshit am I talking exactly? It doesn't say anywhere that the 3 health professionals that died from SARS were totally healthy and had no pre existing conditions. I gathered that from the previous link you shared about it! They were all over 50 as well and hadn't lived in Canada all their lives... they were all from Asia.

Anyway, SARS was more serious than the current coronavirus so if it killed healthy people, that would be a given due to the strain it was but this strain doesn't seem to be killing healthy people, does it? Unless you have an example of it killing someone that was considered to be in good health with no previous complaints of respiratory issues? It was brought to Canada by a woman that did business in Hong Kong regularly... so your article posting is just pushing me further into thinking that the pollution and smoke epidemic in China is causing such an epidemic every time they have an outbreak of a coronavirus.

You actually don't need to start swearing either just because my opinion differs to yours. Learn some social skills...

@YappityYapYap there are 2 people in ICU in Paris who are 30 and 31, they are very sick from this illness, it's far too early to say it isn't killing healthy people. You might be right, but you sound absolutely desperate to be right in order to make yourself feel less worried. It's understandable but what you're saying cannot be verified right now.

@YappityYapYap

This strain doesn't seem to be killing healthy people

How can you possibly be sure of that?

The people in Paris are from China! The whole point I'm trying to make is that if it starts killing healthy people in China or from China, they need to wonder if these people are actually healthy, like is their respiratory system actually healthy? I don't need to be a right, I just don't understand why it's not common sense that people in China or from China are dying or getting seriously ill from a respiratory disease that isn't meant to kill people that are otherwise healthy.

The point about the Toronto thing is that we don't know if they were healthy and they had previously lived in highly polluted countries and the spreader was a regular visitor to China. It all just seems to link to China and people there seem way more susceptible. That is all

45% of the cases were among health care workers. Fewer than 10% of the fatalities (that’s for all cases, not just health care workers) were immunosuppressed. Only 25% had lung co-morbidity.

There is a strong undercurrent of xenophobia in your assertion that the health workers affected had “not even spent half their lives in Canada”. You are making all sorts of dangerous assumptions.

It’s not just dirty Asians who can catch, and die from, coronavirus.

The index patient in the Toronto outbreak did not bring pollution with her.

The median time from SARS symptoms onset to death was 33 days. This epidemic only got out of China 10 days ago. It’s much too early to say everyone will be fine.

Of course, you are more likely to die if you are old, frail or have co morbidities. So what? Just because someone is older, or has other health conditions, does not mean their life does not matter and we should just accept that they should die.

@YappityYapYap yes they are from China, otherwise healthy Chinese people, apart from the respiratory issues you seem to think all Chinese people have. You have absolutely no evidence that residents of China have less lung function that anyone in the UK or other countries. Can you not see that you are spouting an opinion that you seem to think is based on fact but it isn't? Unless you can cite some medical studies?

For those whom might be interested I've just read a Chinese blog called sixtone.com about a man ill in Wuhan. It makes interesting reading and seems to have the whiff of authenticity. I was led to this blog as I was interested in the fate of one of the doctors who had discovered this new outbreak who then subsequently became ill himself.
Im very interested in being prepared as we were living in HK during Sars with a three year old while the schools were closed and it was a very eerie experience. We didn't become frightened as we had a group of friends there and we just went to the beach every day, to avoid crowds.
Now I currently have a DH working for a mainland Chinese company and kids who go to school with lots of Asian kids.
So whilst I'm not panicking, i do want to know what's going on and not be fobbed off by any panacea ( health experts telling us the Nhs is well set up for these sort of things). When the Nhs can't even cope with the winter norm.

@teta I google the blog and it seems to have been taken down, what was the gist of it please

Does anyone have a prepping 'must' list they would kindly share?

I'm considering buying extra essentials for the cupboards next week. Family of 4 including an 8 month old. Things ideally I can put in the shed that won't get gorged on by the family of field mice we keep hosting.

It's not just Chinese people living in China though. People from all over the world live in China, all different cultures etc so you can shove your 'xenophobia' and angling that I'm being racist up your bum!

I clearly said anyone that has been living in China. Anyone! Not just Chinese people! We all breathe the same, you don't need to be Chinese to be subjected to the poor air quality in that country. It's heavily documented how bad it is and it could well mean that a lot of people living in those sorts of conditions are more susceptible to respiratory infections or seem unaware they have contracted it as they are so used to coughing up all sorts from breathing in the toxic air.

I pointed out that those healthcare workers weren't born and bred in Canada and actually from densely populated and polluted countries to make the point that they weren't always living in the fresh air of Canada to rule out the fact they were totally healthy. There is not a single article to suggest they never had an immune suppressed condition or had respiratory issues previous to catching SARS. As I said though, SARS was a stronger strain of the virus and killed much less people in Canada than it did in China and of those that died in Canada, some were frequent visitors to China and others previously lived in well known pollution riddled countries.

Let's just ignore it all though and let people that live on the other side of the world breathe in all sorts of shite and put it down to just a coincidence that it keeps killing people in the worlds most polluted and smoke filled country 🙄

I'm not saying pollution is the cause, I'm saying people in China are less prepared to deal with such a virus due to the fact they don't really get to breathe in pure air much!

See if you can get it on deeptones" the Wuhan patient alternating between ........... " I accessed it from sixtones and the article on li wenliang.

The article is about a sick man with pneumonia who hasn't been tested for this virus as there are not enough testing kits but his 3 MRI 's show his lungs becoming worse over a period of time. He hasn't been admitted to hospital but has tried to isolate himself in a hotel in Wuhan to stop his family getting sick.
When he starts feeling better and returns home his third MRI shows his lungs are getting worse. He managed to pick up some anti-viral medication from friends before the lock-down of Wuhan as doctors couldn't provide any but it hasn't helped. It's very interesting about the state of the healthcare in Wuhan.

@MynameisJune a quick Google search tells you exactly what the air quality is like in China, lots of articles on it, hundreds and actual people living there saying they struggle to breathe at times living in major cities. But yeah, there's no proof! Maybe read up on it

@YappityYapYap Yeah I'm well aware of the air quality issues China has, what I'm asking you for are medical studies that back up your claims that residents in China have poorer respiratory function than say the UK or similar? Otherwise yeah you're just spouting bullshit that you can't back up.