I have treated my pregnant wife like utter cr*p. What can I do to make it up to her?

[Badhusband]

I've been depressed for about a year and a half now and have taken it all out on my DW. She has been patient and kind to me and I have been abusive an cruel back (not physically abusive, but emotionally nasty). I told her it was all her fault that I was down, and she just took it and looked after me. I convinced her that she had issues and smashed her self-esteem, so that the focus wasn't on me. I refused to get help until one night when I finally took it too far and humiliated her in front of my friends. We managed to sort things out and she persuaded me to get counselling and start taking ADs.

Unfortunately I knew best and stopped taking them - which led to the day she had to take me to the doctors to stop me from doing something really terrible.

A couple of months after this I decided I was better (I now know that it was the ADs kicking in, but I didn't want to be the pathetic man on ADs), so stopped taking the ADs - without telling her or my GP or my counsellor. My behaviour towards her got worse. This coincided with us finding out that she is preg with dc3 (something we both wanted, although the timing was terrible). We had had miscarriages before and so the first few months were very stressful for her.

I didn't do anything to help as I was spiralling down again. In fact I shouted at her when she cried or got sad because it made me feel worse.

Then the day of her scan - when she asked me to be there for her because she was so sure the baby was dead - I went walkabout and left her to cope on her own. She even forgave me for that. But I kept on being nasty and selfish and cruel to her. And she was being there for me less and less, so I got worse and worse. Until she found out that I wasn't taking my ADs and was so upset. I told her it was none of her business - which I regret, but it was how I felt (which is ridiculous when you consider that she was the only person being really affected by my behaviour).

She was so sad. I told her I would get better and went back on ADs - but a lower dose. She said she couldn't cope with me anymore But I knew I could be her husband again if she let me.

She is so scared of losing the baby and I keep making everything about me.

She has given me so many chances and I have blown them all. I want to be better, but it's so hard to keep thinking about her needs.

She's now in her 3rd trimester. She's sad and lonely and crippled by hip problems. She says she doesn't know if she wants me to be at the birth or not, or if we can make it.

I can't help but take it personally if she is hormonal or upset. I find jobs to do around the house so I don't have to be in the same room as her.

I want to make her feel special. I've barely even treated her as a human throughout this pregnancy, let alone as the mother of my children and the goddess that she is. I promise her the world and deliver nothing.

Please, please, please can you suggest ways that I can make this up to her. How can I treat her in a way that is real and not just papering over the cracks. I want to show her that I love her. I am trying to change my behaviour, but I need to make it up to her too.

Any suggestions? Leaving the house is diffficult for her and the dcs are always here too. I need little ways to treat her everyday and big ways to show her that I'm thinking of her.

All you lovely mums out there, please help.

One of the main issues counselling has come up with is that I have no idea how to deal with anger. To the extent that I can only tell you a week after an event that it made me angry - I honestly cannot see it at the time. DW can tell I'm angry, but if she points it out to me I can't see it and react badly to her "seeing things which aren't there" - so she gets it all focused on her in other ways (neglect, snide comments, sullenness). God, I have made such a mess of this.

Sounds like your mother made you very afraid of talking back or even showing anger

there is a lot more to this than you and your wife's relationship

Counselling might help short term but you really need some therapy I think.

Good luck mate

Thanks Watusi.

Am going to get off my arse and sort out some real therapy. Thanks to everyone. This has been much more of an eye-opener than I thought it would be.

Badhusband, sometimes when people have depression they kind of hide behind it and don't deal with stuff they should deal with. Don't get me wrong - I do understand how debilitating depression is. What I mean is that some behaviours are personality related and to change behaviour you need to understand why you behave in that way and you need to want to change the behaviour. Sounds easy I know it isn't - but nothing worthwhile is ever easy. Now is the time you need to become more self-sufficient (in a healthy way, not a self-absorbed unsharing way)and utilise what help there is to help you get there. But please don't rely so heavily on your wife..........she needs time to heal, time to think of herself and the baby/kids, time to assess the relationship she has with you. If you show her you can be strong and selfless maybe she will see that you have a future together. Counselling is only as good as the counsellor, so if your sessions are not working maybe try someone else. By the way my relationship with my h suffered after several m/c. He didn't cope well at all. I'm sure this probably had a profound impact on you. Sorry but how wonderful that you have another much wanted dc on the way New life brings new hope.

oh that's so good
If you can't identify when you are angry and you feel unloveable then you need some long-term therapy to try and sort it out.

Have you also considered doing something like running? I am a recent convert and find that it really really ups my mood and makes me feel more focussed.

I'm a big believer in removing yourself from your usual surroundings, it can help both of you see your lives from a different angle.
A night in a B&B or hotel, even if it's only half an hour down the road, can really help you gain some perspective on things as well as maybe even helping you both see why you love each other so much (assuming that you do).
Also talk and listen to one another. Ask her what she wants you to do, make some kind of plan for the future, make rules if it helps u both. But what ever u do don't let her down, if you make promises then keep them.
Maybe this baby could be the fresh start u both need and help u both leave the past behind and make a happy future for all of you.
Hope u manage to work things out, things wont be magically fixed over night, it's gonna take hard work and patience from both of u.
Good luck xxx

This isn't badhusband, it's his wife. I am actually a regular MNer, judge flounce, narniagate, moldies, blah blah blah.

DH doesn't know I am posting here but he did show me the thread, and I'm not saying anything he doesn't know.

I am at my absolute wits end. This thread did help, but only as "proof" and back up for what I have already told him. He doesn't believe a word I say unless his counsellor or strangers on an internet site say the same

He did talk to his therapist about CBT and she is going to incorporate some into their sessions (although I don't think that she is a big fan). He has made no attempt to seek further help. He cancelled his doctor's appointment to discuss his medication, and hasn't made another.

I had to laugh when dittany said that talking to him was frustrating. Imagine having the same let downs and circular conversations for more than a year. If he's not currently trying to get forgiven for something then he will at best ignore me.

He can offer me no support and he asks for so much.

I am not well with SPD - pretty much housebound and miserable with it - and there is no doubt anymore that I am depressed myself. I have always had terrible PND too, so that's something else to look forward to.

I don't want him here anymore, he takes all my energy.

He tells me he loves me and that things will be a better all the time. But he never follows through. He cannot take responsibility for anything.

Funnily enough the OP asks for suggestions for a big gesture. I had been trying to organise a family holiday for when he's off in a few weeks. He rubbished every one of my ideas and suggested none. I gave up eventually. Organising the holiday would have been a nice gesture - and one asked for - but with no one to back up what I said it didn't occur to him.

So. What do you do when your dh is all words, when he promises you the world and does nothing?

I know he's ill. Were he not I would have left him a thousand times. But now he is blaming everything on the illness. Nothing is his fault because he is ill. Then who takes responsibility when he hurts me?

He is no where near the man I married. Since Christmas he has gotten nastier and yet he tells me he is getting better. He seems to see me as the enemy. I have asked him what motive I could possibly have for wanting him to stay like this, and he can't answer.

Although my BP and pg is otherwise normal, I keep finding myself unable to catch my breath (and not in a final-stages-of-preg sort of way). I get so tense and breathless that it hurts and I worry I'm hurting the baby with all this stress.

I honestly do not know what to do.

Sorry, longer than I meant it to be.

you need to let her go to counselling. She needs some support and she is not going to get it from you.

you need to take the ads and go to counselling. you are responsible for looking after yourself. She shouldn't have to look after you.

Does she have family near by that can help?
It would be good if she could have someone else around.

You need to take those ads. Depression is nothing to be ashamed of but taking no responsibility for your own health and well being is. That is the very least a person can do

Badmother's DW - I haven't posted on this thread before although I followed it. I thought your DH although making all the right noises was still a bit head-in-the-sand about what he needs to do and you have confirmed that.

I probably have nothing useful to add I'm afraid. Just wanted you to know that somebody read your post.

I would take care of myself if I were you. See a doctor about the stress and the depression YOU are feeling. See if you can get help for yourself. You never know, your self motivation might rub off on your DH, if he can see passed himself for 5 minutes (I think he can actually as he started this thread so he has no excuses).

What about going to some sort of couples counselling? I would suggest Relate but I don't know if they will be as effective given that you are both unwell at the moment. Perhaps a doctor can recommend something? I know you are finding it difficult to get out of the house. Have you got long to wait until the baby is born? He says you are in the 3rd Trimester - maybe you can plan to go as soon as the baby is born.

Badhusband - Get yourself to the doctors and get your medication sorted. That is the very best thing you can do for your DW. Her post sounds desperate. If you don't do something to help yourself she may well decide that it is every man for himself and she has to go to protect herself and your DC. You don't want that do you?

wife

Sorry have to go to physio now, will reply later.

Thanks

Badhusband. Your behaviour has been very difficult for your wife to put up with. But illness is not an automatic get out of jail free card. You need to make every effort, for the sake of your wife and children, to get better. And you aren't making every effort, as you cancelled the appointment with the doctor. Constant apologies are not the answer - as my DH said to me when I was depressed - "I don't want you to be sorry, I want you to be better". The constant need for reassurance is just feeding the depression. You need to learn to deal with these feelings in your head without roping your wife into it, rather than constantly asking for forgiveness.

Bad husband

Starlight is onto something very good here. Stop thinking about yourself for five minutes and start actually doing things. Set yourself small wife appreciation and family life targets, and build them up gradually. That might sound rather harsh, but moving on with this will also help your depression. It is time.

I heard this man interviewed on the radio when his book came out, and he emphasised the need to move away from self-pity and towards doing something positive with life. He had survived a suicide leap off a cliff.

www.guardian.co.uk/society/2008/sep/24/mental.health

Wife

You have done your part now, and you have been very strong. The ball is in his court. If he can't learn how to be a proper husband and father within a reasonable time frame, you may need to move on emotionally and ask him to move out. He has had all the advice and medical help that is required. He now needs to decide to get better and focus on playing his part properly in the family.

Right, have sorted out my namechange.

Kalo thank you, I agree, he does need to sort himself.

Niecie thanks for that reply. I do need to get some support for myself. I don't have any, which is funny when I consider all the time I have spent setting up dh's support network. I made it out last week to see a friend for the first time since before Christmas. I had a really nice time and dh had agreed to pick up the dcs so I wouldn't have to rush back. I felt like a real person again. But when I got home I found that my eldest had arrived back to nobody home to let him in. DC1 was worried and dh didn't get back for another 15mins (he finishes work much earlier). So I felt terrible.

His counsellor has insisted that he stop asking for praise for things that he should be doing anyway (so he can move out of his "child" role). But last night he had a go at me for being angry about dc1 being left alone instead of appreciating the fact that he has filled the dishwasher.

He says I always focus on the negatives. He says his behaviour is much better, I'm just seeing what I want to see.

I am now at the point where I would rather choose to be sad all the time than have him lift me momentarily and let me hope he is making the effort, before dropping me like a stone. I don't understand why he cannot choose to take control. He copes perfectly well at work. I appreciate that it would be an enormous effort on his part to concentrate on his behaviour, I wouldn't expect a change overnight. But if anything he has gotten worse in the last six months - oddly directly proportional to the promises he makes, the more he insists he will do the less he does. And I know the obvious answer is that he is ill, but at what point do you cease to be responsible for your actions?

I am very tired. He says he loves me and wants to make this relationship work, but what relationship? We don't have a relationship. I wouldn't even consider him a friend right now. He certainly can't be trusted with any of my vulnerabilities because they are invariably thrown in my face when he next does something selfish.

And the worst thing is I want to do it for him. I want to make everything better and carry the burden. I want to fix it all and take responsibility for everything. But instead I feel utterly powerless. I have provided the means for him to get better, I have been there for him through the anger and blame, I have held him all night long. I can't do the hard bit for him

So I fear it's not going to get done.

TotalChaos I'm sure I've said those words a thousand times. Along with "I don't want you to be sorry, I want you to stop doing it"

Boffinmum I know you're right. I just don't want to make that decision

Sorry for the long stream of consciousness, it's just good to get it all out.

.

I guess I'm guilty of too whiny too

Thanks for the help.

Blimey, BHW...no way are you too whiny.

It's taken me till now to read your posts. Hold on a minute while I compose a reply!

Thanks FlightA

Beginning to worry.

Okay.

I'm on the thread further down btw under a different name. I hadn't realised you had posted on it till just now.

The thing is, dear, that he isn't going to get better because you want him to - it sounds awful but by staying in the relationship and trying to support him, you're enabling the behaviour - I don't like to presume anything but possibly you had a father who wanted some 'mothering' and you feel like that's your job, as it were? I don't know - that's why I get like this with men anyway

But really someone as ill, or as unreasonable, arguably, as your DH, is not really fit to be in a relationship at all at the moment.

Until he finds a way to sort out his own issues (which sound complex) you're not going to get anything from him in return.

The best thing to do is probably separate - it doesn't have to be forever, but do it for the time being. He needs to sort himself out and being in a supportive personal relationship might not be the best thing to help him do that.

It's not your job
He is not your responsibility - where is the man who owes you some support?

I'd be far happier being alone for a while I think in your situation, than expending all this wasted energy on someone who won't help himself.

Sorry to be harsh Badhusband but it's the truth and you know that.

Badhusbandswife, we are here for you and will support you whatever you decide to do for the moment. I think you need to think about you and the child(ren) - sorry I can't remember if you already have a child.

Take care xx

Flightattendant is right, you know. You're both in a loop with this, wanting it to change but also perpetuating the pattern.

That does sound rather harsh reading it back

But when you are in what seems to be a parent-child relationship (defined by his treatment of you as a 'parent', more than your wanting to mother him) there's no easy way to make it work.

I can't tell you why it has turned into this - people do change over time - but it has by the sound of it and you have got to step back really or it's going to go wrong anyway. Having some time alone might really help.

I'm really sorry this is happening to you, especially whilst pregnant (have realised you do already have a dd ) and the stress isn't good for you - having been through two very stressful pregnancies myself, with nobbo men (no inference here) messing me around, I know how horrid that is.

thanks FlightA.

I know you're right. I've known it for a while.

It's so easy to make excuses - we can't afford it, the dcs will be sad (we have 2 already BTW) and will need to be told something, I have no family or close friends nearby and can't take dcs out of school to go where I do have support, etc, etc.

But he's not getting any better and as long as he is utterly convinced that he is then we do not stand a chance. When I first saw this thread I was so hopeful, but it was just more words

I'm very very tired of words.

It's half term next week so I can get away for a bit and try to get my head straight. Not sure where to go though, I don't want him to feel abandoned, but he's so far in denial that he can't see what he's doing anymore, so I can't stay.

This isn't going to be better before the baby's born, is it? I was so hoping it would be. There's going to be so little time to put towards fixing things afterwards.

I don't want any of this to be happening.

Darling it's not about abandoning him...seriously, if you keep putting him first it's going to destroy you all.

By all means go away at half term. Don't put obstacles in the way of your being Ok, taking the children out of one school and putting them into another would not be as bad as staying in a desperate, desperate situation which is making you really unhappy.

do you have family or support elsewhere, then? Would they welcome you and the children? If so, go to them for the holiday and talk about the situation, and tell them how very scared you are of leaving him even for a while - say you don't know where to go. See if they can help you find somewhere near them.

It might feel like you're letting him down but you're not - you've been driven to the edge and you're acting now to save what is left of the relationship and your family. I do believe the only way out of this nightmare is to separate from him, initially as a trial, but then to review it after a few weeks or months, and see whether you feel he has made enough progress to give it another try.

Please, please put your welfare and the children's first. He's not able to partake in a rational relationship at the moment. It's not your fault and probably not his eitehr but you need to get out of it. xx

Perhaps you could write her a letter? Then show real change, baby steps.

By the way I'm sorry I got the number of your children wrong - I didn't want to re read the whole thread, am rubbish at remembering things like that

Also, just to say that when I was in a relationship and pregnant by a man who was in his words depressed, and in mine abusive, I didn't want to leave - I didnt feel I was allowed. It was only when my mother saw me crying again and begged me to leave him, that I realised I had the choice iyswim - i needed her permission, as otherwise I felt it was too much of a huge responsibility on my shoulders to bring a child into the world without anyone else to help/support us.

Talk to your family or friends and I bet they will be so glad to help you.