DEC 08 - Barely into toddlerhood and already at our tit's end

[MomOrMum]

Tit's end...had to be done.

Hope this works!

bum bum I wrote a post but lost it.

Basically I said

Sorry things are so tough Daisy, I'm thinking of you loads and please always know you can vent here. It's tough for you with DH reacting like this. It probably doesn't help but men do seem to react to difficult or bereavement situations with anger. It is an emotional response that they unfortunately have grown up being allowed to use. They are sadly discouraged from venting their emotions with tears, something women can do. I have often watched parents dealing with the traumatic illness of their children on the wards. Mums will cry in response to bad news etc, and this is something that is easy for the staff to deal with, we make sympathetic noises and get them cups of tea. However, often the fathers become angry when faced with the news that their child is gravely ill, and unfortunately as this is not something the staff like to deal with they become defensive and get annoyed in response often making it all worse. I know it's hard and you shouldn't have to be treated like this but this may just be his way of expressing his complete distress and feeling that things are so out of control in view of his mums illness. (I explained that a lot better in my first post I hope you can understand that).

ZJ how was your night?

Kayz not happy!

Urbane poor you and your pooey offspring!

We had a nice weekend, a play in the snow at a local park and then we went to a snowdome near us today. Was great fun, DS1 & I went skating. We are going to book him into Ski lessons and go regularly to do snowboarding ourselves. They have a great play area that kids can play in and we can take turns watching the boys and snowboarding

hello all
sorry I've not been on for a while - been focusing on RL for a bit. Does get in the way doesn't it?!
Not fully read through so forgive me for missing things...
daisy I really feel for you, Love. You are staying so strong and just look like you're being battered and bruised from all sides. I know your DH will find this very hard, but you need to grieve too and are entitled too. How is dd? I hope she's giving you a bit of a break from her naughtiness. You know when my DH annoys me (nothing like your situation, I know) but I sometimes think I'd be better off as a single mum, then the next moment one of them is pushing me further than I can go, and I thank God that I'm not a single mum! Hope these last days with MIL are as peaceful and pain free for her as they can be. And even though your dh is shutting you out, there will be the time when he needs and wants your closeness and you will support each other again. Prayoing for you xxx
urbane how are you doing? How scary having to take dd to A+E. Is it the same hospital where she was in those early days? It must be so hard to go back with bad memories springing up. Hope the voms vanish very soon.
kayz glad your troupe are on the mend
beans and rubs I loved the boots/socks confusion. Very funny indeed
zj lol at you accidentally offering to have the extra children! hope you managed the morning ok, with however many extras...
not heard from turnip for a while have we?
Things here are going well. I've got a parent support person from L's school coming round on Wed morning to chat about her behaviour, but actually she's been a bit better over the past week (then horrid this weekend!). Then wed pm I've got the appointment with my consultant where she decides if I can continue at work. I'm actually feeling better than I was so I'm hoping she'll be able to see that. I'm guessing the increase in happy pills is probably to thank for it, but most of the time I'm alright with that. It's a bit gutting that I'm now back up to the dose I was on when I was at my worst, but I know I'm far from being as unwell as I was then, so I should just stop thinking!
I've also been trying mega hard to tackle Phoebe's sleep, so I did 3 horrendous nights of letting her cry, just giving her a pat and then leaving the room every 10 minutes, and no milk till 6am, and then last night she only woke once for a quick pat, so I have high hopes for tonight! Lu has been poorly with her chest and really nasty cough (always makes me think of you, urnbane - how is your asthma?) so she's been sleeping in our bed and I've been evicted for the past few nights . I've not taken her to the GP but when we're out and about I keep getting looks from people when she's coughing her guts up, as though I'm a terrible neglectful mother for letting my daughter have such a bad cough
anyway, must go and get sorted for the morning...
night night all xxx

• your snowy day sounds fab

Evening girls...

Very weary after weekend in deepest Cornwall. It's quite a depressed little town and as I probably mentioned we were visiting widow of DP's friend who died suddenly one year ago Her little girls are 3 and 5 and it has been very hard for them all. Between her job (as a doctor) and looking after the girls she hasn't really had the time and space to grieve that I had for my DH and I don't think she is much further on than she was a year ago. We needed to go of course but from a selfish point of view I wouldn't say it was an easy weekend However, must obviously count blessings.

Popped in to visit schoolfriend on way back, who underwent endless rounds of IVF before conceiving baby naturally, who is a month older than DD. So more blessings counting there!

To Rubes (thanks again for Friday!), Daisy and others with refusenik children, DD has pretty much only had her formula for days. I just don't know what is up. I think it is partly teeth as she keeps gnawing her fists. Stressful, isn't it?

Urbane, I am so sorry your littlies are poorly. That is very rough. Hope there has been some improvement.

Trace, I am so pleased to hear you sounding more chipper. That is topping. Sorry about Lu's cough though.

Aubi, I am with you on the insomnia. I haven't had a good night's sleep since Tuesday and I know many people are getting broken nights for one thing and another and I don't want to go on, but I am really v tired. The thing I hate most though is the way my mind whirrs in the night over every little bad bit in my life and then blows them up all out of proportion, until I get myself into the state of mind whereby my life seems like the Slough of Despond. I presume I am not alone with this (it is pretty much always totally fine the next day)...

ZJ, you were brave with the babysitting! What happened in the end?

Veg, I'm glad you had a good time in the snow/snowdome. I must say I am not a snow fan myself, but skiing is a good skill, I say.

Daisy, I have saved you till last. I am not surprised your DH is angry but putting himself at risk by still being over the limit when he drove is very difficult Poor him and poor you. I hope and pray that your MIL is painfree and gets the best care. I guess you will just have to let your DH be angry as it is an essential and inescapable part of grieving (obviously that is what he is doing even though she is still here) but it is very, very hard on you. I wish I could think of something profound and helpful to say to you, but I can't - I know all our loved ones are only 'lent' to us - we can't keep everyone forever, much as we utterly long to - but eventually it is easier to simply be grateful for the time we had them, rather than rage against the unfairness of them not being physically with us.

But I wouldn't say I'd got it nailed myself. I've worked really hard at being thankful that DH was in my life at all but (for instance) on Saturday night I dreamed that he suddenly came back and all I needed to do was ring him, but I couldn't remember the number. It sounds stupid but it was awful, the grief was overwhelming.

Anyway, on that rather sober note, for those of you still listening as I have rambled a bit, amazingly I turned out to be pregnant after all It's been a challenging few days as the timing of it all is abysmal, but what can I say but que sera, sera...I am sure it will turn out to be a blessing in time and IMPLORE you all to keep it under your hats and not allude to it on FB as I am only 5 weeks and I am not planning to tell the wider world for AGES. Weeks. Aubi, this means I will be 22 weeks at D's wedding and won't look like a fox at all, but a blimp. Sigh....

Oh my dear LadyT, many congratulations and warm thoughts your way! I know that this is earlier than you had planned but your 2 children will grow up being great pals for each other and wonderful company. I remember feeling with DD2 and DS shortly after the deed had been done that something was afoot. Funny how your body lets you into these secrets. I'm not on FB so your secret is safe with me. Sorry about your trying weekend and sorry too about your disturbed nights and difficult dreams. It is hard making sense of it all sometimes. I know the sense of panic one feels when you can#t do something in a dream and the relief mixed with sadness when you wake. Take it easy my lovely.

Daisy, am thinking of you and your DH. I hope the next few days are peaceful for you all.

Trace, I am glad you are feeling more chipper. Let us know how the consultant meeting goes.

Need to find some clothes for tomorrow. M is now walking well and supremely pleased with himself for it. Constant red cheeks and lumpy gums though, and frequently turns down food, which is most out of character. They're funny buggers, these babies, aren't they?

Night night all.

Thanks Syb, I am still getting used to the idea and it is a little hard, and I must be honest (I found out on Tuesday night) that it has taken me until this weekend to stop feeling furious with DP and I am generally rather apprehensive about it all...but this new one must be and will be much loved and I guess that's all there is to it...

Next time I talk about silly forms of 'contraception' such as the withdrawal method and Persona (actually I had the Clearblue version and it only ever had me on 'low fertility', ha ha, which is obviously hollyhocks), please, girls, hit me over the head WITH A VERY BIG SAUCEPAN. Because I do only want two children, fabulous as kids are.

I don't feel sick but I feel tired and unusually very irritable.

Time for bed...

Don't worry darling, we'll get you coiled up after this one. Or get MrT (as 'twere) to have the snip. I think unplanned pgs are always a bit of a curve ball. It took me a LONG time to get my head around Matthew, as I just was not ready for, nor sure that I even wanted, a third baby. He is of course my joy now and the best thing that could have happened. But I am with you on the shock.

I'll start knitting. Are you going to find out the sex (thinks of patterns wistfully)?

The coil makes me nervous. But then, not so nervous as the thought of a DC3. Mr/Lord/G/T (actually Mr G&T would be quite a good name for him) would no sooner have the snip than an arm voluntarily severed.

I hope to find out the sex, yep. I don't like surprises. It will drive me nuts if I don't know...and anyway I think it might help me 'imagine' it if you know what I mean...

I don't intend to resign from the Fatties thread though as I am still intending to watch my weight and do as much exercise as I can physically muster.

Morning,

LadyT Congratulations!! I know it isn't the best time for you but soon enough you wouldn't want it any other way. If you keep eating healthily sickness permitting then I'm sure you won't look like a blimp at all.

Trace Lovely to hear from you. You sound much much happier. I really hope that you can keep working.

Daisy Thinking of you and your family. Hope your MIL is as pain free as possible.

DS1 has reverted to being feeble and ill. He was fine yesterday morning and once we got to mums he was lounging around crying and complaining. He did sleep on her sofa for about 3 hours and missed dinner so he must have been really tired.

Hope everyone is ok.

Morning ladies. Lady I actual started writing a post to you last night but I didn't send it because I was saying how happy I was for you but I kind of felt like that isn't what you wanted to hear then. I've had a feeling ever since you said the deed had been done that you were, you just seemed so sure of it. I'm sorry the conception didn't go the way you may have wanted but, well you know it all really, you've been going through all your feeling already. Be gentle with SirG&T, I bet he's chuffed to bits but feeling all crap at the moment. As far the timing for work etc, well if I'd had the boys closer together I'd be almost fully back at work now (if I lived in a country where I spoke the local language) rather than still on my extended Maternity leave. In a way your current work situation quite suits getting up the duff again as once this one is out of the way (sorry not a nice way to put it) you can get on with the next chapter in your career without having to figure in a pregnancy.

I leave you alone now, but I am quite excited by your news, congratulations.

Hellooo Sybsy you so make me want another.

Kayz we have the sickies here too, I've got yet another sore throat and DS2 is recovering, so I'm going to have TV day today, I try not to watch daytime TV because I'm worried I'll not stop but today I'm allowed.

DS1 broke my heart this morning. We cycled to school in the snow which he was fine with (all cosy in the trailer) but when I dropped him off he cried his heart out. I still feel like I'm abandoning him poor little man. He is slowly picking up the language but I find it hard going into shops not speaking Dutch, it must be so scary for him. I'm trying to think up a nice treat for him for being so brave.

Aargh! I wrote out a long message but the computer ate it! Will try and re-do.

LadyT: congratulations! You are a wonderful mum to DD and will be equally fantastic with DC2. Though I can understand the mixed feelings, esp as the responsibilty on this one was rather taken out of your hands. I certainly had an 'oh shit, I AM pregnant' moment with both DSs and they were planned. Anyway, good things are a) you get another gorgeous baby, b) you don't have a commute this time and c) pregnant women never look like blimps, only radiant

Trace: lovely to hear from you and good luck for today. You sound much better and more in control despite L's shenanigans! I sympathose on the hacking cough, mine sound like they are in the final stages of consumption as soon as they have a mild cold. Sounds far worse than it is.

Daisy: thinking of you and your family. Must be hard supporting DH when he's angry and lashing out. Wise words from Veggie.

Much news from you all over the weekend: snow and skating and twins and teeth (DS2 off his grub as well). NO news at our end other than the fact that we were having a quiet weekend until DH decided to move all the furniture. The hous edoes look a lot better now, but still piles of stuff to put away!

x-posted with Veggie: poor DS. Ultimatley it will be a positive experience for him, learning a new language and experiencing a different culture, but it's still such early days. DS1 is still a bit upset when he's dropped off at nursery and he loves going - he just doesn't like leaving me or DH.

Urbane: sorry to hear your DS is ill as well, are you feeling any better? We watched an awful lot of Chigley over the weekend as the boys weren't up to par (not exactly ill but grumpy and vaguely unwell) and DS2 loved it. Especially the train song. As I've said before, am a big fan of vintage children's tv when they ill. (you can get Chigely on iTunes, along with Camberwick Green and Trunpton).

Lady, sounds like you need a lot of rest. Burning the candle at both ends and all that! Glad you are starting to feel better about things. I'm with you on the firmly stopping at two thing - I was (not sure why) but perusing the Club Med website last night (as they have their kids /baby clubs all included) and my good friend swears by them with her two, and it all seems so much cheaper easier when it's a family of four! (However that said, I bet having 3 is also fantastic and has its wonderful points that I no doubt will never experience) Anyway, Club Med have a new "Luxury collection" now - one day... one day.. has anyone used them?
Trace glad things are looking up and good to see you areound more!
Sybil, that explains why my "friend request" on face Book hasn't been accepted by yourself not sure who the heck I added then

Urbane hope the house gets well soon - I'm feeling much better here - and fingers crossed ds doesn't seem to have picked it up so far

Aubi - yes I have insomnia here too but I think preg related.... can only sleep on my side, I hate my pillow and I get restless legs syndrome all the time not to mention the peeing every hour factor!!

Veggie, your weekend sounded nice... it amazes me how you always manage these fun weekends with the family... I need some help from you in that area! However I suppose as soon as ds gets a little older to appreciate things and wants to do more things, I imagine it gets easier to plan stuff to do? Not to mention when i'm not pregnant it will be easier to get enthusiasm I suppose!

DH goes in for his nose op tomorrow he's in overnight so must look up all the visiting hours rules etc. he's going in near our old house as it was during the time of moving, but I don't think anyone is around that area are they as I might have all day to kill - oh I'll probably just go home I think or go see a friend in Croydon if they schedule his surgery early. it's quite funny as he's strangely worried about it and finally admitted it's that he doesn't like being "out of control"

Anyway, must get some brekky sorted

Hi all, back from ski holiday which as great fun,4 kids under 2 all wreaking absolute havoc and snow up to dd's chin!

about to tackle Laundry Mountain but just had to pop on and see how things were with you all, LadyT congatulations! how very exciting, there will be a little gaggle of december little brothers and sisters

Veggie - cross posted. Sorry ds1 is so sad. If you give me a list I would happily love to put together a little pack of ds's favourite goodies from the UK if you'll let me? Just need your address etc which you could FB to me? it would be no trouble and I'd love to - he's such a lovely little boy and really is coping well - as are you all

Hello JJ glad you had fun!!!

Veggie I second Rubes, I'll send him some stuff over too if you want.

I'd love to send a parcel too - maybe we could stagger it so he gets something every week for a bit? Am rarely on FB (can't access from work, too busy at home) but you could maybe email me?

speaking of FB, my near-nonogenarian grandfatehr has added me as a friend - I guess I have to accept?

Hilarious Effie!! It seems all the olds are getting into the FB-ing - my Mum and some of dh's older fam have added me too

Yes, count me in for the cheer up parcels to AK. He has been super brave.

Thanks for all your kind wishes, it does help! There will be 22 months between them. Anyone else with this age gap?

Welcome back, JJ! Summer was on holiday recently as well, hence her absence (Effie, you were asking where the Cambridge kids had gone).

I am worrying as obviously wasn't taking folic acid before conception or indeed until I found out I was pregnant and I am now five weeks. Well, there's not much I can do about it now, just have to hope for the best.

DD has a cough and conjunctivitis this morn but she is very cheery. I think she is just glad to be home.

Oh My Gosh LadyT! Doesn't MrT have some super sperm and aren't your eggs welcoming. Congratulations my dear. I really hope the shock wears off soon and is replaced by excitment. It must be hard when such a momentus decision is taken out of your hands and I do feel for you. However, if you focus on the positives it might help. As Veggie says the disruption to your career will be concentrated and over in one short sharp burst. Also the DCs will be close in age which, while intense at first, means they'll amuse each other from early on. My DDs roar with laughter at each other and it's a joy to see. Finally in seven and a half months you can lose weight KNOWING it will be permanent and not have to worry about another pregnancy. Hugs to you as you come to terms with it all.

I also wanted to say that your description of your dream about trying to phone your late DH really resonated with me. I have a recurring dream about my Mum where I realise she never actually died and I just forgot to call her for five years. I then feel an enormous wave of joy, followed by guilt and then panic as I rush to get in touch. But everytime I do call I realise I missed the healthy years and she is very ill and about to leave me again. I then watch her die while kicking myself for having not been there for her recently. I used to dream that weekly, now it's rarer but I know the pain such dreams can bring back.

Trace - so lovely to hear from you. I was beginning to fret that things weren't good and that's why you weren't around. So lovely to hear you feeling brighter. Good luck with the psych this week.

Veggie - I do feel for you when you refer to your broody moments and your DHs certainty that he wants no more. Does he say why? He sounds like such a lovely dad and you are such an intuitive mum - I could imagine you cheerrfully coping with 19 (as one American family I saw on TV are!).

JJ - glad you had lovely hols. Nice to have you back.

Daisy - thinking of you this week. I hope it's all as peaceful as possible.

LadyT I have 21 months between the boys. I think that it is quite a good age gap. They play together all the time. In fact they are having a crawling race around the front room right now. DS2 is squealing with laughter.

I am still awfully broody, I am so desperate to start trying now but I am going to be patient. Somehow.

Hello girls, just to say I am here, as LadyT says I have been on hols and then we have had intermittent internet problems, plus been busy, in addition to my "don't post at work rule" (breaking now) not had chance to be on!

I have lots to tell you all so will try and get on tonight!

But should say daisy sorry to hear about your DH's anger, I am thinking of you all lots, sorry you are all having such a hard time at the moment.

LadyT congratulations!! How exciting, sorry not very good at responding with anything other than excitement! And like you say everything happens for a reason, like others have said you will get the career disruption and putting on weight stuff out of the way all in one go which is a positive way of looking at things.

jj glad your holiday was good! Our snowy holiday was also great. But more on that when I get chance to do a big catch up.

Also on the eating, LadyT it is reassuring to hear there are other fussy ones around. DSes eating and sleeping got so bad we got the health visitor round. She was very helpful, fortunately his sleep has improved (for now) and the eating doesn't seem such a worry when I have had some sleep! He drives me up the wall with it but I am not actually worried about his health as he seems fine, and I figure I just have to be patient.

Anyway I must go back to work, but must try and catch up properly soon!

Very quick one, as I am justifying a post in the tail end of my lunch break.

daisy - not much to add, other than to say so sorry.

LadyT - I know you are ambivalent, about the timing at least, but really, can't help but be pleased for you. My two are 19.5 months apart and its lovely - they care for each other, but I think will play with each other two, which I think can be harder with a bigger age gap. I guess my view was coloured by my own experience growing up - I am 23 months older than my brother (but he is only 1 school year behind me), who is 21 months older than my sister and we grew up as the "3 musketeers". I know that's not the same for everyone, but it is something I treasure. I would second what the others have said about career disruption as well - as you'll know, I've had to firefight a bit since I got back to work, but can only think it would be much worse if I were coming back and then planning to take another maternity leave in a couple of years. I know that (potential) employers can't ask, but its been useful for me to be able to draw a line under the whole "family" issue.

trace - thinking of you - hope the meeting goes well and you are confirmed fit to work

JJ - very brave - I chickened out of a skiing holiday, although our recent US trip for my brother's wedding was very near skiing territory. Glad that it sounds like you had a great time.