March 09 - there is no snooze button on a baby that needs milk.....!

[meep]

over here ladies

MissM - I don't sterilise bowls/spoons for food. The way I look at it is that I don't sterilise her toys and she's picking all sorts up and stuffing it in her mouth so not much point(although I did try it once with dd1 when a friend's baby with a cold slobbered and snotted all over my PFB toys so bunged them in the microwavey sterlisier to find them a melted mess....). Am fairly sure I didn't with dd1 either - think I started doing it and then realised it was far too much faff.

On the sterilising front - does anyone know if the 'rules' for sterilising bottles changes at 6 months or if you need to do it for a year ? I thought it was 6 months although I did do the year with dd1 as I was so used to it by then I just got on with it. I currently use a single bottle steriliser but by 6 months (or just after) L will be on lots more bottles so wondered if I could dispense with sterilising rather than break open the big steriliser (and flog on ebay). I do dishwasher them....

And as for putting more than 1 to be on own, I now put L to bed first as she gets to melt down point earlier than dd2. DD2 is 4.6 though so easy to leave in front of tv entertaining herself whilst I do it.

NOt too much aching here this morning thankfully. I can feel I did something but really isn't sore. Hurrah !

Morning. Yip, me again. Where IS everyone??

Wheely I don't sterilise beyond 6 months. With DD1 I did for longer but then found out after, I didn't have to and with DD2 it was 6 months and she was fine. So I plan to do the same this time round - but at least we have a dishwasher this time so that helps.

I hate to break it to you tho - tomorrow might have to be the day you watch out for! You might feel stiffer then. And if not then you are much fitter than you thought!

I'm here!

just feeding A and waiting for the hv to come and do the weaning visit. she should be here any minute.

oooooooooh!

A just looked up from feeding and she has her second tooth!!

oh! two teeth already! How wonderful. I think it won't be long til HHB's breaks through. I can see it ready to burst. It'll be the last gummy smile for me! (Until I'm maybe a grandma!)

wheely my bottle routine (with huge disclaimer that it doesn't follow the current guidelines) is to make up 2 bottles once Rosie is in bed. Freshly boiled water - formula in - then sit them in cold water until luke warm (about 10mins) and then into the fridge. These are for her 11.30pm feed and her morning feed.

When she has her morning nap I make up 3 more bottles for the rest of the day.

If I'm going out - you can keep a bottle in a cool bag with an ice pack for up to 4 hours. If any longer than that I take a sterilised bottle and a carton.

The reason I do it this way is that I want any bugs lurking in the formula powder killed off by the hot water! With dd1 I would to make up 6 bottles each night for the night feed and ALL the next days feeds - but am more cautious now.

You can sterilise a bottle and leave it in the steriliser unopended and it will stay sterile for ages (my one says about 6 hours) - so you could have a bottle ready sterilised - make up a fresh feed - then cool it under the tap (only takes about 3-5mins)?

HTH?

grinning - U2 were awsome last night - I wasn't that excited about going being full of the cold and because I thought their last tour was rubbish - but this one was great - lots of old stuff and not too much political preaching from Bono (who was looking rather hot I must say !).

Miss no sterilising of bowls & spoons here once 6mo (like slick I only found that out after I'd been faffing around sterilising everything for dd1 - I took her to settle into nursery and was horrified when they didn't sterilise her spoon - reported this to friends who set me right !).

I am still holding off till 6mo for weaning - am a bit of a preacher about not doing early weaning unless your baby is really chowing through full bottles of milk and still needing more (like FB!). The thing is that they will still get more calories from milk than from solids in the early stages of weaning. "Food is fun until they are one" is what I go by (though when they hit toddler food defiance stage a la dd1, food no longer becomes fun - grrrrr!).

Impressed with the running wheely - there is a podcast that trains you from scratch and eases you in gently that I am thinking of starting up - just need to stop putting it off.....

slick - good news about your friend - not nice to go through though.

jolly what a difficult thing to have to think about. Going back to work after maternity leave is hard enough.

And 2 teeth grinning - wow! I do get a bit sad when their teeth come in as I so love little gummy baby smiles.

Need to go - little croaky meeps are coming over the monitor - so it muct be feeding time!

meep you could have said U2 were rubbish!! Seriously though, I'm glad you enjoyed it. I sooooo wish I was going tomorrow. Waaaaaaaaah

Lovely hv been and gone. She last saw A when she was 3 weeks old, so noticed a bit of a difference! She also weighed her, and she's put on just over 1lb in 3 weeks. She's 14lb 13oz now. She is going to check for me whether A's fingers and thumbs might be a problem - she can bend her thumbs back to her wrists (yuck!!) and her fingers are bendy in the wrong direction too. Mind you, dh is double jointed.

The weaning talk (no leaflets) was what I'd hoped for to be honest. A is 19 and a bit weeks, and she just said to keep feeding her myself for the next few weeks, and if I want to I can give her big bits of food to hold/lick and then start giving her mushed up food (rice pudding consistency) when she seems ready.

A was quiet as a mouse for the almost hour chat (why doesn't she do that when I'm watching BB!) and has conked out on the sofa now after another feed. Bless!

Right. Must go. I'm feeling a bit lightheaded as no breakfast yet! Need to get some weetabix in me

Hi all - good to catch up on everyone's news. I can't believe A has her second tooth already Grinning - how old is she? Penelope doesn't look like she's anywhere near getting teeth (22 weeks on Sunday).

So I finally won the bottle battle and Pen now takes an 11am bottle happily. It made me feel a bit sad to see her take it from a bottle and not from me, but she starts at childminder in a month's time, so I wanted to start to prepare my boobs for the change! 3pm boob feed will be the next one to go.

I haven't bothered sterilising anything - like many others on here, I figure that Pen is shoving all sorts of rubbish in her mouth (carpet / toys / other peoples fingers a lot of the time!) and none of that has been sterilised. They also don't sterilise in lots of other places (the US being a prime example) and so DH and I decided not to bother - too many other things to think about with a little one! I also saw this a while back which made the final decision for me:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk?topicid=breast_and_bottle_feeding&threadid=91585-imho-and-the-opini on-of-microbiologists-there-is-no-need

Anyway, on another note, does anyone know if swapping from breast milk to formula can give a baby a saw bum? Pen has never had any problems with her bum (no nappy rash; never used sudocrem etc) but as of last week when we introduced formula at the 11am feed, she suddenly got a red, angry bum which looks a bit saw in the middle. Her formula poos appear to be green and cheesy-string in consistency as well - could this different kind of poo be causing the rash? Or just a coincidence?

Pen waking up all hours of the night again. Argh. How many growth spurts can a baby have? Anyone done any sleep training with their LO yet? Or are they all too little still?

xx

sore, not saw

Formula poos are definitely different to bf poos. Rosie's went quite thick and grainy to start with - the only way I can describe it now is like pale green foundation!!!

It could be what has started the nappy rash -do you use a barrier cream or have you not needed to yet?

Metanium cream is an absoute godsend for nappy rash (horrid yellow paste!) - and will normally sort it out overnight. We use Bepanthen as a daily cream as dd1 is prone to bad nappy rash. Much cheaper though is "Castor oil & zinc" Boots nappy cream (big purple tub) - which does much the same thing.

Never used anything Meep, what's a barrier cream? Will get some of the Metanium if it doesn't get better by tomorrow.

Oh, just a quickie, as I thought of it earlier when reading everyone's posts. How often have you all seen HVs? I had a home birth so I had the MW come and visit me twice at home and then I saw her twice at the surgery (so 4 times total in 10 days after which I was "signed off") and an HV came to see me once at home for half an hour about 2 weeks after my last MW appointment (so Pen would have been about 4 weeks old). I haven't seen or spoken to an HV since. Is that right? I've taken Pen about 3 times to get weighed in the last 4 months, but never seen an HV as they always seem so busy and I haven't really had any probs with Penny... are they supposed to still see me at home some times? What is everyone discussing with their HV?

Barrier cream is basically nappy cream that you put on at every nappy change - keeps the wee and poo. Forms a barrier between their skin and the wee/poo and helps prevent nappy rash starting. There are load of creams out there to choose from - but it is pretty much an essential pice of baby kit as they get older and their poo gets more toxic !

We use a barrier at every change - and use metanium (also acts as a barrier but very healing - only use a think layer though) if there is any sign of trouble.

Also watch out for thrush - can show up as angry red spots of white spots - if you suspect there is any use something like Cannestan.

Best thing for nappy rash is lots of time with the nappy off - can get messy but it works.

Rosie had horrid nappy rash when she was little and we've used a barrier cream ever since.

I last saw my HV when Rosie was 16wo - and that was my last set contact with her. I can ophone if I need help - or go to the clinic - but no more formal meetings.

It is totally up to you if you need/want to see your HV - but if you are getting all your info from friends/MN you should be fine - and some HV's are pretty useless anyway (IMO!). I think it very much depends on teh area you live in /funding available as to how often your HV sees you.

Hmmmmm. Boobz Read that link and some of the arguments are compelling but I think some of the thoughts about the fact that they put all sorts in their mouth, is not the same as the fact that milk is the breeding ground for listeria and therefore that's the main concern. But having said that, I do think there are so many muppets out there who are probably really really lax when it comes to cleaning bottles etc that in that instance sterilising is no bad thing! I will still seterilise til 6 months. I've not found it too much of a bother this time as we used the milton tablets as apposed to boiling which was an expensive and condensation-producing pain in the arse.

I think sometimes we can be over-cautious, for eg what Meep was saying about making milk up - with our first, we used to make them up in batches, use within 24 hours and re-heat! Now that's all fround upon and it's bloody annoying because you think, oh what if I do that, maybe I'm taking an unnessary risk. But I get pissed off with it as in the beginning with HHB we wasted SO much unused milk and it did start to feel like a conspiracy by the Baby milk companies!!!

Anyway, roll on next month!

Boobz we've not seen the HV since Mae was little, I think she came twice early on possibly the last time was at about 6 weeks becos Mae had been below her weight line thing.

Have been getting her weighed every now and then, she weighed 15lb when she was 23 wks old but this was the first time we'd had her weighed since she was 16wks. No sign of the HV. Although the childrens centre is at the bottom of my road and there is nearly always something on their with some professional of other so I probably could go and chat to someone if I wanted.

My work colleague who is also on maternity went on a weaning course at her local centre.

I'm a bit hit and miss with the sterilising, we sterilise the bottles because we only have a couple and so it is easier to wash them by hand and microwave them but all the little weaning bowls and spoons go in the dishwasher because we have more of them and we can wait to we are ready to put the dishwasher on, rather than having to run it half full. But as we have a cat and Mae shoves literally everything and anything in her mouth sterilising seems comletely pointless really I think she'd have put the cats tail in her mouth in the cat didn't squeal when she realised the baby had hold of it!

I can't believe all this talk of teeth, still no signs here except all the slobbering and sticking of fingers in the mouth, but no actual teeth or white lines.

talking of teeth - I had a filling done at 10.30am and I still can't feel the right side of my mouth - ugh!

I'm also a steriliser - don't find it a faff - just pop them in the microwave for the allotted time and hey presto I feel like I have done good ! We also have these which means you can quickly do one bottle at a time and are great for travel.

slick we don't reheat bottles - Rosie takes it straight from the fridge (I did heed your warnings of later problems with hot food!) so we're eliminating one potentially harmful element of making up bottles in advance.

It is all a minefield. You just have to read all the guidelines that are out there then do what you feel comfortable with.

Totally agree Meep and at the end of the day, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. I mean, now they're saying a ham piece could lead to cancer. Oh FFS!

I am curious about the bugs in the FF powder theory tho (and therefore the need to make sure it's hot enough to start with to kill them - fWiW we do start with the water hot enough (I think!) in the flask) - but how are there bacteria in a powder. It looks so inert when you peer into the tub!

I think the water should be no cooler than 30mins after the kettle has boiled. No diea at what bugs could be lurking - but I suppose poder isn't sterile - you are opening and closing it all the time -...... who knows!

On a different note - Rosie has reached the "tummy crunches" stage - if she's lying slightly propped up by a cushion she'll lift her head and neck off the ground as if she's doing a tummy crunch. Babies must have great abs!

I think that thread goes into the argument about Listeria bugs as well and debunks it, Slick, but you probably have to get to page 9 of the thread I think! DH is a microbiologist by training and so he knew he was never going to sterilise anyway and just had to convince me (as nothing's properly sterile for long after it comes out of the machine - and that a good clean with hot soapy water or a clean through the dish wash amounts to the same as a few mins in a steriliser in terms of cleaning bugs) but I didn't need much convincing after I'd done some research myself. At the end of the day we all do what we're comfortable with... and like some people say - it's actually quicker to use the steriliser than the dish washer in come housholds if you don't do a load every day.

Right, off out to see some Mums for a coffee - back laters xxx

See I do my bottles the way i always have.

I make up 5 at a time. Sterlise make up to 7oz's once cool put in the fridge untill needed.

Heat in microwave for 45 sec's add powder then shake to mix and get rid of hotspots. None of mine would take cold either from the fridge or room temp.

We've not seen the HV since she came for the 1st check and to give the red book. So now we only see them when i take Robbie to be weighed.

Robbie doing his stomach crunches to.

As to weaning i had hoped to wait untill he was 6 mths (21st sept) but this week he been having 2 7oz bottles between 6 and 9 am So i think i may have to introduce some baby rice at 8am.

still only on 6oz bottles here (and those are not always finished!), so we're a long way off weaning.

Mind you I do pretend to feed Rosie dd1's food if she is refusing to eat (results in shouts of "no, mine, my food, not Roshies food") - maybe Rosie will surprise me one day and bite it off the fork!

Sorry to have started another 'making up formula' debate. With dd1 I used to make up bottles of cooled boiled water and just add powder when she wanted a feed. Easy Peasy. As I said earlier my friend's twins were in SCBU and they effectively did this (this was feb/march this year) - certainly did not add to near boiling water. BUt I am doing the 'right way' at the moment but do take cartons out with me and a 'sterilised bottle' (although isn't sterilised probably by the time the milk is added).

Does anyone know if the only reason for not adding powder to boiling water is just so you don't scald yourself and sue the formula companies or is there a reason for it ? Because its the 15-30 mins wait once the water has been boiled that is the problem not the sterilising as my steriliser takes 3 mins and I tend to do that a bit in advance. If I could add boiling water, then straightaway the powder and then cool that would be easier. I suspect its only that the formula company/ DoH just don't want ot be sued .

oops posted before finishing

Meep - its 'couch to 5K' the podcast. I did it last january (08 !) and by the time I got pregnant I was running 10K regularly and even got a bit beyond that. I've taken up the podcasts again this time. They really are fantastic. I am evangalistic about them - lots of people have started running after me raving about them. Even my 65 year old mum (sort of - she is doing the early ones round her garden because she's too embarrassed to go out !).

Haven't had L weighed for weeks. It was at least 5 weeks ago, if not more. Seems a faff with dd1 home. Probably wait till she starts school (sob) and then go then.

For a little one she sounds a bit of a piggy. She downs two 7 oz bottles a day, at least 4 breast feeds on top of that and 2 lots of solids. Maybe she's a) not taking muhc in the breastfeeds or b) got dh's metabolism after all and I will have 2 skinny daughters laughing at their dumpy mother .

Oh and on HV visits - I saw her a couple of times when L was first born because she took a while to regain birth weight. Then she had an 8 week check then that's it. By chance I might see one at a weigh in but mostly they are done by the nursery nurses not the HV.

I assume we'll get an 8 month check unless they've phased those out too.

We can make an appointment to see on every wednesday but I don't think there's a great deal of point.

Why do you have to wait until the water has cooled? I don't - I just add the formula to the boiling water, stir, and then put under a cold tap to cool down to a temp that Pen will drink.

That's what I wonder Boobz - if you read the formula packet or DoH guidelines they say you should wait until it cools for 15-30 mins (depending which one you read) but I cant' really see why - surely the hotter it is the more likely it is to kill the bacteria anyway.

As I said, I strongly suspect its to stop people scalding themselves.

have just added a new piccie of L too.