March 09 - there is no snooze button on a baby that needs milk.....!

[meep]

over here ladies

Hi all!

loli I hope all is going well, I was monitored loads with Gabriel as DS1 was prem, and it is stressful but worth it for the babes.

News from the almost-6 months end of things: I don't what is going on with Gabriel but he's been really unpredictable! Thurs night he slept all through the night from 4pm, last night (when of course I'd got a friend to babysit so DH and I could go out) he didn't go down til 9.30 so I was stuck home. He's been really whiny and screamy today, but doesn't seem to have a temperature or any other signs of distress.

We're still having a stress with passports, the friend I got to countersign did it wrong (having left off sending it for 2.5 weeks), so I got a letter yesterday saying we had to submit a new application and we're flying in 19 days! We can't use the priority or in person routes with a first child passport so it's all up in the air if it will arrive in time.

Hi All

Am back from hols . Had a lovely time - really nice to get away although L slept worse than ever for most of it. Started to settle down (to waking twice !) and then it was time to come home.

However, we did start to make big changes whilst away - we started weaning her onto solids. Now two weeks in and going well I think. I have also introduced another bottle so she is on two bottles a day - mid morning and mid afternoon. Have just read week 3 in Annabel Carmel and I should be dropping lunch time milk feed this week but according to Lorraine Kelly (a strangely good weaning book in case you wondered) says not so I don't think I will as I don't think my boobs will cope with cutting down to twice a day (plus night) just yet.

She also slept out of our bedroom when we were away as the cot didn't fit in our room and so she shared with dd1. So, when we got back last night we decided to go for it and move her into her bedroom and big cot (and its a cotbed so is ginormous). She slept no worse than usual but I think the amount of space might cause issues as she's so wriggly. I found her firmly wedged across it at 6 this morning . She had her first swim in a pool too and seemed to like it (and not just drinking the pool water either...ewwwww...).

DD1 decided to swim too. I would say 'learnt to swim' but in dd1's true fashion I think she'd have been able to do it for a while but only does things when she wants to. She made friends with a 5 year old on hols who was just learning and so she wanted to be like her so went for it. By the end of the hol she was swimming 10 metres and diving for things.

Hope all are well - will go back and catch up on all the going-ons.

Rhys is napping with DP, so I?ve got time for a massive catch-up post. You have been warned!

Wheely ? so glad you had lovely hols. Well done on all the changes for L, too - that's massive!

Laumiere ? eeeek on the passport. Bloody bureaucrats. Fingers crossed it will arrive in time. Hope Gabe is feeling less out of sorts today.

Slick ? I thought I was going to be sick reading about the poo extravaganza! Am hoping R never twigs to the fact he can explore his nether regions! Loving HHB in his high chair.

Slick and meep, thanks for the info on teething powders. I continue to be amazed at what you can get in the UK! No such stuff here, thanks very much. Have been using the Calgel without much difficulty (R actually tends to open his mouth when he sees my finger coming) but DP will be in London on business Tuesday so I might have him pick some powders up just in case.

Loli ? good luck with getting J onto formula. Sounds like anything you can do to give yourself a break is a good thing ? it took R a few days to begin accepting his formula, but it?s going better now. Maybe try a different brand? And I did find with R that I need to heat the formula to a temp actually higher than I would EBM before he?s satisfied. Take care of yourself.

Gorgeous, gorgeous girls you?ve got, meep, megzy, kanga, boobz -- in case they?re looking for a younger man, I?ve put two new pics of Rhys up in my profile. Handsome devil!

Add me to the list of mums impressed with mama kanga, please!

On the feeding front, we don?t have all the fab formulas you?ve got in the UK, but we?ve been persevering with the original (Nutrilon) and it?s going much better ? he?ll down 100 to 135 mls at a time now, so we just need to start offering it for more feeds. But now I have boobs like unripe cantaloupes. Owie.

Boobz ? well done on the Bottle Battle victory! In response to your suggestion, I?m never the one to give him his formula ? that falls to DP or my mum. I hand him over and skulk off to the far end of the flat so as to be out of sight and smell. And how FABULOUS that you?ve found such perfect childminders ? that must be a huge worry taken care of.

Question: I've noticed in past couple of days that R?s pee STINKS, especially early in the morning. I don?t know if this is the formula influence, but it?s sort of a cross between ?after eating asparagus? and ?dirty stables.? Has anyone had this happen with their LO? The number of wet nappies hasn?t changed, and he?s drinking lots so don?t think he?s dehydrated?

After a solid week of hell (R waking hourly), we ran for the hills last night ? left him with my folks and a ton of EBM and checked into a hotel down the street. Of course, it took me ages to fall asleep, and I was still up early, but the BLISS ? the sheer, unmitigated BLISS ? of 7 uninterrupted hours of sleep! Did us a world of good.

My parents, however, did not sleep at all. This had less to do with R (who had a decent night, for him) but with them ? they were up and down like jack-in-the-boxes checking to be sure he was still breathing.

Think the time has come to start cracking down on his night wakings, though. I think he?s taking the piss, quite frankly, and as I?m back to work in two weeks (weep), we need some changes. Going to order Richard Ferber?s book from Amazon ? anyone used his methods?

Oops, hearing some cries of hunger. Happy Sunday, everyone --

Corgi glad Rhys is learning to accept the bottle. I do wonder if the BF babies have smaller tummies becos Mae will only drink at most 150mls at once EBM and formula and this seems so much less than the formula fed babies I know. And Rhys looks very handsome.

We have now managed to drop the 10am bf and replace it with cereal and formula so I am now looking to get rid of the 4pm feed next week and the 1pm feed the week after. As I am also back to work in Sept fortunately not till 7th and I am only working till lunch. But still really scared at the prospect of leaving Mae with anyone.

Wheely glad you had a nice holiday and somehow managed to fit in all those changes too.

Lau fingers crossed for your passport!

Slick what a lovely insight into the future. Can I stay in the ignorant bliss that 'my' baby would never do that! Yeah right she'll probably manage to walk it through the whole house or something!

ahhhh butter wouldn't melt, corgi, he is soooo cute.

by the way i have used richard ferber's book, "solve your child's sleep problems". it is where i got the advice to reduce night feeds by a few minutes gradually. i dare not mention it but i used to read gina ford for ds1, and she also refers the reader to his book. i did use the methods described, and found them encouraging.

slick hope dd2 forgets that habit in a hurry!

wheely i am very impressed with the swimming achievement. my three boys started a week of beginners lessons a fortnight ago, and two of them are still sinking...no where near swimming 10 metres.

jolly i am sure Mae will thrive with her carers, and you will both benefit from your time together. she will gets lots from a new environment, and you'll probably see her with new eyes when you collect her.

as for mama kanga, thank you everyone! BUT i think anyone who brings up a child or 2,3,4 or 5 is a super mum: it is hard work no matter how many there are!!!

Hear, hear, joanne, on the child-minding worries. Maybe we need to start a support thread for panicky mums going back to work!

If it's any consolation, my mum is threatening to rent the flat across the street from the nursery and install herself permanently at the window with military-grade binoculars to keep an eye on her grandson...and I'm just about ready to take her up on it.

Well done with the BF to FF switch -- I'm still struggling a bit to get on more of a schedule (the famous 10, 1, 4, etc) because his BFing has never been like that. He's an inveterate snacker/grazer, and will stop in at the "food court" every two hours or so. That's not gone away in our early FF experiments, as he will only eat a small amount (I think you're right on the smaller-stomach idea, joanne) and then ask for the boob an hour later.

On the bright side, after a nightmare getting him down last night (started at 9 and succeeded at 11), he woke once to eat at 1.30 and didn't wake again until 7.15! Ate, fell asleep again and is still sleeping now.

Welcome home wheely! Well done on teh weaning. I've been trying to remember how I did weaning with dd1 and I just can't. I think I have an NCT weaning book and the AK one so will have to dig them out.

If anyone is doing finger foods from early this book was recommended to me and is really good.

Has anyone got 2 sharing a room? Do they wake each other up? I know that dd1 will be so excited having Rosie in with her and can just imagine the "conversations" that will go on! We are keeping dd1 in her cot until she is used to sharing her room - mainly so she can't get out and annoy/climb into the cot with Rosie!

corgi, Rosie can sometimes smell a bit hamster-like in the morning! It must be a formula thing and comes out in her wee.

Love the pics of Rhys - don't we all have the most adorable babies!

Glad you got a night away corgi - you've had a pretty hellish time on the sleep front so you deserve it. Alas my folks won't take Rosie overnight until she's about 1yo - or they would also be up checking breathing all night!

Rosie has managed to catch her big sisters cold. Horrid throat and cough (still sure it isn't swine flu - no temps). I hate hearing babies cough as they don't know how to do it effectively so it goes on for ever. It does sound a bit like a croup cough - but she is happy and smiley otherwise and drinking her milk. Also sleeping loads during the day so it is hopefully healing. It is just the look of horror when she is laid down in her cot and the snot engulfs her - lots of choking and spluttering. Have the cot raised at one end and Olbas oil on a tissue - but beyond that there is not much else I can do. In dd1's day I used Medised - now it is just Calpol (which she likes to spit out or sneeze out her nose!)

jolly Rosie also has a small tummy. She is 18ml bottles and doesn't always finish them. And she is fully ff! But she does sleep well. I guess all babies are different.

To all of you anxious about going back to work/childcare, just remember that it does get easier. But for the first few weeks/months you will feel that they are just not doing it right (ie/ not your way !) and you will do lots of soul searching about whether to change your carer/nursery. Give it a few weeks and you realise that they are good (or if you still have misgivings by that stage - change) and let them get on with it. I stressed so much about how little sleep dd1 got at nursery - but she just used her at home days to catch up.

We have just gone through a couple of weeks of wailing and crying at nursery drop off - and today she went running in - gave her key worker a cuddle and never gave me a backward glance! When it is like that it is lovely and you realise that they get to do so much in their day - lots of messy thing you don't want to do at home - and they learn so much.

Finally - can I just say, slick, OMG! Poo "art" is not something you want your toddler to get a taste for - eurgh!!!!

that should be 180ml not 18ml bottles before you all think I am starving Rosie !

meep My two boys share, we pout DS1 to be about 6.30 (he will play for a bit then drop off) and put DS1 down in the cot in our room, then he gets transferred into the boys' room when I go to bed. They don't tend to wake each other up, even though DS1 is a bed-bouncer!

Passport update: The lovely woman from the office just rang me, she's got the application so we're finally going!

hooray - great news about the passport!

hmmmm - Rosie goes to bed first in the meep house (can't keep her awake past 6.30). Think I will just have to do dd1's stories in a different place then sneak her into the room. Rosie is pretty good at staying asleep - or waking up and having a look round then nodding off again.

My FIL in coming over from NZ soon - so he and dh are being tasked with clearing out the garage so we can move the huge wardrobe in dd1's room out there and make space for wee Rosie. Then the big move will be at the end of September. Will be lovely to go to bed and read my book again!

Thanks for the welcome back everyone.

'Will be lovely to go to bed and read my book again' - Meep, it is fab. After 5 months of reading in bed by torch or mobile phone light I have read in bed with the light on the last two nights !!! AND AND AND L went to bed at 7.30 ish last night, slept till 4.30, fed and back to sleep until 7. We have NEVER had a night like that. So she seems to like the cot and her own space. She also went back for a nap about 9.30 IN HER COT. Obviously I woke up at 3 worrying about why she hadn't woken up.

kanga - dd1 has been hving 'lessons' since she was 6 months and real proper lessons since she was not quite 3 and is now 4.6 so it wasn't a quick process. Nevertheless I am v. proud of her and now need to hunt out the high school musical towel I promised her if she swam the length.

Hope all the going back to workers are feeling ok and that the formula switch is going ok. My boobs seem to have settled down to our new feeding pattern which is good. I never made it back since dd1 partly because I couldn't face it and secondly I was the unhappiest accountant in the world. I'll venture back into something else one day.....

glad the passport is looking ok Lau.

We just got notification that they've finally sorted out L's child benefit application and so we are getting a big back dated lump sum - hoorah !

Hi everyone

I am in sleep hell! A is crying everytime I put her in her cot now, although she will sometimes go to sleep if I put my finger in her mouth.

She is also teething! Her first tooth popped through on Friday, and its next door neighbour won't be long by the look of it. I can also see white lines where the top ones will be!

Once I got her into bed at 2am this morning she then woke every half an hour. And it was almost the same the night before. I gave her calpol to see if it would help with any pain, and have been to Boots this morning and got some Ashton & Parsons powders and some teething gel too just to try. Her new little tooth is ever so sharp and I can feel it every now and again when I feed her. Eeeek!

I dropped dh off at lunchtime as he is on a pub crawl with most of the blokes from our old local. How nice it has coincided with the start of teething and poor A is very grumpy and tearful. He has been told if he is smashed, he is not being picked up! (Is that mean of me?)

Not started weaning yet, but I was eating a pear on Saturday and let A have a taste - she started trying to chew it. I wonder if I'll be able to hold out to 26 weeks...

Oh, and Meep was it you going to see U2? I am not going now. Was supposed to be going on Thursday - but the company I paid a lot of money too are a b**y scam!

Feeling very down in the dumps and knackered. Sorry for mammoth post. I hope there is a light at the end of the sleep tunnel.

oh no grinning that is absolutely sh*t - both on Amy's teething and U2. I am going to see them tomorrow night if the rotten cold I have will let me (if it doesn't there will be a spare ticket to Hampden if you want ).

grinning, I'm sorry I know what those nights are like! They do say it will end eventually, so I'm clinging to that faint hope (of course, I also believed that things would improve at 3 months foolish, foolish me!). Any chance your DH can take over for a couple of nights to give you a break?

Tried to get Rhys in bed tonight at 8.15 a radical departure from his usual 10pm and have been completely unsuccessful. DP in with him now offering some EBM without picking him up from his cot...we'll see if that works...

Come on, Amazon! Where's my Ferber?

Hope things have got better grinning - you poor thing.

Corgi - hoped the ebm worked.

I bought the 'no cry sleep solution' a while ago but haven't opened it. Although since coming home from hols L has been going to sleep without a murmur bizarrely (was taking me hours on hols and wasn't great before we went). Is also napping again in her cot. OUr night wasn't so brilliant last night but ok.

Meep - I know I have asked you about this more than once but now that I am actually doing the bottles in the day I can ask you some more pointed questions about preparation. Sorry for being a pain ! I thought, as I am only doing 2 and at regular times it would be fine to do them fresh but both afternoons L has decided she wants milk half an hour before she 'should' so I have a screaming baby whilst trying to cool down water etc.

So, I just wanted to ask - when you cool them down and put in the fridge, do you get htem really cool before putting them in the fridge ?

For the morning do you do one the night before and leave in fridge (also for the night - not that you need it in the night but imagine you did ) ?

Do you take them out from fridge when you go out ?

OK, will try and promise not to ask any more about it !!

Am lurking and too busy to post properly at the moment, but if you don't mind me sticking my oar in wheely til Meep comes along, I have been FFing HHB for four months now and generally, we boil water and then let it sit in an open flask for a bit and then put the lid on. that way when we need to make a feed up, the water is at a better temp and it doesn't take so long to cool down. It also means we can make the feeds as we go. Once we've made the feed up we stick it in a bowl of water to the same level of the milk and it cools pretty quick. Hope this helps.

Back later.

Thanks ladies.

I ended up with her in bed with me last night, that way I could just pop a boob in her mouth every time she grizzled

I had to go and pick dh up from the pub at 11pm (and it's 30 odd miles away) so her usual bedtime was out the window. He was very pleased with himself for only drinking 21 or 22 pints, and kept saying "see, I told you I wouldn't get smashed"

He has a bad head today, so I keep texting him to take the mickey.

I have a weaning visit tomorrow. Don't know what to expect, but a community nurse is coming over to natter. Do you think she'll say I have to start now that A has teeth? Do you think I should start anyway as she'll be 20 weeks this coming Saturday? I don't know what to do really!

Meep Hope you make the concert tonight. I'm not at all...

Corgi If the ebm in the cot works, do tell us because I'll be trying that too! (Hope it does for you - this no sleeping thing really does get you down)

Thanks slick - all advice welcome. Sounds like a good idea. I assume you have a good flask - I wonder though if I'd worry the water wasn't at the right temp (but then I'll worry about anything ).

I was talking to my friend who had v. prem twins and apparently the SCBU didn't follow the guidelines re hot water which I thought was negligent interesting !

grinning - I had a weaning visit with dd1 and IIRC they just gave me lots of leaflets and talked through things. I wouldn't feel pressured to start because she has teeth/ is 20 weeks. Take your cues from A. I started at 20 weeks mainly because L was grabbing food from our plates, crying when we were eating etc.

meep - hope the cold is better too. Enjoy U2.

My 8 year old just said to me;

"You really like Mumsnet, eh Mum?"

"Yes" I replied.

"Do you LOVE it?"

"Errr...."

I'm not sure how to answer that. Maybe my grown up (sic) equivalent of liking something is on a par with her 8 year old 'loving' something! Anyway, I certainly feel strongly about our March Mums thread.

Grinning Sorry you've been having such a rough time. Can't believe you travelled 30 miles to pick up drunk DH! And at that time of night! He owes you! Hope Amy starts to sleep better soon.

HHB has little teeth about to burst through too and his lower gums just look so red and hot. Poor wee thing.

Wheely Hope your LO is onto a good thing! Long may it last!

Well we had a helluva day yesterday. My DH was back to work after a two week break and my back has been agony, so combine that with no sleep (all THREE children were up at some point through the night, what the fff...?!) and scorching PMS, there was a lot of shouting going on yesterday. I did manage to go see a new spinal therapist down the road (handier and cheaper - and it turns out that his grandad taught the other guy I usually see in Perth!) but he is a bit, well, sanctimonious, has worked with a lot of Scottish footballers and I think is a little on the mysoginistic side, a bit patronising to women, but hell, I was desperate and it turned out two parts of my lower spine were out which is why it was worse than normal and so is feeling much better today. So I put up with it. But I really felt like telling him to F--- Off.

Then our tap in the kitchen bust so I have a constant leaking tap on to the floor. Then the water turned brown and gritty,as there seems to have been some works getting done nearby. Then I had a plumber (not related to these porblems) round to discuss the possibility of moving the bathroom and bedroom around and at the end of it, we have decided not to bother. We will just decorate them as they are. So that's quite a lot of hassel off my plate. But THEN I got a text from one of my best friend who's a midwife and has just had her second baby a month ago, saying she was in hospital waiting to find out if she has a blood clot on her lung! So am really worried about her and hoping to God that if it is that, it doesn't dislodge and go to her heart. She's had a scan this morning and we are waiting to hear. They hopefully have caught it early enough and will give her blood thinning tablets. But, such a worry. So that put everything else into perspective.

Sorry for mammoth post.

Friend is now back home and been given the all clear! Phew! Thank God.

Slick thank goodness your friend is OK, that sounded very scary. Also glad your back is OK, even if it did mean putting up with some dinosaur.

Grinning your hubby definitely owes you big time. I would suggest using this wisely may be you could have a day off?

Grinning hope today has got better for you, sounds like yesterday/ night was a real downer.

Mae is off for her first session at nursery tomorrow we have an hour tomorrow afternoon so that she can have a look round and then a couple of sessions next week.

And I have also had some sort of bad news as I have had a letter from work telling me that I have been assessed for a 'competitive slot' at work for a job that it is between my current post and my former managers job, but I don't know what to do as there is only one job and there will be at least 4 people trying to get it. I am not sure whether just to ask to stay in my old job if it is possible even if it is downgraded because there will now be a post above it. And annoyingly I can't talk to my boss as he is one of the people I would be competing against!

sorry about your bad day Slick - and about yuor bad news Jolly. Good your friend is ok Slick.

I am feeling most virtuous - I started running again when on hols and today went out with the all terrain buggy with L in it and did a run. It was sooooo hard pushing the buggy at the same time. I think I may ache tomorrow.

Thanks for good wishes.

Jolly Ooooh tricky one. On the one-hand it sounds like you're qualified to do it. Does that mean there would be more stress tho or is it not bad? Sometimes at this stage when you've had a new-born(ish) adding more responsibilty can feel a bit much. But there again, if you feel like you'd handle it no problem then go for it! What would happen if you didn't get it? Would you still get to keep the job you are in? Hope so.

Wheely Running?? I can barely bend my knees yet with this blasted hormonal-sore-joint problem, so I am really impressed you are running. I went on a see-saw for two minutes on the family break and it killed my knees!! Swimming's ok tho. Good for you. I still amn't fitting into my old jeans yet and it's really doing my head in. I can't bring myself to buy new jeans as I just hope feel it will be a waste when I finally (ahem) get myself back into the old ones.

I may, however, be very deluded.

At tea-time earlier, I went to answer the phone (we had finished) and HHB was still in his high chair. I came back to find DD2 spooning carrot and rice mush into his, er mush, and he was killing himself laughing. I think those two are going to get on great.

Hi everyone - great to hear how you're all doing. I don't post much but try to keep up with the thread.

Well, I've been half-heartedly getting into weaning - we're putting off a full-blown effort until DD1 is toilet trained (which we're trying at the mo with grim determination with mixed success). But tried a bit of baby rice today and the expression on M's face was hilarious. It was like 'what the f* are you giving me woman' while simultaneously grabbing the spoon out of my hand to try more. I wasn't convinced anything was going in until she gagged and spewed it up It's funny because we didn't get this expression when she shoved DD1's Play Doh in her mouth this morning and that tastes rank!

I just have a question for the seasoned pro weaners among you - do you sterilise the bowl/spoon etc? I can't remember from last time and am too lazy to google!

Another question for those with more than one LO - how do you manage the bedtime routine on your own? Do you put one down first then the other (in which case how do you keep the second one entertained while putting the first down)? Or do you try and do them together (in which case how does that work??)?

Hey Miss (Sorry everyone, you'll all be sick of me, but there doesn't seem to be anyone else around!)

Lol at your bubba's try at real food! Maybe homemade play doh will be cheaper than veg.

With regards to sterilising the bowls and spoons etc, I kinda do, but don't get too hung up about it. By the time they are getting to the point where they can lift stuff and put it into their mouth's anyway, a clean bowl and spoon won't matter much - esp if it is cleaned in a dishwasher. So, sometimes I do it, if it's convenient and makes me feel like a better mum but like I say, I don't worry too much. I think at this stage (mind, mine is over 5 months, would probably be a bit more careful earlier) it's the food and milk that's more important. That's what I think anyway.

re: getting the little blighters to bed - yes, I just do one at a time - currently in this order; (nearly) 2 year old first (she's the biggest trouble ), then HHB, the the eldest. I just leave HHb sitting in his bumbo or leanback or whatever with a chew toy or something. Once the toddler's down, anything seems possible! Hope this helps.