The March-ers 2019 - Baby Talk #1

[Angelmiracle]

Congratulations to all the mamas with their new babies 🌸

Now the fun really starts 😄

@toastfiend - baby boy - 28/01/2019
@TheWanderlust - Baby girl - Althea - 7lb6oz - 16/02/2019
@PurpleFlower1983 - Baby girl - Matilda - 17/02/2019
@Wineandchoccy - Baby girl - Lois - 6lb12oz - 19/02/2019
@Harley8888 - Baby boy- Logan - 7lb4oz - 01/03/2019

@Hermagsjesty @MistakenHoliday also meant to say thank you for the solidarity 😊

My two year old just did a massive vomit, said 'that's crap' and then vomited again. Obviously we are not being as careful with our language as we thought we were!

Well today has been the final straw of my breastfeeding journey . It's making me ill. I feel depressed . Rose has cluster fed all day and I just can't do it . I haven't got a minute to myself . I have had about 300mls of fluid all day . I'm at my sister's currently sat in the spare room with her on my boob whilst our partners are downstairs watching the football . I wanted to carry on till 6 weeks . I know that's not a long time in general but I didn't want to breast feed I am just trying to do what I can . It has made me feel down before and I spend my days crying ..I'm not sleeping I'm not eating right or drinking enough . I am not enjoying my experience as a new mum and it's because of this responsibility . I feel so shitty right now . Don't know what to do . I have no idea how to formula feed or how much to give etc I have no idea what the he'll to do. Just want to give up everything righg now

@BadBadBeans oh god, it was! I blame the lack of sleep, sorry! And what a stressful day you had 😰 it sounds so tough. I'm glad your MIL was there to help. Keep reminding yourself that it gets easier (I know I do!). By the time the summers here, everything will have settled down.

I had a moment today where DD2 was crying in the pram because she was hungry whilst I carried DD1 who was screaming because she'd fallen and scraped her knee. I felt like shouting, 'My life used to be fun!' 😂

Love your two year old's language! We've had to watch ours since DD1 told us the dog had 'had a shite on the landing' one day!

@Jenlou1992 it sounds like switching to formula might be the right thing for you. I know the midwives always say breast it best but I think a full baby and a sane and happy mum is much more important.

I can't offer any advice on how to do it, sorry but I know others will. You're amazing for getting this far so go easy on yourself!

@Jenlou1992 you sound like I did with DS1. I wanted to breastfeed but it was such hard going and I didn't enjoy my baby. I switched to formula at 11 weeks as he wasn't gaining weight and it was such a relief, I felt tonnes better to be able to hand him to DH for a break and he thrived.

You could mixed feed, I don't have ant advice on that though as haven't done it myself, we just went straight fit formula. We used to use Aptamil but got told it's the same as Cow & Gate but C&G is cheaper. The packet has info on how many feeds they should be having at each age and how many ounces per feed but I'm sure you can amend a bit depending on if they still seem hungry after.

There's so much about "breast is best" that I felt awful about switching and like a total failure. There should be more information on hand to say that a fed baby is best and just as important is a happy mum. You getting upset will just make babies feeding worse and then it's a vicious cycle

@jenlou1992 if breastfeeding isn’t working for you, then you should stop. Your baby will be well fed and happy and you’ll be able to look after yourself better too. It’s definitely not something you should feel guilty about.

@BadBadBeans sorry you're having such a tough time. I understand about your DH needing to drive but it definitely would've made more positive difference to you than negative to him. They really have no idea about how little sleep mums get and how much energy breastfeeding can take too.

Sorry your eldest is sick, hope he's feeling better soon. Glad your MIL took charge, remember to keep leaning on her when you can to give yourself a break. Could you consider expressing and bottle feeding instead of using your damaged side to give you time to heal?

Also, your son's language made me laugh, although I'm sure that you didn't see the funny side at the time. It's amazing what they hear and pick up, isn't it?! Somehow we've mostly avoided bad language (although DS1 did have a short spell of saying "dammit" to himself in bed!) But he does come out with some things that make you wonder where he got it. Also makes me think twice about talking about anyone in his presence incase certain things then get passed on out of context!!

@Jenlou1992 first of all have a hug it’s so hard and breastfeeding is hard because only one person can do it. If you want to switch to formula it’s ok and it means you can share the load a happy Mum is as important as a happy baby. Formula is well regulated so choose whichever brand is easiest for you to buy. The approximate amounts are on the side of the box also google paced feeding.

@Jenlou1992 sounds like you need a hug! Why don't you start by replacing one feed with formula and see how it goes from there? Maybe the first evening feed as it may fill Rose up a bit more and give you a chunk of sleep to set you up each night.

@MistakenHoliday haha that is exactly what I feel like shouting! I'm watching a lot of box sets and films while feeding and just marvelling at all these characters who go where they want, when they want 😂 That's also hilarious about the dog shite!

@Jenfur I could potentially express for a bit, but am unwilling to because I did this with DS1 when his tongue tie was making feeds excruciating and the extra work it created nearly drove me insane! I think I will dig out a nipple shield tomorrow and see if that helps a bit. Ha yes I am now terrified about talking about people in front of DS1!

@hermadgesty my 6 week check was very comprehensive in comparison to @wineandchoccy. She asked me about how I was doing, how we were feeding, if I wanted her to check my stitches etc and then with him she was very thorough. Apparently his boy bits aren't fully developed yet but he's got two balls so she said it's just a matter of time and likely a result of him being almost pre term. It lasted around 30 min for us both.

@jenlou1992 switching to formula sounds a good option for you. I also didn't really envisage myself bf for that long as I need to switch to formula only shortly due to health reasons so was also planning to do 6 weeks if I could. Im now there and will carry on but we've been combination feeding since week 2/3 (although more breast milk atm) and as others have said the guidance is very clear on the packaging wrt how much to give, how often etc. We have a perfect prep machine as we knew we would move to exclusive formula within months and husband says it's been really good as it takes the thinking out of bottle prep as you literally press go. They're around £20 if you get a second hand one or we paid £55 for ours new. Do you also have some bottles? And a steriliser? Again we just got a Tommee Tippee "starter kit" with an electric steriliser, bottles etc for £55 and it's been fine. You basically just need to invest in a brand as all of their kit goes together, although we were told to get a variety of bottle brands to see which he likes best so we also have MAM bottles that we haven't used yet. We got them free at expectant parents events. I know others on here such as @ballanj are exclusively formula feeding so they'll be able to give you pointers on the transition. Oh, and at one of the breast feeding drop jbs I went to I specifically asked about moving into exclusive formula and she said that there's literally no difference between the brands as it's so heavily regulated. There was a Channel 4 Dispatched programme about a month ago on it, I've been meaning to watch but haven't got around to it as loads of people, including this woman, have said it's really informative.

@badbadbeans and others, so funny and scary what they pick up!! We've already been talking about how we can't continue to use the language we do in front of him. We don't really swear in a conventional sense it's more we use a lot of poo/fart/bum etc "insult" phrases both to each other and now him which he'd probs get in trouble for, but we use them almost as affectionate terms as we are that mature!!

@hermadgesty just to add dd2 hasn’t had her check yet but I remember dd1 appointment taking a while weigh in plus basically a repeat of the newborn checks they did after birth.

I will catch up properly in 'proper' morning but couldn't read and run @Jenlou1992 please don't feel guilty about switching to formula, I breastfed DS for two days and then switched and it was the best decision I've made. If you need any help figuring it out let me know as I think I've cracked formula feeding 😂 also, if you need to chat about how you're feeling to an anon stranger on Mumsnet let me know, I really sympathise with what you're going through right now. Well done for getting this far with it all mumma! Xx

@Jenfur I really know how your feeling.
Try not to be hard on yourself.
I only lasted about a week breast feeding, I felt exactly like you do, crying everyday, exhausted, in pain and not enjoying it at all.
I also felt so guilty and shit about myself and baby for changing to formula, but honestly after a couple of days I was fine and really started to enjoy being a mum again.
Like people say we all know "breast is best" but a fed happy baby and mum is best.

Baby seems to have a little cough this morning, not sure if it sounds a little chesty.
Anyone else's baby had a cough/cold, did you take baby to doctors?

Sorry everyone I've completely lost track of this thread so I don't mean to Bob in and change the topic... but...

After having an emergency csection, I don't feel like I can talk about "the birth" to anyone as I don't feel like I actually gave birth to my son. I had planned a water birth in a birth centre but ended up being admitted due to there being meconium in my waters and then they discovered he was undiagnosed breech and in distress so we got whisked off to surgery. I wouldn't describe the experience as traumatic but it definitely all happened incredibly quickly and I do feel like decisions were made for me. Although, to be honest, this doesn't bother me as the decisions made were in the best interest of both me and my baby and I would have chosen c section under those circumstances anyway.
The bit that I'm most sad about was not being able to see, touch and ultimately bond with my baby straight away as he was whisked off to another room to have his lungs checked by doctors as they were worried he might have inhaled the meconium. The surgeons were also unable to lift him above the screen as they brought him out of me for me to see him as his cord was too short. Then after he was given the all clear (only took about 10 minutes) he was given to me DH who was told to move over to the corner of the room as I was losing quite a bit of blood so all I could really see of him was his little hat. I wasn't allowed to hold him as my arm was strapped down with drips and I think a blood transfusion going into me. (I wasn't told but had given my permission before the surgery and overheard the surgeon telling them to prep the second unit of blood)
I love my son more than anything on this planet but I missed out on the rush of instant love people describe. When people ask me about the birth, my response is that there wasn't really one and that I had an emergency c section. I did have contractions but only got as far as 1cm dilated. I'm trying not to get hung up on the fact that I didn't really experience birth or labour but I do feel a bit sad about the whole thing.
Sorry about the massive essay and my actual question is, to those of you who had emergency c sections, do you have similar feelings at all? And is it normal not to get the rush of love everyone talks about?

@kee80 we've had a blocked nose/cold for about a week and I took him to the pharmacist. They gave me some saline drops which helped and then we had our 6 week check this week anyway. The doctor checked his lungs and said there wasn't anything "deep" in his chest so the bunged up ness should clear in a week or two. When is your 6 week check?

@assumeitwassomethingclever sorry you didn't get the birth you wanted, although as you say what happened was ultimately best for you and baby. I had the birth I wanted but like you it was very very fast and way earlier than we had thought. It was only immediately after he was born that I was really aware of what has just happened. I was completely shaking and found the immediate after birth much harder than the actual labour. I was in complete shock and also didn't have the imminent love feeling that everyone talks about. They wanted me to hold him but I was shaking so much and was terrified that I'd drop him so declined, and then wasn't really with it for the first two hours that he was born (despite only having gas and air) so my husband did all of the initial skin to skin, first feed (as I just couldn't do it and was also really worried as my body felt unable to per) etc and ultimately they decided that I was "struggling to bond" and referred me to the mental health team which even later that day I was very annoyed about as I felt completely judged by people who had known me for less than 2 hours and had no appreciation of the context, which in relation to my response was very important. It's a completely different situation to you, but I only really looked at my baby for the first time around two hours after he was born partially because I knew that my husband would do whatever needed, which again they took as "failure to bond" rather than me freaking out and focusing on myself as I had complete confidence in my husband's decision making abilities.

@cardboard33 6 week check isn't till 13th may. I've rung doctors just for advice and he's told me to bring baby in this afternoon just to be checked.

@AssumeItWasSomethingClever I had an emergency c section as well. I was in labour for around 12 hours before they made the decision to operate but like you it was not what I had planned. I was all for the Hypno birthing drug free method. C section was the very last thing i wanted - 1) because I didn't want a spinal and 2) because I'm stubborn and independent and I was terrified of a long recovery and depending on other people.

When they lifted Emerson out they cleaned him then gave him to my partner then asked if I wanted to hold him. I declined this for 2 reasons. 1) like you I was strapped down so I've no idea how they expected that to happen and 2) my birthing process was incredibly traumatic and throughout it I had thrown up on myself multiple times. It might sound ridiculous but all I could think was "they've just cleaned him. I don't want to get sick on him".

So I didn't hold him till they'd sewn me back up and were wheeling me out into recovery (and I made a nurse tie my hair back to limit the sick issue!). I also never had that immediate rush of love. I knew I loved him, thats never been in question but my main thoughts were along the lines of "thank good that's over / I wonder when I'll feel my legs again / god I want to shower". Despite that I still know that I love this baby more than anyone else could dream of doing. I definitely felt like I'd given birth but it took me a while to not be embarrassed of the fact it has ended in emergency c section and hadn't all gone to plan.

I think new mums need to be careful of getting wrapped up in what they hear from other people. The only "right way to do this" is as long as you're happy and baby is happy and fed and looked after. It doesn't matter if you ff / bf / has a c section / had a relaxing 10 minute water birth etc, but it takes a while to not think "I failed because of x y z". I am a firm believer of everything happens for a reason. No two birthing stories are the same and you definitely have given birth - don't forget that.

@AssumeItWasSomethingClever I had a VB for both of mine but still didn't feel that rush of love for DD1 when she was born. That feeling didn't come until a month or so later and it was more of a gradual build up. I think it was the shock of what had just happened and the fact I needed time to get used to this massive life change.

Like @WhatALearningCurve says, I think this 'rush of love' narrative is a damaging one that makes women feel awful when they don't experience it. I suspect it's more common that women feel like we did that is talked about

Oh and complete side note but last night, for the first time in five weeks, I DID NOT GO TO SLEEP WITH THE BABY AT BEDTIME! I very decadently spent the evening glossing the stairs and managed to sleep in this morning so DD1 was very late for nursery but, hey ho 😂

@kee80 my DS is 23 days old and has a little cold, we did take him to the doctors yesterday just to be absolutely safe. He is fine and his chest sounds good, it's just hard when they're struggling. He needs to be held up or propped up well to sleep. We also got saline spray for newborns and a little manual nose sucker - you put one end in their nostrils and literally suck the snot out.

@AssumeItWasSomethingClever sorry to see you're feeling this way about the birth. I also had an emergency csection and have struggled with the birth and post birth since, my DS was taken straight to neonatal for four hours so I didn't get to see him. Then we were in hospital for 6 days both quite poorly so that was difficult and had lots of complications re csection since being home. I haven't had that rush of love either, I love him unconditionally but I see his dad with him and know I can't do as much for him atm and I feel like we haven't bonded as much as all I want to do is sleep. I also can't remember much of my birth, I totally zoned out during theatre (forceps, vontuse, csection), everyone was telling me how calm I was but in reality I just felt so disconnected from it all. Does your hospital have a birth after thoughts service? They can discuss the birth with you and refer you to counselling if necessary xx

@CaseofEllen I will get one of those and the spray from the pharmacist when I've seen the doctor. Thanks

@AssumeItWasSomethingClever I had an EMCS with DS1 and was very disappointed that I didn't feel that rush of love. I had imagined I would somehow recognise him when I saw him, but actually he looked nothing like I had expected and I felt very little in the way of emotion! I also did not get to hold him or see more than a glimpse of him immediately as he was puking meconium and then had to have his head stitched as he had been cut by the scalpel! I then spent much of the day vomiting and couldn't physically hold him so I wasn't able to bond. My husband remembers me crying 'I don't even know him!' several hours after he was born.

A lady opposite me had a planned section and she didn't feel the rush of love either. She was very candid with me and said on the second night that she thought she might be starting to love him a bit. But it was gradual for her.

I also didn't feel like I had given birth, and I still don't now I have had an elective as well. I feel like the surgeons gave birth for me. And after the first one, I felt like I had failed / missed out for ages afterwards. Then I met up with a friend who had had a horrendous vaginal birth and was left incontinent (temporarily, but it did last for two years!) and I decided to stop feeling like I had missed out!

I told my husband this morning that I feel like I don't love J, or certainly don't love him enough. He told me to get on mumsnet and find other people in the same situation to speak to! I think I am just so exhausted and drained, and frustrated by the feeding and the lack of sleep, and (particularly at night) I find it hard to think lovely thoughts about my little baby who is at the centre of all this. The times when I feel real delighted love are when he smiles in his sleep. I can't wait till he is smiling properly. DS1 started smiling properly at 3 weeks and I found it so easy to love a baby when they are smiling at you. I know it will come, and I am fairly sure that I do love him really, but I don't feel happy at the moment, just desperately frustrated, and that means I'm not having the feelings of fulfilment and bliss that I would expect to come along with love. Rather it is quite a functional sort of love at the moment - an I will look after him and protect him even though it is driving me crazy sort of love.

I've also fallen out with DS1 today because J went down for a sleep and I told his brother he could either sleep with me or play quietly in the bedroom with us. He got into bed with me and just talked at me and poked me. I was so gutted to miss out on a nap and although I realise it is totally unreasonable to ask a 2 year old to understand my need for sleep (and to expect him to play unsupervised), I got cross with him and told him off a bit. Not winning parent of the year over here!

@AssumeItWasSomethingClever I just had a little search and found this old thread which you may find reassuring. I certainly did. Identified hugely with the, 'is it okay?' 'Does it need anything?' 'Can I sleep now?' lady - I still feel like that now, let alone on the first day! Also several people corroborating what I just said about feeling lots of love once the baby starts smiling.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/antenatal_postnatal_depression/1791543-Why-dont-I-feel-overwhelming-love-for-my-baby?pg=1&order=

I've just had an hour's nap (DS1 out in garden with Grandpa; DS2 miraculously asleep in basket) and feel a bit brighter. Still feel bad for being grumpy with DS1 though. I feel like I am nowhere near as good as the mum I imagined I would be. It doesnt help that my own mum was basically perfect - I would love to give my children the kind of mothering she gave me but I fear I am too selfish and too flawed!!!!

@AssumeItWasSomethingClever I had an emergency c-section with my son and I never felt that "rush of love" with him till he was at least 12 months old. I think I may have had a bit of PND but never spoke to anyone about it.

With this baby I had elected section and I felt the same with her too. I cried when I heard her cry but when I saw her I was like.. oh right, she's here, she's not what I imagined her to be like! Also found with the demands and stress of breastfeeding I was starting to feel a little worst and kind of resenting her, I felt like the worst mother ever! This baby was so wanted and I thought I would have unconditional love for her once I saw her due to 2 previous miscarriages, but no I didn't feel it.
Stopping breast feeding really did help me. I no longer feel like I'm starting to resent her and no longer feel like a bad mum. My "unconditional love" for her is now starting to grow.

Thanks everyone for your replies . Not sure what I'm feeling about the breast feeding . Yesterday was a really bad day . Today isn't any easier . I just think my low mood is present more than a good happy mood . Don't think it's just the breast feeding . Think I'm going to ring my midwife tomorrow and see if she will come out . Just don't want her pressuring me into anything. My partner is really getting on my nerves . He adds to my stress x 100 .