November 2012 - The weaning adventure continues

[StuntNun]

Previous thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/postnatal_clubs/1772925-November-2012-Adventurous-eaters-food-refusers-and-everything-in-between

Oh dear ladies. Three wake-ups or one long one. Not sure which is worse actually.

Am now back in bed with DD2 waiting for her to sleep. PCM seems to have been effective for both wee cherubs. DH could not sleep with the noise so he is downstairs watching J and I have the bed. He came to bed at 7 as he was tired so I think he has done well.

And no chance of a nap as J does not nap when poorly, and if DD2 did then she would be awake until 11. And they would never do it at the same time anyway.

Shit VQ What a night :( Surely the Valium clan have had more than their fair share of illness now.

Hope you get some sleep. And you too stunt

I have the Thomas the Tank Engine theme stuck in my head. It's bloody annoying.

Still awake. DD still awake. Birds fucking awake too. Grr!

And now I have Thomas music in my head too. Thank you

Amidst all the crawling and standing we had our own first today. His first kiss - me! Am feeling v lucky. He stroked my face, grabbed it and gave me a big open mouthed smacker. Clearly a softy like his Dad! So if early talkers are meant to have a high IQ and early movers meant to be sporty - this better not mean he's going to be some lothario!

Told my sis about our apparent success with soy and she said that her daughter was also seemingly OK initially just was sleepless 2-3 nights later. Given the chatting, singing creature in my arms after what is usually a quick night feed - he's more like a mogwai from gremlins arse. I've just sneezed whilst feeding him and he's just given me the funniest shocked face with my boob in his mouth .

Morning,

I still have my friend here so no chance of posting really, She is leaving tmrw morning. It's nice to catch up but I feel now so tired, it's exhausting having friends around. And my diet is not going well at all, haven't managed to go for a run since she has arrived. We took O to the Zoo yest, she loved it, was fascinated by the giraffes and zebras.

vq so sorry to hear all the illnesses, I hope everyone recovers soon.
Pr I love the post holiday aims and hope that sleep training dd1 will go smoothly.
evil so glad E loves nursery, have you sorted out drop off and pick up ?
chasing you know what I think, dead proud of you for making the right choices.
bplp sorry for milk supply. I miss breast feeding so much.
Hugs for everyone who needs it especially gt, izzy.

O doesn't want to drink formula. She has 14oz a day. I wake her up now fora dream feed to get an extra 5 oz in her, 14 oz inc dream feed. I know it's because of the heat but no idea how to force her to take more. She has 5 oz of water appr.

I remember the non-napping days from when DS2 was small, if he slept then DS1 wanted to be played with and they too never slept at the same time. It's funny that I thought DS2 was a bad sleeper, J tops him and then some. At 6 months DS2 started sharing a bedroom with DS1 and was only waking once a night.

Don't worry YW, DS1 was a late talker and now he's articulate and verbose whereas DS2 walked at 9 months and does not do well at sports' day.

What a night! n did want to sleep, but thier was so much snot! It's his teeth, as he cried so much this morning he's not eaten much nor has he drank most of his bottle. thankfully cbeebies are on!!! I try and have some breakfast.

Evil

Insomnia again.

Got up this morning to find that the cat had vommed/diarreahed everywhere. The playpen, the changing mat and the doormat.

Am taking her to the vet on Saturday. I can't cope with her constant illness it's disgusting. She has been back and forth for several years and nothing has been found to be wrong with her.

I can't keep her inside as she pukes. I can't keep her outside as she just comes in through open windows anyway. I can hardly leave the windows in the bedrooms open to air them properly as she comes in there theough the windows and I am worried about her disgusting arse on the bedding.

:(

As for dd1 I need Supernanny. Someone to come in and do this for us as me and DH don't agree on how to handle her at all. Yesterday we were doing rapid return vq and it was just complete meltdown. You're supposed to walk them back to their (ha, I wish, MY) bed instead lf carrying them but she would do that annoying floppy thing and refuse to walk. And I don't drag. And as soon as I let go of her hand she would laugh hysterically (flip the switch from crying hysterically) and run up and down the living room, til she was sweaty and very over excited. All symptoms of tiredness.

She's getting overtired but she won't go to bed or eat til her dad gets home, and by then it is too late. Have missed the window and she's up for hours.

My DH wants to start her with a shrink but I will not go down that road at just after two years old. Pushing boundaries and tantrums are all part of being a two year old.

I don't have this problem at all when I am on my own with her, ie DH is away for work. When that happens both kids are in bed by 9. I don't want to ask DH to come home even later as his and my days are long enough, and I don
.t want to pretend to DD1 that daddy isn't coming home each evening because that would be lying and horrible.

But I feel unsupported by DH as he either gets angry or gives in, doesn
.t listen when I try and discuss methods, or plan stuff, comes forward with no ideas, and when he does agree to a method gives up on day one when it doesn't work immediately.

So if I try something alone she just screams Papa Papa until he comes and takes over.

Meanwhile I sit there seething.

Maybe the only thing to do is to take DH and DD1 to the paed and get her to talk some sense into them, but DH now has no more holiday til end of August, so when are they supposed to go? I can't wait that long I can't deal with This anymore.

This weekend I have guests, but once they are gone I am going to make up the spare bed for me and just move out of my own room. And the idea of doing that makes me so fucking angry with both of them, which in turn makes me angry with myself. Because how can I be so angry with my own tiny daughter?

pr that sounds rubbish for you all. What does your DH think a shrink will achieve? It sounds to me like he hopes a magic switch can be flicked and he won't have to do anything he deems unpleasant. I would have thought a shrink for a wee one so young would require significant input and action from the parents so this line wouldn't get him what he wants anyway. I have no advice I am afraid - I know naff all about toddlers. I wait anxiously for our own troubles.

VQ I think a sacrifice to the snot god is necessary. Nominations?

Morning all,

7 - 1.40 - 6.20 all in his own cot

Haven't had a chance to catch up properly but it sounds as though things are rough for PR and VQ especially so ((hugs)) and aplenty.

There is no way I am taking a toddler to a shrink for something like this. If he believes that every little issue needs to go via a shrinkthen I doubt our compatibility as parents. It doesn't help that his sister is a child psychologist. I'm quite clear however that if he ever discusses our children's health with his family ( his mum has munchausens by proxy and his sis is very Freudian in her psych beliefs) that I will consider it a massive bettayal.

((((( PR ))))) I dont know what to suggest but I do have a lot of sympathy. Not sure a shrink is necessary, think you are completely right about her just being 2. Mine behaves in precisely the same way when she's in the mood. She also still sleeps with DH, albeit in her own room/bed. We also need to sort this but I am much less fussed due to enjoying my kingsize bed to myself

Is she big enough for reward chart / introducing the bed by stealth, i.e. read story in the bed, cuddle in her bed, then into your bed, gradually build up to naps etc? Could you just put her in her bed, stick a stair gate on her door, and let her really go for it until she gets the message? Some of my friends have sworn by this and say it only takes a couple of days but I am too much of a wimp to do this myself, despite its likely effectiveness

Snot here too evil

lily always nice to have guests, but I am also always glad when they go and life gets back to normal and you're not "entertaining" all the time

Any of those methods may work but I need DH on board. Also will need to move LO back out of their room which will be disruptive as however I get DD1 to sleep in there will be a noisy battle I fear. If I move LO back into our room that will cause jealousy issues so the only real place is the spare room. Which will be inconvenient as it is where I study, where the pc is and there is hardly enough room for the cot. I guess it is the only solution though.

PR you have my sympathies. It sounds bloody awful, especially if dh isn't on side. Supernanny would be straight in to tell him off.

VQ sorry to hear of ongoing snotiness. You have had more than your fair share now.

Lily glad you've enjoyed having your friend over. I can't wait to take F to London Zoo later this year.

Fatima F is on ff in the daytime, as I can't possibly express and work, and didn't fancy the idea of reverse cycling and 50+ hour weeks. It does seem like this mix feeding lark isn't working very well though I think I'll be lucky to maintain one feed a day. I'm almost sure she isn't getting enough overnight, as ever since Friday, she's woken an extra time overnight due to hunger.

Well done little O for sleeping so well! Hope F follows suit....

Dietitians appt later on today, am sure there is so much I want to ask her but I cannot remember half of it.

Yay Chasing go O. I'm sure you feel like a new woman.

PR fwiw I have found that sleep problems usually resolve quickly, i.e. within a week, although the first night in particular can be horrendous with lots of attention required. We did rapid return when our oldest two started leaving their room at night and it basically meant camping out on the landing in the dark and taking them back to bed whenever they came out. If it really seems beyond you then the Baby Sleep Site will do a sleep consultation which may help, I can't remember how much it is but iirc it wasn't stupidly expensive. My DS1 has special needs and we have found the most useful thing is to have a script or plan or action for dealing with his behavioural issues. That way we're not stressing about what to do, or getting creative with punishments, we just follow the plan. It might help you similarly if a specialist could give you a strategy to follow, especially for getting your DH on board.

Please can I have a reality check. J has been a rubbish sleeper for months now. He's on ranitidine and Gaviscon for silent reflux which have all but stopped the vomiting and the wriggling and writhing at breastfeeds. After he had scrambled egg he had a clear allergic reaction, probably non-IgE-mediated. Whereupon I stopped eating softly-cooked eggs but didn't stop eating e.g. egg noodles, cake, etc. For the past two weeks J's sleep has gone from okay to awful and his eczema has got worse again, but in that time I have eaten mayonnaise (Hellman's) on a number of occasions. After a lightbulb moment on Sunday I have stopped eating any egg-containing products and not only has J's sleep already improved, his mood in the daytime has been better. This seems like a pretty clear indication that I need to cut egg entirely. I last ate egg last Saturday so I intend to avoid egg all week then try some again in Saturday to confirm that J is reacting to it. Does this all add up? It's going to be pretty annoying to avoid egg entirely as I'm on a low-carb diet so I want to be sure that it's causing him problems before I completely exclude it from my diet for the next year or however long I continue breastfeeding.

Stunt it does sound as though eggs are the problem. The way he has responded to changes in your diet are similar to the way in which F responded to me stopping/having dairy. I might be wrong, but doesn't mayonnaise have an element of raw egg in? In which case he would react more so to that than to, say, cake? Just a thought because a world without cake is a sad world indeed

Also, a bit of an AIBU, but a good friend is getting married, and her hen do is next month. I really wanted to go, but her sister has organised something rather extravagant which is going to cost upwards of £200. What happened to L plates and a good old fashioned booze up?! Have had to say I just can't afford it

Pass that made me

Thank you for your kind words all x

PR a shrink will do nothing for your daughter but would do wonders for your DH! Let me share my experience with DD2:

B is extremely wilful and has just turned 3. She now mostly goes to bed well and gets up around 6. It has not always been so.

DH has his (many) faults, but generally we agree on all things parenting, and if we do not, we talk about things until there is resolution.

DD has had two periods in her short life when she was extremely difficult at bedtime. They blur as to when, but one was whilst in the cot, and the second in her big bed. Thankfully we have never had her sleeping in with us. Both times were following illness. Both times we went through long periods of one of us lying next to her until she fell asleep and gradually withdrawing but she would frequently wake and it could take hours.

I cannot remember what triggered our decision to do rapid return, but we had got to the point when we could take no more. We had a gate on her bedroom, but she would get up and climb cupboards, yowl, jump off the bed etc if awake and alone in her room. Typically it was left to me to do it. However I couldn't. Her cries for mummy would melt me and I would give in. I had to hand it over to DH and he had to be strong. I remember being sat with my hands over my ears. The first night took hundreds of returns. The second night about 20, the third a handful, and by night 4 they had cracked it. She still loved us, and was clearly happier for having more sleep. I think she was around 2 also.

I think the fact you have co-slept will make it a tad harder, but I encourage you to do it. Make a decision, get DH to at least stay out of the way as he is clearly the one less likely to stick at it, and tell DD that this is how it is going to be. Accept there will be three shit nights, but it will be worth it. Have you got a gate on the door? May be an idea to invest in one. An added complication is LO, so hopefully you can find a way to ensure she is cared for by someone other than you, and will not be disturbed by big sister.

I really think moving out of your marital bed is a bad idea as it will tell her that she is the boss of you, more important than you, and will affect your relationship with DH. Also, it is a situation that cannot last for ever. I think the sooner it is tackled the better, especially with your impending return to work.

Hopefully your sleep will improve once she is in her own bed in her own room x. I also think it is time the cat went to chase heavenly mice

Took me ages to post that so just off to catch up

Stunt that makes sense about the egg. I think you are doing the right thing. I am however wondering if the low carb diet may be something to do with the problems you are having. I did not think such a diet was compatible with bf, but have not researched it extensively.

Fuck. Bad nights for many. Illnesses for many. :( :( :(

Stunt No reality check needed. When you write it like that - it's clear as day. I'd say he is definitely reacting to egg.

PR Sounds like DH is the key to the problem really. I'd start there rather than with DD1, as otherwise it will be pointless. I'm not sure how to start with him though, but it sounds like he needs to have a few lessons in good sleeping habits.

I feel awful coming on saying this, but I was so happy this morning as a rare thing happened! O did not wake up once. Not even a cry out in his sleep. 8ish-7.30!

It has never happened before. For him to to even murmur. He used to sleep for long stretches without waking til he was ready for a feed, but around 14-15 weeks when reflux/cmpi was at its worst, he started waking up and crying out in his sleep. We used to say he only ever woke for feeds. But that hasn't been true for over half his life now :(

So it is a Big Occasion in our house for this to happen! And gives me hope/belief we have found the culprit finally.

Thanks stunt I will look into that. I definitely need some kind of professional to bollock explain things to my DH.