October 2012 babies - we meet them at last!

[YompingJo]

Getting thread in place in readiness!

Doing okish here, baby smiley gorgeous if very sickly (lots of changes of clothes all round here!). Keep feeling low and weepy intermittently but no good reason, prob just tiredness but don't like it. It's worst in the evenings but I have no reason to feel like this, delivery was easy ths time around, baby easier, bf easier ( though weirdly getting really bothered that it was so different for dd1 and feeling guilty for her - even though shes 5 and blatantly absolutely fine!). Oh well. It will pass.
livvy you are so nt a failure. Looking after a newborn baby is without a doubt the hardest thing I have ever done. It's also the most worthwhile and having my two daughters has brought me more joy than anything ekes (not necessarily in the newborn phase though!) if a maternity nurse helps, do it. Nothing wrong with that at all.
I never left dd1 to cry, didn't feel right to me. She was an appalling sleeper as a baby but from 18months or has settled herself with a nice bedtime routine and been brilliant. I read something the other day that's aid the best way fr a baby to go to sleep is calm and happy, so they get positive sleep associations, whether that is settling on their own,rocking, cuddling, feeding or whatever.
honey no chance whatsoever that bubs could have been hurt.
october big hugs for you too. You are doing your best for your baby.
Typing one handed so will stop now but love to all.

orange, midget and esp zara thank you for the words of encouragement. Zara - took a look at the other thread and have decided to try and combine the expressed milk until it runs out.

Now that it has been almost 48 hrs since I last breast fed I can definitely say I don't want to go back to it. I can cope with expressing but don't think it is a long term option to combine with formula.

zara you have had an unbelievable journey so far and the rational sane part of me knows that we are doing the best for our babies, but it is hard to let go of the breat feeding dream if that makes sense. Like you, I assumed bf would be come easily and didn't even bother thinking about formula as I was convinced I would be bf for 6m at least. Time to move on.

Sorry quick post as it is precious sleep time... But Livvy do whatever you need to do to survive, seriously. And on Baby Whisperer / crying to sleep stuff - I tried it one night very early on with mini-Angelico after reading BW. She howled for 15 mins and showed no signs of stopping. I have never done it since as reading around stuff online etc she is just way too young. Think there is lots of good stuff in BW, especially reading baby cues but not the crying it out stuff at this age.

Our bean generally settles well in little basket and has done from fairly early on BUT what did help (and sorry if this is obvious) is starting to teach beans the difference between day and night. So e.g. when night feeding her I turned on the lamp, talked to her etc and then read an Amazon review of a baby sleep book where person summarised whole book by saying "Night time - no talking, keep lights out etc (just nightlight on)". Sounds so obvious now but I was like "I am a muppet!" Also - if bean is in basket and crying you can try the BW patting stuff or (like us tonight) pick her up, sooth her (in our case bean did 2 enormous burps when picked up, hence the crying) then cuddle her and sing for a minute till eyes are closing. Gently put her down and soothed sleepy bean went out like a light. It's just trial and error really so hang in there And in middle of night if she falls asleep on boob - it's the one time I ease her off and pop her in basket without waking / winding etc. Survival!!!

Speaking of which bedtime. Night all xo

Just a quick (one-thumb-typing, mid-feed) messae to send and hugs and courage, you're all doing amazingly battling through these tough bits. Some tough choices being made - remember these babies need parents to look after themselves, so take as much help as you can find. The fact you are thinking so much shows what loving mothers you are. Don't forget to love yourselves as well as babies. There are no prizes for martyrdom! It really does get better, just hold on through these bad days. At 5.5 weeks we got a proper smile, which makes up for a lot!

Big hugs, xx

angelico I too am trying to teach babba the difference between night and day... Unsure if its working!!

londonmrs hope all is going well with you! I think it's fab that your DD is latching consistently, even with top ups needed! If DS were doing that it definitely would've encouraged me to keep going a bit longer.

october yeah it's the mismatched/unfulfilled expectation that's the worst, hey? This is not what I thought I would struggle most with in a million years. I would tell a friend in my situation to do exactly what I am doing and switch to formula and move on but it's HUGELY different when it's yourself. Best laid plans of mice & men etc...

Don't know about you but have been googling to find stories of other new mums who have had same experience. A lot of the US ones say that the women pumped exclusively for 6 months to a year???!!!? Eh????? Bloody hell. When do they leave the house????

DS eats like there's no tomorrow and feels like he's putting on lots of weight. Another reason to complete transition to formula pronto.... My boobs and the Medela can't keep up (DH already had to replace some worn-out valves on it last night!)!

Like you I am also thinking of going the whole hog of ditching my principles and trying a dummy! DS was fed 120ml formula at 3am, has been changed, cuddled, offered food again but won't settle! Aargh! Might pick one up at boots today along with some more ready-made Aptamil cartons.... All While paranoidly looking over my shoulder to see the hordes of people who will surely be judging me and screeching "bad mother!!!!"

He also has an eye infection and I have discovered that trying to administer eye drops to a newborn is errr an interesting exercise.

In other sad news I think the greatest parenting invention right now is the wetness indicator on Pampers nappies. Amazing!!!!

Thank you mrsconfusion - the thought of more interaction and smiles from DS is what's keeping me going!!'

DH reckons that newborns are like pet goldfish, a low return on a lot of investment

just a quickie

3rd night in a row baby squid has slept through the night in the moses basket with just one feed between 7pm and 5am

bearing in mind this was a baby who would not be put down for more than 20 minutes previously - or at all, some days - and fed every half hour (still does feed frequently in the day)

I would not let a baby this young "cry it out" and I don't believe it leads them needing to be held indefinitely - no judgement on those who parent differently, we are all different - in my case it seems to have been proven correct

I was initially planning to co-sleep for as long as baby needed the comfort and am surprised that she has made the transition so happily and so early

We are 6 weeks old tomorrow - keep the faith, guys xxx

Babyhoney turned into devil child last night.

londonlivvy
This agency has a good reputation in the south
www.nightnannies.com/
Good luck with finding someone, mummy being happy is the most important thing...sure some extra support will make all the difference x

livvy I have been very shocked at how much I have relied on my mum, she is kind of living with me for the time being (at least until my sis has her baby, any day now!)... but you know it is not normal in most cultures or countries or indeed in our own culture until recently for a couple to bring up a baby alone, it's far more typically a group effort. I asked my mum how things were for her when young, and she said she spent 10 days in hospital (she had an uncomplicated delivery) and then her mum stayed with her for 2 weeks, and then my ddad's mum did for 2 more weeks! That was pretty standard. Modern life has got quite isolating for many.

In many cultures new mothers stay in bed for 40 days with the baby and assorted family do all other chores.

You are completely normal to want an extra pair of hands and it's no kind of failure at all! Good luck with the maternity nurse if that's what you decide.

Hi all,

Things have calmed down a bit in the Cherry household since I gave up all notion of trying to get a bit of a routine going.
Feeding on demand definitely works here. He is a man of simple needs - if he cries he wants boob, be it every half an hour or not. And I'm realising that if that's all I have to complain about, then I'm very lucky. So apologies to all for my earlier stressing.
Already things do seem to be settling in to a bit of a pattern of their own accord, and today we had a 3 hour sleep, which is the longest ever.

With my usual "I know nothing" disclaimer, I couldn't do the crying it out thing. It was bad enough having him cry in my arms, with lots of hugs and soothing, the other day when I was trying to BW. I can't imagine leaving him to cry alone in his cot (that is what that means, right?). For one thing, I do think they're too young to get anything from it at the mo, but mainly for me it just breaks my heart - I'd be a gibbering, sniveling wreck after about 5mins. Not good for Mummy-Morale.

Livvy, I hope you're feeling a bit brighter today. I'm really realising lately how quickly the time is passing, so we will be through the worst of it soon. Perhaps at the moment it's just the dread of DH going back? Once it actually happens, you'll realise it's not so bad and the dreading will be over, so you can relax a bit. I always get that "back-to-work-feeling" after a holiday or something, and it's so miserable and depressing, but a couple of hours into the first day I wonder what all the fuss was about.
And totally reasonable to feel so down about your sis moving so far away, but Skype is great and think of all the lovely holidays you'll have in the future.
I do think you should keep an eye on your feelings though and keep talking about it on here, because it doesn't seem like you. I know I don't really know you, but before you were always so positive and happy.
A maternity nurse sounds like a great idea, will be interesting to hear how you get on with that. Bet she'll give you some great tips that you can then pass on to us

October and Zara, still no question in my mind you're doing the right thing. I hope you can both stop feeling guilty about it soon. If we're not judging you on here, why would anyone else worth worrying about be, either?

Yomping, I would find it hard to feel sympathetic too, in fact I think you did very well not to kick him in the balls and call him a knobber! Seriously, I do feel for the men a little sometimes, because they are a bit like a third wheel and any support available is aimed at us, but perhaps he'd be better to speak to someone other than you about it!

The 3 of us went to the mall today, it was our first proper outing together. It went quite well really, they had great baby facilities and it was nice having DH there too. We didn't stay long, but I'm knackered now! So are the boys it seems, both out for the count.
Bought some cheap jeans and a couple of tops to tide me over, I'm so close (but not close enough) to getting back into my pre-preg stuff that I don't want to spend much, but I was getting desperate. Mind you, it's not like I'm doing anything to get me back into it....

Right, this has gone on long enough and I really should be napping too. Sorry to anyone I missed, and thanks to everyone - it's so nice not to feel alone, and to always get such great advice.

Sorry to hear that Honey.

Springer, they sound amazing!

www.little-sweeties.com/
This agency is also v well regarded in Surrey area, not sure where you are londonlivvy ? I have a couple of nanny friends I've met through DD1, who are lovely and been with this agency for years.

zara sending hugs on the BF front.

I've had an absolute nightmare. LO's latch was iffy to the point my nipples were agony, but also problems with supply (midwives have put that down to body "protecting" itself after the huge blood loss I had, and current anaemia).

Could spend an hour expressing and only get 20-50mls (and most of that just off one working boon), and he was getting fractious and cranky with just BF as not getting enough.

Had to do top up formula feeds in hosp as he was suffering with jaundice and combination of poor supply and uv treatment meant he was becoming dehydrated.

2 weeks on and we've been supplementing near enough every single feed with formula top up to the point where his diet was 90% formula. BF just not coming in, spending all my time spending an hour trying to BF, then an hour trying to express whilst DH gave a formula feed, for LO to take 30 mins to settle to then have a 30min break to myself before we hit the 3 hour mark and it would all start again!

Made the difficult decision to switch entirely to formula - I wasn't enjoying feeding times and given he was already on 90% formula it wasn't much of a wrench.

Still feeling horrendously crap and guilty about it all. Hate that as a mummy I can't do the.natural thing and provide for him, but if he stuck to purely BF he'd be.dehydrated/malnourished and back in hospital and the whole BF/formula top upcombo was testing my sanity. I know overall I've made the right decision but still feel like I'm letting him down.

Here if you want a chat x

Hi everyone! Been a while since I posted! Still not caught up with reading everyone else's news either.
Well Imogen is 3 1/2 weeks and yesterday was our first totally bottle fed day. Bf just didn't work for me so I bit the bullet and thought I should do what makes us both happy. I'm glad I did the first few weeks bf though.
So she's taken to the bottle really well- except she was quite fractious and colicky for about 1 1/2 hours in the evening, but then this is when I would have normally been lying on my dude dozing and bfing her so maybe she was missing it!
She's fab during the day- still at the stage of sleeping and feeding and sometimes having a look round.
Still a Moses basket dodger at night but last night managed 3 hours! Woo!
I think all babies go through a colicky stage don't they? I remember this with my first and it passed after a few weeks or so. I remember using infacol- has anyone else any tips?
Right will carry on reading messages!
Doesn't time fly though?! For those for whom this is their first- cherish every day as I can't believe my eldest is over 2 and this one is nearly a month already and grown out of newborn wear.
Also- I finally got round to plotting her weight and length on the growth charts in the red book. Whereas she's on the 50th centile for weight- she was 57cm long at birth which is above the 99.6 centile! Bonkers! We're both short arses!

Just read your post kyrria- sounds like the right decision to switch to formula. You can jut get on with it now and not worry about your milk issues. It's easy to get into a routine of preparing formula.
How are you doing it? I'm currently preparing the water in the bottles in the morning and if I put them in my packapod bag they stay warm for ages. Might get some of the cartons for out and about though.

october - just catching up and seeing that you've had BF issues too. Know that you're not alone, other people in a similar situation are feeling similarly crappy and guilty and that you need to do what is right for your own sanity.

Here if you want a chat too x

Forgot to say I'm bloody engorged though and keep expressing just enough to make me feel comfortable but bloody hell it's agony!

Hi lizzie

At the moment we're just using the "ready made" stuff as it was easier to prepare (just warm through) when trying to combine with BF/expressing/sterilizing various bits of equipment. Have bought powder but not used yet.

The ready made stuff is easier but more expensive - want to use it in terms of being "out and about" as easier, but need to work out logistics of packing bottles/formula into change bag. Meeting up with one of the girls from my NCT antenatal group today who had similar issues so if I find out any fab tips I'll pass them on x

Morning all,

kyria I had a huge PPH with DD and the only way I could get a decent milk supply was to take drugs to increase it and express 24/7. This Only worked because I was in hospital for 2 weeks and had loads of HCP attention and support. It then led to mastitis repeatedly and thrush. So i think you are probably very wise. Hope you have all managed to pop guilt over bf in a bubble and blown it away. Guilt serves no purpose apart from dragging you down. shut up midget you stupid hippy

Can I just say when I asked if anyone trying to get any routine yet I didn't mean crying out. I think it is dodgy at the best of times but I agree with Angelico that ours are too young either way, Big difference between letting a baby settle itself and crying it out. I do think it is important that they can self soothe and settle - newborns change so much so quickly though, I am just not clear when is the best time to help them do this. Squid hope your sleep thing is here to stay. I remember exactly the same with DD at 6 weeks but alas it did not last - hope you are luckier than me. It did all get easier though but the sleeping through was a flash in the pan for my little one. Not trying to piss on your fireworks just pointing out what we all ready know is that they change all the time. Master midge is suddenly sleeping less - luckily just in the day so far but he is having much more awake time. I prefer it though as he was being a bit boring before (bad mother emoticon )

PIL's here to cuddle and squeeze the baby all day So best get out my PJ's and wipe the cake off my chin.

We are all at the stage where we do what we have to do to get through. Livvy you should totally get some help in. Stop judging yourself so harshly. This is not failure in anyway shape or form. Most people have help in some shape or form - I have no family close and I have thought about it too, ideally so I can also give more time to DD. be really interested to hear how you get on if you do follow it up. Cut yourself some slack though - you need rest too.

Right really must fly, big waves to all.

kyyria sounds like you've had a difficult time Big hug

Elpis keep thinking about your husband saying that you were the one who wanted a second child, as if implying he is your sole responsibility. That made me feel so sad and really cross. Immaculate conception, was it?? Hope he gets a grip soon.

livvy as a fellow no-family-support person /i echo what squid says about looking after babies typically being a team effort. There really is no need to feel that you have to go it alone to "succeed". These early days are about surviving intact. Please get help, and please keep an eye on your mood. Not sleeping when you have the chance can be a sign of PND. Isolation is a Bad Thing. Sorry if I'm coming on too strong but you sound a lot like I felt last time and I hate the thought of anyone going through that.

How long and how do people wind their babies at night? DS is doing fabulously but is a very windy feeder due to his mild tongue tie. Wind builds up over night and by 4am he's in so much pain he can't sleep even though he wants to. I try to get wind up for about 15mins, over my shoulder rubbing and patting but no result at night. Burps fine in the day, just not at night. WTF? Any tips anyone?

I think I'm going to get soneone in to help a couple of hours a day a few days a week as I'm struggling with my 2. When DS2 cries it really unsettles DS1 and he gets super demanding and I struggle not to lose my cool. And endlessly bouncing DS2 while DS1 naps is exhausting

Hello Lizzie and Kyyria! glad you both made the best decision for your situations and your babies re BF - that's what being a great mum is all about, so no guilt needed.

Midget, don't worry, I know you didn't mean crying it out. No self soothing or settling here - I'm hoping it'll happen magically when he gets a bit bigger and isn't so bloody hungry all the time.

Crazy, I think I read somewhere if nothing happens after 5mins of winding, then it's not going to happen. Usually I feed DS lying down with him on his belly on me, then when he starts to scrunch up like he's got something brewing I rub the left side of his back with upward strokes, a la BW. This could be mid feed. But it comes out both ends of him very easily, so not sure how helpful this is.

Does anyone use any cream or lotion on baby? I thought I wasn't supposed to, but DS's skin is so dry and flaky, especially on his legs, feet and ankles and the skin on his chest and belly seems really shiny and tight. It's taking all my willpower not to slather him in moisturiser. Any tips?

cherry I think they advise a tiny bit of olive oil. It's quite common for skin to flake and peel in newborns as they've been in fluid for so long. It goes away by itself if you don't use anything, but I think olive oil is the kindest thing for their skin.

x-post midget and at wiping cake off your chin. Also a big YES to nothing staying the same. For God's sake no-one google 4 month sleep regression

cherry I seem to remember being told olive oil too but forgot that until crazy mentioned so have been using baby lotion or baby oil.

London hard water seems to really dry out master midge.