Totally's postgrads - you know who you are.

[Meita]

Totally's original thread was for TTC after MC. It continued long after Totally herself graduated, and is still going strong. Totally's grads was set up as a thread for pregnancy post MC - i.e. anyone who graduated from Totally's thread and anyone else who had experienced MC and was now pregnant. It, too, is still going strong.

Now, more and more of us have graduated from Totally's grads - including LouiseSH, whose Georgie was born asleep. I suppose that makes us postgrads. We have travelled together for a long time and would like to stay in touch, but the pregnancy post MC thread is starting to get very big, and I think it should be allowed to keep its focus on pregnancy post MC. May it be as wonderful a place for support for current "members" as it was for us.

So this thread is a place for us to keep in touch, share experiences, and provide support.

(This is the first time ever I'm starting a thread - hope it works out...)

Hi dorcas and hi officially to everyone else! I've got my cap, gown and degree so ready to be a post grad now...

dorcas hopefully one of the other ladies will be along to help you out I think alba has been doing mixed feeds. It does really hurt sometimes - thinking back to ds1 I tried nipple shields which helped a bit, also rubbing milk on your nipples after feeding can help heal them. Just do what feels right for you xxx

I am leaving hospital today with low bp, iron count of 8,

Contact dermatitis on my legs from dvt boots and open sore from wound dressing- looking good....!! Seriously though, am moving around far better and with less pain so am pretty pleased with how I'm doing, although that may change when I've had to walk to the car park

Toby is doing well- we have to come back for a hip scan due to family history and he has an undescended testicle which will be monitored. Last night he figured out that sleeping on me with a boob in his mouth is far preferable to his cot, I'm so glad I read all your experiences because I've been able to just let him snooze feed and cuddle - my sleep will come later!

Hi Clare and Dorcas, great to see you both over here!

Clare you sound so upbeat and positive despite all the aftermath of CS, if I had iron count of 8 I don't think I could stand up, even down to 10 mid-pregnancy floored me. Hope it's back up to normal soon and you recover quickly.
My little one had an undescended testicle at birth, a few days later DH and I could both see two when changing nappies and midwife confirmed all fine next time she visited. I understand it's very common, and most likely all will be well very soon. Hope it's the case for Toby.

Dorcas I feel for you with the feeding. Despite a very easy, drug free birth, establishing feeding was very hard work for me. I had problems with DS1 too, unfortunately he was only 5lb 13oz at birth and once he started losing weight, it wasn't long before we had to switch completely to bottles, I was in absolute agony, despite midwives saying latch was good, severely cracked and bleeding nipples... far worse than labour.

This time I knew before I started I was going to need help. A post-natal doula, with BF experience who can stay with you longer than a short midwife visit, watch you feeding and help with hints and tips can make a huge difference, as can a fully qualified lactation consultant. Very small changes to how you latch on can make huge differences to your feeding. As can the confidence and knowledge to let you know what will work and what's right and what isn't. To find a lactation consultant try here. It made a huge difference for me, the lactation consultant I saw is incredibly well respected locally, my midwife suggested how to help with weightloss, but wanted to know what the lactation consultant said first to be sure we were doing the best possible.
My latch wasn't bad, but I have a baby who rather likes using me as a dummy, rather than feeding well, and tends to change his latch as the feed goes on, so taking him off as soon as it felt wrong and re-latching helped a lot, as did breast compressions, to stop him nibbling and get him sucking again (try Dr Jack Newman's website for details and even video here)
I started expressing pretty early on to up my supply. I was feeding (rugby ball hold my doula had taught me) and expressing at the same time, baby one side, pump the other. Then feeding the expressed milk rather than wasting it... at about 10 days old, with a decent latch, we had no issues with nipple confusion and I'm pretty happy now that we can use either if needed. DH went out and bought me an electric pump, I've no idea which make is best, but he looked them up on the boots website and chose the one with the best customer feedback, and it's working well for me.
I was advised (after more than a pound weight loss at 2 weeks old - thankfully at 8lb 10oz birthweight it wasn't so bad to drop to seven and a half) to start one formula feed a day, which I'm still doing. Only half a little carton of ready mix so it's not much, but has the added benefit of helping night-time sleep for me. Might wean off it now weight gain is on track, then again.... it's nice for DH to do one feed, and nice for me to have a bit of a rest and more sleep. Initially I expressed at the same time so my supply didn't drop, but now it goes down fast mid-evening cluster feeding so I have no time to express as he's back to me again right afterwards.

Hard to say what will work best for you. I did take painkillers to help me get over one crack that was a bit sore (ibuprofen -- I read you shouldn't take whilst breastfeeding, but occasional use I'm told is ok). Also Lansinoh, amazing stuff. I used it after every feed initially (possibly just mentally for me to feel I was doing something to try to avoid the awful cracks I got last time) - now I just put loads on breastpads when I get dressed in the morning (last time they stuck to me once and did a LOT of damage, so again it's just preventative and for my own peace of mind). The crack I have fed through, it healed from the inside out and is fine now. Still have issues at the end of feeds when he starts trying to nibble/chew, so I'm still having to stay disciplined taking him off and putting him back on properly, but other than that, it's a breeze. And we've mastered feeding with me lying on my side at night too which is so much more relaxing than making up bottles in the middle of the night as I did with DS1.

At 2 weeks old, we'd lost 1lb 2oz, since then, gaining at steady 5-6oz per week. Weighing again at 5 weeks old on Monday and at the rate we've been going we should be back up to birthweight, just. But more importantly now, it's just how much we've gained since last time, we're tracking nicely just below the 25th centile line, so despite 75th centile at birth, we're gaining at a healthy rate so it's all good.

Very best of luck, and try to get all the help you can get.

Just bookmarking as had lost you guys - will try to get back later, waves to all xx

Alba thank you so much for your advice, it made me a little teary with gratitude that you went to the trouble to write such a long reply. I think my LO is also one who likes to use my nipple as a comforting thing to suck on, not just a source of food. I fed her half an hour ago and am sure I got the latch right this time as no pain, but she drifts off after ten minutes. I'm so worried that she isn't getting enough food, and very frustrated by the fact that she won't stay awake long enough when I do get her latched on. They should be on for at least twenty minutes shouldn't they? I feel terrible that we had to take her back to hospital and also that all this week she hasn't been getting enough food because I've had the latch wrong, I'm so afraid I'm still not feeding her enough.
I'll have a look at the website you suggested thanks and look into a breast pump. It is good to hear that you switched between bottle and breast without any problems. Every time I consider it I keep hearing in my head all these dire predictions about ruining my chances of breastfeeding. Will get some Lansinoh too. I saw a breastfeeding counsellor at the hospital on Friday who did help improve my latch a bit, although still not there yet, she said I could call her back tomorrow so will do that and also look into a lactation consultant.
It is all a lot harder than I imagined it would be- they made it sound so easy at the NCT breastfeeding clinic. Feel a bit stupid that I am getting it wrong!

Hi clareanna, lovely to be graduating over here with you. We went from the conception thread to the pregnancy thread at about the same time and now we are here! Sometimes I still can't believe it. Glad you are feeling relatively well- you are doing amazingly well with that low an iron count!

Hi unbuffy and everyone else.

Hi Dorcas, Alba's advice was brilliant, I thought I'd add a few bits from my experience too. Nipple shields can be a life saver when really sore and will give you a chance to heal. They appear massive when you try to latch baby on but work well. Feeding might take a bit longer though. I understand they're not to be depended upon permanently but I used them for five days and was fine going back to breast. Also check to see if baby has thrush as you will have symptoms too. Look inside her mouth and check the sides of the cheeks and tongue for white patches. Some tongue whiteness is normal but the combination of the two could be thrush. For you, thrush will make your nipples bright pink and really sore. Mine felt a bit itchy too and at the peak of our thrush my nipples peeled. thrush needs treatment and you'd need to see your gp - I have much experience and can offer further advice if you need it. It terms of length of times for feeds I don't think there are any hard and fast rules. If she nods off after 10 minutes it might be that she has had enough in that time. Ruby wanted to comfort suck so we use a dummy which she is happy with. To encourage 'good' feeding I fed no more frequently than every one and a half hours - it prevented me getting overly sore. If your baby is gaining weight then regardless of the length of feed she will be getting enough. Hope you are having a good day, waves to everyone else, SB x

Dorcas, I couldn't not do my best to help you, I know how hard it is, both the pain and the heart wrenching feeling of thinking you're failing your child. You're not, you're doing the very best you can for her. Good to hear you've had some pain free feeding. Dropping off whilst feeding, either they've had enough or (as was my case) they're just too tired to feed. This is where the expressing helped, it emptied my breasts to up supply/stop any chance of blocked ducts, which I got more than once, ouch, but also it meant I could rapidly tip the extra down him by bottle to give him an energy boost to get us back on track. And it seems it worked. The other tactic was after he dropped off to do a quick nappy change to wake him up before offering the other side.

I'm trying to remember any other useful tips, if Lia pops in I'm sure she'll add anything I forgot. It was a tough first few weeks and it's a little hazy to remember what we did when.

Don't whatever you do think you're a failure. It's a tricky thing to get established and so many of us have a hard time to start with. I remember NCT classes and being told everyone can breastfeed like it's the easiest thing in the world (imagine my feelings of total inadequacy when I had to stop!). It's not the easiest thing and you are not in any way a failure, please try to be kind to yourself and rest as much as you possibly can because it's bloody hard work!

Welcome dorcas and clare, lovely to see you both on this side.

Sounds tough clare so well done on being so chirpy, I'm amazed!

Sorry you've been having a tough time feeding dorcas, and alba the more I read about the issues you've had the more I think you should be so proud of yourself. I can't provide lots of help as I've been really lucky with BF, but I did have issues with Jemima falling asleep during feeds and nappy changing definitely helps. Other things that cool her down like undressing her, burping her, swapping boobs all help too. If you scroll up to the 30th Jan on this thread you'll see all the helpful advice given to me at the time.

You have however unknowingly added to my "lies they tell you" list, although actually it's just a thing that's not mentioned rather than a specific lie...

4. You will also give birth to a pile, possibly the size of a conker, and when your DH has to help you in the shower after labour and is washing the blood off your legs, he will undoubtedly cop an eyefull of the big gross appendage attached to your bum. This will upset you more than being stitched back together.

Speaking of which...

5. You won't even notice being stitched up because you'll be so happy to have your baby. Erm... when the bitch doctor doesn't give you enough local and you can feel every thread pulling through, the last thing on your mind is the baby they've taken off you to check over.

So onto serious things... we had a rubbish night on Friday night, refusing to sleep for more than an hour at a time and that carried on through Saturday. But then last night she went down at 11.45 and wasn't up until 3.45... that's 4 whole hours of sleep, in one go, it's the most I've had since she was born and I felt amazing this morning.

But now this evening we're on another wailfest... and I've resorted to sterilising the dummy. It looks so horrible in her mouth, but she's quiet for the first time all evening. I feel terrible.

Now, my question is this. I've been given a routine book. It again talks about how babies up to six weeks can't stay awake for longer than an hour and a half, and how babies like routine, and if you feed them all the time and hold them til they sleep you'll never teach them to settle on their own. This has been given to me by a friend whose opinion I trust and who has a lovely 9mo. She says all her friends swear by it.

I started reading it and I just don't know how I feel. In RL (i.e. before DD) I was quite a control freak routiney person, and I do want her into a routine at some point, because lets face it sleep is pretty vital and I'll have to go back to work one day. So it's left me all confused. I know MN in general is a baby led kind of place, and I have been converted, because she's tiny and needs to know I'm there for her, but on the other hand I can see that rushing to feed her every time she whimpers may not be a good habit to get into.

Help me... what is the answer? When have/do you plan to start routines? What else can I do to get her to sleep without feeding her (it's taking its toll on my nips)? When she's wailing is it true she's overtired because she's been awake for more than the possible hour and a half? And how do I solve that issue?

I'm at a bit of a loss today, as you can probably tell. Any advice gratefully received, because I don't think we can manage every other night being wailtastic. Thanks all!!

Bloody hell... if you manage to read all that and still give me advice I'll have to write to MN and ask them to make a little medal emoticon for you!

TMT my personal opinion is that you will know when the time is right to start routines.

We started a bedtime routine at about 14 weeks. Ianto took to it very quickly and I never regretted a) starting late with the routine, nor b) starting with the routine when I did.

With the feeding, I think my huge mistake in the beginning was to think 'he can't be hungry already' and ergo not feed him when he showed signs of being hungry. It took us ages to recover from the damage and we only held on to BF by bare shreds. I think a feeding routine is fine if your baby is happy with it, but trying to force a routine on a unhappy baby is pointless and will just lead to trouble and tension.

My clever book, btw, says that most babies develop routines by themselves. Only a few babies have trouble with that and need a little help. Those that do need the help, it would be cruel not to give them what they need - but over all, trust your instincts and if you feel your little one is doing alright, why change things?

(btw our bedtime routine is: feed, nappy change, put on pyjama i.e. sleeping gown i.e. clothes that he never wears during the day, put into bedside cot, lie down next to him, read story i.e. look at a soft book together, while music box plays, sing two bedtime songs each four times (that's just how it works out), lie there quietly for a little bit and leave. He's usually asleep after 10 minutes of lying in the cot.)
It's quite stunning to see how he settles and calms down, even from very excited, when he realises what is happening. That's the good thing about routines. Baby then knows what's happening and what will be next and thus gets into the right mindset.

ok need to go, eyes dropping closed...

(oh btw had a lovely birthday today :) Ianto was a dream, just right for the day!)

Yes that's what I need, talk to me about your experience and decisions about routines, ignore my list of questions and I will step away from the panic-inducing book.

You are the only group of people who aren't utterly open mouthed when I describe our nights (last night we did 11.00, 1.15, 3.45, 5.40 & 7.30) everyone else, regardless of age, looks at me like I'm mad.

Thank you so much for talking to me meita, happy belated birthday..

Toomt with ds1 I was desperate for a sense of routine and control so tried it from about 3 weeks- which was terrible timing as He had a massive growth spurt and I felt like a complete failure!! We did eventually get into a routine but mainly because he started doing it and I picked up the signs.
As meita says, it can help to start with bedtime rituals, quiet time, bath, book/ singing and bed. However if your dd is then just really awake you can't force her to sleep so if she's not settling pick her up but keep it quite quiet and relaxed etc. I also found blackoutblinds for naps helpful, but certainly didn't stay in the house so he only napped in his cot!! Keep doing the brilliant Job you're doing, try to keep a note of feed times and slowly you'll see the gaps in between lengthen a bit. I found a book called your baby week by week by Simone cave and dr Caroline fertleman really sensible.

alba my food friends mr codeine and mr dicolfenac have been helping me through! Got home last night and had a good night, my milk came in just in time, and whilst sporting a pair of that Pamela would be proud of, its nothing like the wild times I had with ds1 milk didn't come in for 5 days and when it did was shooting all over the place, drenched clothes etc!! Toby therefore got plenty of food just when he needed it, so slept well. I feel like I've been run over and will be staying in bed today!!

Routine??? Whatever the baby dictates here... Though with DS1 it kind of evolved as things started to happen at the same time every day. But in the early weeks I remember whenever we thought we'd got some order going it would all change again...

Celebrating today. One ounce above birthweight! (7oz weekly gain) Hurrah! Now I'm going to give up weighing for a while...

How's your daughter's foot Sam?

Dorcas, hope your bf counsellor helped you today and you're feeling a bit brighter

Unbuffy how are you doing? Did you manage those 3 things a day to cheer you up?

Meita how are you doing with Childcare/back to work decisions?

Clare hope you're getting some good rest to recover, lucky you if feeding good, is it true that well fed babies sleep better?

Gilda, RHG, Happy, Sparkly, Malteser, Zayja, Lee and everyone else, hope you're sleeping well and not too knackered... Where's GLB? did she ever find us here? And bunnybaby?

Big hug for Louise

huge apologies to anyone I missed...

TooMuch - I have found with my three that routine develops in it's own good time. You are already building in little snippets of pattern into you baby's day without thinking of it: you probably get up at about the same time each day, potter around at home and go to the shops or for coffee. These things sort of frame the day and are the routine. As babies get older the routine begins to develop. Recently Ruby's sleeping pattern has become more similar each day and she seems to know that bed follows on from bath. Remember too that by the time you go back to work you will be well underway with weening and those mealtime give structure too. My advice would be to loosely structure your activities and that will help your baby to find her own routine. We very much go with the flow here and it does just fall into place. In my experience you can 'get' a baby to have set routine but it's a bit of a battle which isn't enjoyable for anyone concerned. Ultimately you'll end up with a similar result by letting it happen naturally. I find meeting with my ante natal group tricky on this front actually. One lady has read all the books and is always dishing out advice on how to get you baby to do this and that. It drives me doolalay and causes the other ladies to worry because they feel they are doing it 'wrong'. Of course they're not in any way. I'm going on a bit, sorry. It is the middle of the night!!!

Thank you for seeing me through another panic, and there was me thinking it would be better after she arrived. The worry never stops. She's got a blocked nose so I'm off to boots for suggestions.

Dorcas any improvement with BF? I hope you're getting good support.

Great news on the weight gain Alba, hopefully you can relax a bit now.

Have you been to the nursery Meita? How are you feeling about it?

Clare I hope the pammies are settling and feeding is going well, and that you managed to take it easy.

Hello everyone I've missed.

X posts SamB, thank you, it's so good hearing your experiences. It's just so easy for people to make you feel like you're getting it totally wrong, probably unintentionally. And it's weird because I'm normally pretty confident in myself, I guess motherhood brings more changes than just the nappy variety.

Now lying here listening to snorey DD :(

toomt hope you managed to get some sleep - it's horrid when they are snuffling - let us know what the man from Boots says! DS1 has a suspicious sounding cough at the moment so I'm bracing myself that it won't be long before DS2 gets his first cold.

Day 5 for me today - let the weeping commence!
Feeling very sore today, scar is managing to be itchy, numb and burning at the same time. Get my staples out today, which should help and find out how much DS2 weighs etc. I think he looks a little bit yellow this morning, so may be a touch jaundiced, hopefully now my milk's come in that will help - there isn't much sunshine around to stick him in!

Belated Happy Birthday Meita!!!

Hi, sorry, not had a chance to post recently. Its been an up and down few days. Had some good feeds on Sunday then mid evening onwards it all seemed to got to pot, resulting in me sobbing intermittently all night and not getting her off to sleep until 4am. But we saw the bf counsellor yesterday which helped and I've been to a bf clinic today and feel better. Thanks again for all your advice alba, samB and tmt, it is a massive help. I was feeling pretty low yesterday but she was weighed by the midwife and is back to her birth weight which cheered me up. I must be getting something right! Now I just need my poor nipples to heal up.
Hope everyone else is ok. clareanna that sounds really painful, hope you are getting plenty of rest.
tmt I'm dreading DD getting her first cold, I'm ultra paranoid enough about her breathing and keep prodding and poking her to make sure she is ok. I'll never be able to sleep if she has a blocked nose!
alba that's great she is now above birthweight. I never knew weighing babies could have you so anxious until yesterday- it felt like waiting for an exam result!
meita, belated happy birthday!

Hello from snuffle towers... still snorey here, bless her (and me) I got some saline spray yesterday, you're not allowed anything else under 3months, although I have got some menthol on a tissue in the room, I don't see how that can be so bad. She seems ok, she's sleeping as ever, it just takes even longer for her to drop off. The worst though is when she does the horrible choking thing as it drips down her throat, that's really scary!

Congrats on the weight gain dorcas, brilliant news, you're definitely getting something right.

Grrr... she's just gone off and DH's alarm is going off, doesn't bother her, just me.

TooMuch we also had the choking on phlem thing - yuk! We bought baby vabourub stuff and disolved it it water, then sat Ruby near it. That really helped. We also put her in the bouncing chair in the bathroom with the shower on. The steam really helps too. Bear in mind too that at 4 weeks a single dose of Calpol is ok as you can use it after the jabs. Ruby wasn't three months either but we did use Calpol at night when she got really distressed. We found that the crying created more phlegm and the situation got worse so preventing crying was important. Calpol really worked so she may have had a headache or it nay have just made her drowsy. I also kept holding her upright for a few days as lying down made it all worse too. We were delighted when she got better!

Hello ladies

I'm afraid I need to pick your brains. I'm having boob issues - when I wake up in the morning my left boob is ginormous although not hot nor painful and fine for feeding. The right is minute by comparison. Although I haven't been aware of it I may have been favouring my left over my right (hence the obviously heightened supply). I'm horrendously lopsided - what do I do about it? How do I increase the milk in my right boob?

Apologies for the mememe post. I have been trying to keep up but not very regularly. Will try harder in the future. Big welcome to dorcas and clareanna. Congratulations to both of you!

Red simple solution - swap one of your boobs with me, my right is ginormo-boob! Between us we have two perfect pairs!

Actually balanced at the mo thanks to the cabbage which brought instant relief from the discomfort, and seems to have helped slow down over production. Was oO on Saturday and back to oo now so did not take long to sort out.

As well as cold green cabbage leaf in bra, tried to feed and express prioritising the smaller boob to encourage more milk, and just enough from the larger to keep it comfortable. These are novice comments though, I got great advice from the ladies here with more experience am sure you will get further info. Just want you to know that you are not alone and that it is curable!

Also I had fast / strong let down on the problem side (because so full?) so DS was pursing lips on the problem nip to slow down intake which was making it sore. Now if he starts doing that I try to re-latch or if he still does it, take him off, express a bit first then put him back, then we get a comfortable feed for us both.

Right, I was all prepared for a good catch up but we have just had a mega poonami by the sounds of it off to mop up!!

Waves to all!

A quick hello :)
Congrats and welcome Dorcas and ClareA!

TMT and anyone struggling with blocked noses, we got a humidifier for the bedroom, worked wonders. Same effect as having baby in steamy bathroom, but all night long.

Dorcas I think you are doing just fine! The only thing lacking, perhaps, is... confidence. :) Trust your instincts, go with the flow, don't let anyone's stories put you off what feels right to you.

Thanks for the birthday wishes - was really a good one.

Louise I think Georgie's remembrance book is such a good idea, it makes me really glad that little Georgie is doing so much good. A big hug to you, and I'll be waiting for the news that GBOS is on the way.

Nursery news - we're going to visit tomorrow. Meanwhile we have done some research and have visited a local nursery this afternoon, looks great and they have places available to suit our needs, only problem really is that they are more than twice as expensive as my uni nursery where I get reduced 'student' rates. Also have begun looking around for childminders and are in touch with a few that look promising, so we definitely won't put Ianto into my uni's nursery for the only reason that we'd be worried not to find anywhere else. Um... that's a bit muddled but I hope you know what I mean

Will be very busy for the rest of the week (have been for the first part of it too!) as Ianto is being christened on Sunday and we have family and godparents-to-be descending on us... need to get that house into decency.

Evening all - lol at the Oo issues! Looks like an unfinished boob job doesn't it? Gi1da glad to hear yours are back on track - rhg hope your lefty settles down soon. I second what g says favour the right over the left and express a bit from left for comfort abscond a smile on the green grocers face!!

We are doing well - Toby only lost 5oz and is a little bit jaundiced so we went for our first walk today (hobble for me) round to my aunts house. This major expedition wore us both out and we had a 3 hour power nap to recover. Hope I didn't push it too much though. Ds1 held him for the first time this morning which was very cute, and apart from saying "no" to practically everything you ask/tell him, is being very sweet with baby brother.

alba glad to hear your ds has got back above birth weight- well done for getting him there!

meita glad you've got the research underway pm nursery- did the uni nursery tell you what its plan was post ofsted? Can you get childcare vouchers as well? They really help, think the cut off is 6 April for current scheme.

Thanks for the advice ladies (and the offer Gilda - chortle!). Thankfully the left boob has settled down a little and we're beginning to even up. I'm still going to press ahead and favour the right for a while though.

Clareanna - sounds like you're doing really well. When I first ventured out of the house after my section just walking 200m almost finished me off. At the risk of sounding like your mother - don't overdo it.

Taking on board all your comments re colds/blocked noses. My DH woke up with a cold so I'm doing my research now for when Cecily and I inevitably go down with it.

Hope you're feeling happier Dorcas - hang in there, things will work out.

And Meita - hope the nursery quandary resolves. Personally I think you're right to look into other options and don't feel pushed to put Ianto into nursery unless you're ready to go back to work.

Waves to all!

Thanks rhg I'm staying firmly on the sofa today! Very difficult to work out what the balance is between doing too much and not enough iykwim. Think the walk was pushing it a bit though!! Shock horror- have run out of paracetamol- aaargh dh gone on emergency buying mission to restock for my 8 a day habit!!!