im so anxious about threats to cut ctc...

[em83]

god i feel so depressed about the threatened cut to ctc, i have been following the news religiously about this new emergency budget, and have just read an updat which was posted tonigha 22.10 which states that incomes £30.000 or over will not be entitled to ctc

im so pissed off with this and feel so anxious

I know what you mean. It all feels so bleak at the moment.

CTC is currently calcuated on net income ie. after childcare costs to be taken into account. If your net income is over £30k then you arguably don't need the £40-ish a month you currently get from CTC. If your net income is under £30k then you probably won't see much of a difference to what you currently get.

There is a flip-side, of course. The Tories were quite keen on reintroducing married couples' tax allowances and the Lib Dems wanted to raise the threshold for paying any tax at all to £10,000. If you qualify for either of those you could claw back some of the £40/month lost.

well i really honestly dont know how they think people are going to survive imo £30.000 is not a fabulous income so how can they class it as a middle class income...
after bills,rent,childminder fees,school dinners,etc we are left with not much

chilli so ctc is awarded once you have taken your childcare off your income? because when i phone up for renewal they only as my annual gross income and dh annual gross income, nothing is mentioned about net income...

the lower earners will be the ones to pay, if you're still lucky to have a job this time next year.

If you have several children you could still get hundreds a month at 30,000 and higher. I read that they want to cut it from 24K. Surely it is wrong when people are relying on it for childcare etc to just cut it. Gradual withdrawel would be better. It's scary that some people have used tax credits for mortgages etc..

They should abolish CTC altogether. The State has no place in subsidising children. If people can't afford to raise their children without recourse to pther people's money, they shouldn't have them, in my opinion.

it may be offset with a rise in the income tax threshold but we'll have to wait and see

"they only as my annual gross income and dh annual gross income"

Childcare is taken into account. This online CTC calculator would be a useful way of working out what you're entitled to.

Barmy Army, the whole point of Tax Credits was to reduce the amount of child poverty. It is not a child's fault that their parents are not well off enough to afford to feed, clothe and house them without help.

Unless you are intending to police who has children based on people's ability to afford them, then I'm afraid your argument is flawed. The simple fact is that people have children and we should not and can not put controls on that. We do, however, have a duty to ensure that those children have a decent standard of living and are not victims of their circumstances. That is why we have tax credits. It is an imperfect system, but it's all we have.

"we should not and can not put controls on that."

That's different from saying we shouldn't support children. Families that are self-sufficient regulate how many children they have based, in part, on how many they can afford. Families who rely on external support should be encouraged to exercise similar restraint in the number they produce. Contraception is free and freely available, after all. The CB is already less for Child #2 than it is for Child #1 and there is a popular argument to say it should not apply to Child #3.

So excuse me if I am being thick here but according to the news today it is anything from 25k to 30k that families could lose £545 a year in tax credits . If it was any income over 25k my joint income is 26k a year out of that I pay 3000 in tax and NI is 1700 a year, my tax credit that I get is 4100 a year (3 children), so would I just lose the £545 a year or would I lose the lot. If I lose the lot then the government is wrong in quoting that families would lose up to £545 a year as obviously there will be a lot of people earning under 30k a year with more than one child.

This makes me really angry as they are just screwing us left right and centre, with the increase in NI, Possible VAT, Petrol, and then just for fun lets take tax credits away from all those that work. My husband said that after Tuesday he will think about if it is worth him working anylonger or just be a stay at home househusband

tink was this just on news today, as i havnt heard anything of just losing £545 a year?
what about people who earn over £30000? but under £35000 ?

'The State has no place in subsidising children'
Barmyarmy Do you claim child benefit?

tink I wondered that too. If you have more than 3 kids, you could get quite a lot weekly at 25-35K. Will they scrap just the family element or all elements? Eventually, i think they will scrap the whole scheme.

Families in the middle will be shafted though. Some people will just drop their hours so they get under the threshold.

It is being scrapped for over 25k i think

so what are families meant to do who get over £25000? stop work and claim benefits?
imo they are all for helping the non working folk !!!

thing is this is all speculation.

And the reality is that the previous government created a culture that was dependent on the state when the state couldn't afford to maintain it in the long-term.

I cannot believe that the government would suddenly cut (possibly) thousands of pounds from a family's income.

Regardless of whether you think CTC/WTC is a reasonable system or not, the government would be mad to remove that income overnight. Families would be plunged into financial dire straits.

As I understand it (from MN), many, many families on £25,000 and over receive thousands of pounds each year.

I do not receive any CTC/WTC, but I could not take a hit of thousands of pounds on my expected income.

Even the most gung-ho cutting government couldn't do this. Surely? Perhaps they will phase them out over the course of this parliament? I hope that is the intention.

It would be perverse in the extreme if I (mid-rate tax payer) wound up less badly hit by the cuts, etc., than a family on less! Yet, that looks likely to be the case: yes, I'll be hit by employees' & employers' NI rise (though this may be offset by other changes, as I understand it); yes, I'll be hit by 20% VAT; etc. But everyone suffers those increases. I don't receive any other benefits (and don't claim CB), so I won't miss them.

I'm afraid that it does make it seem as though the ConDem government is protecting - consciously or not - the better off (though perhaps not the super-rich, who are paying 50% plus on their income over 150K).

I wait to be corrected on Tuesday, of course.

The quote on families losing just £545 a year is on the front of the papers the Daily express is the main one, but is is also quoted on Daily Mail online although last night it did state those that earn't over 30k a year but by this morning had been revised to 25k.

I agree that people will drop to just below the 25k mark as my husband has already said he will do this but to be honest is it really worth it.

You can email George Osborne and Danny Alexander here to complain about the planned cuts to the Child Trust Fund here: www.davidmiliband.net/broken-promises/

Being self employed it has proved a nightmare for HMRC to calculate what we are owed and we have ended up being overpaid one year and getting next to nothing the following year. If you've ever had to deal with HMRC on the phone about tax credits you'll know how soul destroying it can be. It's a nice idea if everyone has a steady salary, but practically, it just doesn't work and the admin involved in trying to make it work must be costing the country a fortune. It was doomed once they took away the online application system I reckon. I'd be glad to see the back of it and have it replaced with some simple payment to those who need it most.

Yes some people could loose thousands. Say they are on 25K with 4 kids, they could loose hundreds a month (thousands a year). If they cut it overnight then alot of people will be up shit creek. Especially if they are not starting the 10K tax right away...

Also, if the system remains as it is, a family right before the cut off with 3/4 kids will be getting thousands a year yet when they hit the cutoff will loose it all. Surely people will just cut their hours etc. It seems abit silly unless it is lost gradually like it is now in which case they would need to go further than 25K to start the withdrawels.

So people who are still poor even though they work hard should not be allowed to have children because they are a drain on the state?

Which, if you follow that argument to its conclusion means that only well off people should have children, creating a super, well-off middle class and above race.

Crikey. How fascist can you get?

Also, it depends whether they mean just the family element of tax credits (£545 a year up to £50K+) or the entire tax credit where the family element is phased out around £25-40K depending how many kids you have. That is worth £2000 ish per child a year. So several kids at the lower end and you loose far more than £545. Then, people may think they are better off on lower income and get free school meals, tax credits etc...

If they do scrap it, then gradual reduction is the only fair way. It is obvious that people will be relying on what they have had for the last few years.