Dave's cuts are going be deep and they will hurt

[FellatioNelson]

I've been hearing this all day on the radio. I can't take the suspense any longer. They are going to affect the lives of 'every one of us'

I feel like a person wincing and clenching my teeth in anticipation of the big fuck-off needle the school nurse is wielding, and I'm next in the queue....

Come on then, what's it going to be?

wubblybubbly - I am not sure why you would put VAT on private school fees. First let me declare an interest here- I have 2 DC at private school.

But what I mean is that if you taxed us out of the private school, then it would cost the state much to educate that child in the state sector?! You would have to increase the number of state places. Given that we pay for private school fees out of taxed income and that we also have to pay for a few scholarships of children who can't afford the fees then I don't see that it is good policy in any way? Or am I missing something?

May be they should just abolish all private schools. I would go for that one actually...

Gosh Mama, so cross you had to say it twice!

Do what you like with your own child, just don't try to pretend you are doing the rest of us any favours. We all pay taxes. (Even people whose earnings are too low to pay income tax, you know.)

Cheers edam.

I find it interesting that when those at the lower end of society express concern over the impact of cuts and revenue raising plans, they're told we all have to take the hit.

When it's suggested that those at the other end might also need to up their contribution slightly, it's met with gasps of incredulity.

i don't think that they should keep child benefit for people who can afford private school fees and at the same time cut free school meals, though?

Thanks Tdiddy, I see what you are saying, people will still have to buy food, but they will buy cheap food, so that is ok?

yes, tesco did do well in hard times. I also happen to know someone who works for them and it has not been plain sailing for him during that same time despite the huge profits. and it makes it clear to me and him...that no wonder they still made a profit.

what about other companies though? small business? lots of companies cannot afford to make it/sell it for less. these people will loose jobs won't they and we will be paying for them to stay at home.

going off the subject a little, also if companies are forced into a position of making cheaper goods, they definately won't be made in the Uk and poorer countries will be working for even less [child labour increases, even more farmers in poverty etc]. so globally ?

I still think 3 years pay freeze is a bit steep for normal everyday public sector workers.

lego- I am just saying that it is better to spread the pain over a large number of people and over a reasonable period of time that shock us into a depression

ok.
are they really cutting free school meals?

Wubby any business will tell you for every pound they spend they have to earn three, so for every local authority place not being paid for by your council they are saving £9,000. To look at as just 7% of children being privately educated is too simplistic.
We're not in the higher tax bracket so if you hit us with 20% VAT it's game over and all 4 of ours would have transfer back into the state sector because I won't do for 1 child what I can't do for all and we are heavily subsidized by our private school.

good post earlier in the discussion:

"The thing I don't understand is the £billions they pumped into Northern Rock, RBS and Lloyds TSB must be making them money now and is clearly an investment that they can recoup. As this money was one of the main causes of the rise in our debt to 60%ish of GDP - why isn't George O letting us know how much that is worth and when we will get it back?"

Yes I agree, this is THE reason why we have such a large deficit. I think the Cons are using it as a convenient excuse for scaremongering to get their most unequal/unfair policies through. Also why dont they take some control of the banks, when we own them??? have never heard of people getting massive bonuses when their company was on the brink of collapse.

I don't think they are planning on cutting school meals, just not rolling out the extension that was planned. I could be wrong.

Sessypoos - non non non non, if the sell RBS and Lloyds now they make a few BN profit. see here

If they wait a couple of years it could be 100BN or more profit..I have done the numbers of where the share price needs to get to/likely to get to . Would be silly for the GOvt to sell now, wait a few years and they will make a massive massive profit (hundreds of BN as opposed to a few BN)

cut the money given to the royal family?

Mamatomany, we're all having to tighen our belts. I honestly wish I had the option of saving £12k plus a year!

But to be honest, there's no point in getting worked up about it, you're not going to have to make that decision.

ooh alirosie, I hadn't even thought of that one!

Once again though, we'll be told that they're actually very good value for money and in fact doing us an enormous favour by taking a large chunk of the public purse.

Bless 'em.

not sure awhether Royal family is a big ticket item? Let's think big here

We also need to invest in the right sector so that we put the economy right structurally. Good time to invest long term..got to find the cash to invest in sustainable technology or whatever new industry..room for a little Keynesian pocket...even as Friedman marches on to the stage

If any schools need closing down, it is grammar schools [imo].

• I don't mind what they shut...I just want my DC to have a shot at the most suitable AVAILABLE option if i can afford it...tis my duty.

Tdiddy - interesting article, sounds good but arent we receiving dividends already from the banks, as they are now in profit? wonder how much that is..

If our credit rating is downgraded, as
this article suggests, then the rise in the cost of servicing our debt might make it wise to reduce it earlier? selling a few of our bank shares which are now at a profit seems like a pretty painless way of doing it.

Ooh I like the royal family idea! heard queenie complaining that she hadnt had a pay rise for the last 5 years (poor lass), but dont they have loads of land and assets? She'll probably moan about how many parties public engagements she has to go to, but we're all in this together right?
I think they should get off their bums and work for a living, the lazy scroungers.

What's wrong with grammar schools? Don't they give kids from poor homes opportunities for social mobility?

Anyhoo, off topic...

I am nervous about the cuts, not so much because of how they will affect me, but because politicians don't have a great record of carefully thinking through the consequences of changes in policy or tax. They are going to need to be so careful that the tax increases they bring in don't make people change their behaviour and lower the tax revenue they receive. I'd like to see VAT rise on luxury goods because no one will suffer for not owning these goods, but if it stops everyone spending, it could put lots of firms that sell such goods and alied businesses out of business.

Ooh, found some lovely quotes by David Dorling:

"The poor in particular are now subject to widespread prejudice whereby, it is nastily and quietly said, they must have something wrong with them if they are not able to work their way out of poverty. In the end the rich [and sakura would class anyone who can afford private education as rich] have to believe there is something wrong with other people..."

"If you point to societies that are more equalin Japan, in most of Western and Northern Europe, even in Canadaand show the outcomes to be better, they may suggest that those societies are more equal due to special historic circumstances...but all that is required is a sinificant land value tax...."

"...there are no beneficial side effects of one man's greed.... Greed corrupts thinking, as those who take most simultaneously argue that they fund state services the most through those taxes they cannot avoid"

The reason underclasses exist is not because those people don't or can't work but because of the huge disparity of wealth in a society.

That is just untrue leftist propaganda. There were to be richer children brought within the school meals system for the first time. That is not now going to happen. No one is giong to lose school meals. Those children from families on benefits will continue to receive school meals.

We need things which yield a lot of revenueThere are lots of good candidaets on this thread. Pensions changes take years to come through so not for now the best but the plan that says employers may never force someone out of work because of age must come in. It's only fair. I always wished labour had done that but they didn't when they had the chance. of course not all will choose to stay. 67 retirement ae which I think Germany now has for all would help in due course too

Spain apparently only pays you most benefits if you've paid into national insurance so the young who have never worked have to live with and be supported by parents. Also you get the payments for a year only. That sort of thing we might well need here but I'm not sure of the details of it.

Remove free bus passes for 60 year olds. I am fed up of getting on busses and being the only person paying. (for me any my young children).

If bus companies don't have 'real' customers, paying from their own pocket, then they have no pressure to keep fees affordable.

Will everyone really suffer? Will DC manage ok without some of his 30million fortune. Poor man...