Andy B’s speech

[TheRealSmurfette]

What did you like / not like?

Jam tomorrow. We are facing economic crisis and there is nothing proposed between now and 2030.

I don't think that's really fair. Sure, it was in the tradition of party conference speeches in that it was more about the vision than immediate policy detail but there was also some definte concrete policy for right now, on the VAT cuts to electricity, and the Great British Grid thing, for example. And he spoke alot about growth - albeit without policy detail, but that's to be expected pre-budget, right? I also think the Prime Minister's instincts are right, in that I think the public are tired of short term knee jerk politiking and want to hear a bigger, longer term vision (I know I feel that way). And let's be honest, I don't think we've heard anything close to a pragmatic solution to the current economic crisis from any political party yet (although I am genuinely interested to hear what Kemi Badenoch has to say in her conference speech, now).

The Tories did nothing to improve the mess New Labour made of government infrastructure.

Austerity passed you by then? Demolition of Surestart, privatisation of the probation service, changes to the state pension age.

Billionaires have a lot to do with it @Pineneedlesincarpet. They own our utility companies now. Most of them are foreign so they’ve never lived here or paid tax on the profits they extort from us.

Those things are hardly the same as civil service reform. Getting rid of Surestart didn't stop microchipping cats taking seventy billion years did it?

What did he say about growth?

And completely agree with @PinkFruitbat point - how can he promise to end the triple lock in 2030 when he might not even be in government? That's not his promise to make. He doesn't even have a personal mandate for the next three years let alone beyond the term of this parliament.

It’s all a GE pitch surely. Most of it is post 2029 GE.

Maybe if regulation of the privatised industries had been effectively managed by - guess who - government - we wouldn't be in the mess we're in. It's highly ironic that we're now suggesting returning to state owned utilities to sort out the mess.

Of course it is. It’s a heads up for the next manifesto.

He framed a publicly owned electricity grid, and deeper ties with the EU and shifting power out of the treasury and into the regions as being about growth. I'm sure plenty of people won't agree with that philiospohy - and that's great, its what a battle of political ideas should be about - but I just don't think it's true to say he isn't concerned with, or talking about how to solve, the economic state we're in.

I also don't disagree that much of the speech was about a pitch for the future - but to me that's exciting, I'd much rather have a longer term, bigger thinking kind of politics than the kneejerk populist tinkering of the last few years.

You cannot spend your way to growth. Each of those things will require a vast outlay in taxpayer funds.

Id prefer he sort things out now. Such as with defence. What did he say about increased defence spending and what is being cut to fund it?

It's not that I don't agree, it's that I don't understand the philosophy because he hasn't explained how any of that creates growth. And if most of it is supposed to be taking place after Labour's terms of office, what's the point to it all? You need cross-party consensus that this is what the UK's future will look like, or it's all just words.

The financial position hasn't changed since Starmer left office and Healey has been at pains to reassure the bond markets and business that this budget will be business friendly. So where is the money coming from for the publicly owned electricity grid? Unless it all happens in 2030 when it may not be his problem any more.

I also find it amusing that he talks about the last 40 years being the problem. Erm, has anyone told him what the 1970s were like economically?

I liked the substance but the proof as they say is in the pudding. He will get pushback on everything.

As a pensioner I think he is right to remove the triple lock to help fund social care. We need it to sort out the NHS and do away with ambulances not being able to offload patients and corridor care.

I think closer ties with the EU are needed to grow the economy which is key to everything.

I like the talk about renationalising water and energy. It is time to realise privatisation has failed and only the rich investors have benefitted. The costs are way too high and services are dire. We also need more council houses and no more of this right to buy. If you want to buy a house you do it the way we all had to not getting a massive discount.

Investigating in public infrastructure will require funds, absolutely. I suppose the counter argument is, you can’t cut your way to growth either. I think it’s good that there’s a Prime Minister prepared to have that debate, though.

Well you can at least cut your way to spending less on debt interest. Or spend less on one thing so you can spend it on something else like defence. Rather than spending money you don't have and leaving our children "in hock" (to coin a stupid phrase) to the previous generation's profligacy.

But the economies in the EU aren't growing. So how can they be the key to grow our economy?

The 1970s were more than 40 years ago. 40 years ago was 1986.

True

You should mention this to Burnham’s speech writers, who use 40 years ago.

He writes his own. A man of many talents.

I think she means that the last 40 years of Thatcher and Major maybe were the problem?

I dont know. Andy B seems to have done very well under Thatcher and Conservative government. Social mobility you see.

I did too. It was in spite of them.

It’s Burnham anyway pushing the 40 years line.

That'll teach them!

You can to an extent - but not straighforwardly, because so many cuts actually just shift costs elsewhere, in a way that is sometimes even more expensive to the tax payer.

From my perspective, no political party has yet offered a fully thought through, pragmatic solution to the debt crisis. But at least Andy Burnham seems to have a bit of vision - and I do think being prepared to even talk about modifying the triple lock shows he's got political steel.