Rachel Reeves can’t win, can she?

[anothervoter]

After days and days of negative press and chatter about income tax going up, complaints on Mumsnet and across the media, today’s reports are that idea might be dropped and now she’s being accused of rattling the markets and making the cost of borrowing increase.

Honestly, genuine question- what can she do?

When will you stop blaming Tories?

Ah the "one and done" bullshit?

@Southernecho

Stop making comparisons to the previous Govt they don't count.

So, why were you comparing the Conservatives to Labour?

@blossomtoes

Not everyone thinks”austerity” was the problem.
The majority of economists do

Austerity started under the last Labour government in 2008 after the banking crisis.

Err i didn't.

I specifically chose not too, can you respond in kind and move the thread on?

No, its the same old.

The IMF has said get debt down. This month reports borrowing is higher than expected again.

You continually keep referencing the Tories and you admitted to comparing them "Its pretty clear that the only reason you & others don't like the comparison ".

It's your continual gaslighting that's the issue.

I think the wording of my post went straight over your head!

I'd just been "told" not to make such comparisons, then another critic of Labour poster did exactly that!

Nope, in my my 2 recent posts you've chosen to respond too, i have not.

Like i said, it would be good to move on.

Do you even know what Gaslighting means?

Its not someone having a different opinion to you or not doing as you try to make them do "Stop referencing the Tories" stuff.

I am happy to move on if you will stop referencing "what about the Tories" as a counter point to everything.

You are now telling me I don't know what gaslighting is 🤣🤣 that's a classic

Many of us have said 100s of times what Reeves needs to do. You ignore that.

I just said that! & you don't.
Gaslighting is a form of psychological manipulation where a person is made to doubt their own reality, memory, or sanity through persistent deception and lies

Like i said, disagreeing with someone is not "Gaslighting" & you re the only poster who has said this and is continuing to accuse me of this.

Gaslighting is extremely serious and not a joking matter.

I don't think you have suggested a different path, just criticism? if you have, i missed it.
@Leavesfalling has, though & another pp suggested a 1p increase in income tax, instead of Business NI, that would raise around 7billion, Reeves raised 40bn, mostly on NI, so we would need a 4p to 5p increase, what would that do for consumer confidence?

Cutting welfare by 40bn? good luck with that, the 5bn of cuts Labour proposed bought howls of "Labour hate the disabled" and that from the right leaning media.
SENDs needs re jigging too but who is prepared for the pain that will cause?

I agree the Ch tunnel situation is bonkers, that really does need to be looked again.

I have made numerous suggestions over last 12 months.

Austerity started under the last Labour government in 2008 after the banking crisis.

It didn’t. Unless you have some evidence to show that?

None of it was really "austerity" anyway. Ridiculous hyperbolic term. .

It will be nothing to the cuts that will have to be made once the country goes bust after RR kills the golden goose. I see she is thinking about doubling the dividend tax. That should properly shaft the self employed and close a few more businesses down.

Oh dear good luck with that.

Jeez yet another scare story, so she is going to double it to 67.5% ?

Or do you mean the 8.75% rate for basic rate payers up to 50k? 17.5% would put it around the CGT rate, hardly onerous.

Maybe just maybe, she'll double it for additional rate payers and they can be stung for 80% ?

Do you even know what the term Double Tax refers too?

Have you any evidence the UK is going bust? hint! its not, no where near, its credit rating are AA, pretty much across the board.

@BIossomtoes

Subsequent to the 2008 banking crisis, Labour provided bailouts and increased spending in an attempt to stimulate the economy. However, their overspending cumulated in the famous note from Liam Bryne, chief secretary to the Treasury under Gordon Brown,

there is no money left.

Hence the incoming coalition government of conservatives and liberals had no option than to reduce spending. As Graham Stuart said recently on BBC QT,

Living within your means = austerity

You ve totally re written history.

The UK had just 65% debt to GDP, so plenty of capacity to borrow and we were still getting in billions in tax revenue, so hardly broke.

The note left, was part of an on going custom where the out going govt treasury minister left such light hearted notes, they were supposed to stay secret and always were until LD David Laws made it public, he eventually apologised.

Another note left to the new Govt was from a Tory to his Labour counterpart "Sorry to leave such a mess"

I know exactly what happened. I was there. Austerity ruined our economy, the vast majority of economists agree that the sensible policy would have been to borrow when interest rates were virtually non existent and invest to stimulate the economy.

Back in 2009, as western nations battled with the fallout from the financial crisis, the typical household in Britain was slightly (13 per cent) poorer than their counterparts in Germany, and over a third (38 per cent) poorer than the typical American household. Fast forward a decade – during which Britain stalled economic growth-wise – and those income gaps have soared. The typical German household is now 26 per cent richer, and the US is out of sight – 66 per cent richer than the typical British family.

https://economy2030.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/the-uk-economy-has-recovered-from-doom-and-recession-before-and-it-can-do-so-again/

Austerity and slowing down growth in the economy = the mess we’ve been in for the last 15 years.

@Southernecho

Another note left to the new Govt was from a Tory to his Labour counterpart "Sorry to leave such a mess"

Since Labour took office,

Taxes have risen
Unemployment has risen
Growth has declined.

Sounds like thing are deteriorating as opposed to improving.

@Southernecho

Another note left to the new Govt was from a Tory to his Labour counterpart "Sorry to leave such a mess"

Since Labour took office,

Taxes have risen
Unemployment has risen
Growth has declined.

Sounds like thing are deteriorating as opposed to improving.

Before you set off on another one of your half-cocked rambles, Im referring to the worry that she is going to raise the basic rate of dividend tax from 8.25% to 20%. That's going to hit the self-employed very hard. If you understand how the majority of small incorporated business owners are paid.

This is not a pro business government that's for sure!

And we used to have a AAA rating not so very long ago so AA is nothing to be showing off about.

And the majority of business in this country are SME + self employed.
Employers NI has already proven to have a negative impact.
Now they go after the self employed. Typical and obvious.
Every employer other than the state via public sector, is corrupt and must be attacked 🙄🙄 Ripe for taxing and fuck the impact on jobs/economy etc.

The scary thing is its obvious to everyone (apart from the True Believers on here) that they have absolutely no idea how to get us out of this. This is due to the lack of ability and brain power on the front bench. Unfortunately for the UK we are being led by middle management and the complaints department.

We lost our AAA rating in 2013 - in the midst of austerity. No sooner had we got it back than we lost it again in 2016 - remember what happened that year?

That’s madness. Entirely anti growth. Even pro Labour must have dc who want to work at some point. It would work against job creation, just ridiculous.