Would you support mandatory identity cards in the UK?

[Dbank]

Non-mandatory cards have been attempted multiple times and failed to be adopted, do you think now is the time to make them mandatory?

For me it would depend what details. We lived in Venezuela and their ID cards have class- like working class/middle class but they had 5 classes and it’s impossible to change.

Silly idea. For those people who don't have a driving licence or passport, the non-mandatory cards exist and are easy to get. If a need for reliable identity is established, it might be reasonable to mandate that everyone must own at least one of these 3 possible items. However there's no point establishing such an obligation while it's legal to falsify passport & driving licence anyway on demand, so all the ID is worthless until that changes. Under what circumstances do you feel it would be beneficial to mandate a formal ID document @Dbank ? How would it improve things?

You beat me to it re China. I’m always saying to my son, they’ll be giving us citizen points next, like China. 😬

What cards are you referring too?
I have friends who got Citizens Cards but they were frequently not accepted.

And you won’t have an NI if you are a British teen abroad when you are 14-16. Also if your parents don’t claim child benefit, it’s not automatically issued, your parents or you have to consciously apply for it from within the UK.

OP never came back to explain what "mandatory" means.

No. For what purpose?
I don't even like the fact that it's frowned upon not to have photo ID.

If you have an NI number then you can be identified. If you don't then you need to try and get one. Or accept the fact you'll be excluded from work or benefits etc.

I feel like I've proven my existence sufficiently enough across the course of my life to not need to show photo ID on a regular basis.

How would it be enforced? The police stopping people en masse in the streets or knocking on doors and demanding 'show me your papers!'?

Are you sure? Everything I can find online suggests they are unique, I can’t find any suggestion that two people could hold the same number.

That’s not what the utilities providers and the supermarkets say. Consumption as they provide it does not match the registered population. I think it is the Big Four grocers who think the excess is more like nine million.

The proper ones are. The "temporary NI number" issued to people who haven't got a proper one, so that they can be paid while they wait for the proper one to be issued, can be duplicated theoretically but wouldn't be used to link people across systems. The genuine NI numbers can never be duplicates. There are 676 million possible NI numbers - 10 times higher than the population, without the final letter digit (they are unique in the digits up to the last number - if a combination of numbers and letters exists with final letter C, there is not anyone who has the same combination with just a different final letter.

Every vague workable scheme since the 80s has been scuppered by scope creep.

There has always been a general political consensus that they are "UnBritish" and smack of "Paperien bitte !".

The fact that countries that do require mandatory ID have no significant variation in every single area where it is suggested we "need" ID cards is always a red flag.

There is also some low energy thinking that somehow "ID cards" will address "small boats" without the tiny logical leap that in order for this to work (it won't) then all of us will have to carry ID cards all the time. Something that changed a few minds last time this was discussed and people stopped saying "ID cards" long enough to actually listen. And who knows ? Maybe think ?

If you have an NI number then you can be identified

Repeats.

NI Numbers are not unique.

Gov.uk says you can get one with your birth/ adoption certificate plus one other doc such as your dwp letter or marriage cert. Or p45/60.

You can use a UK birth, adoption or naturalisation certificate, but you must send it with one of the following:

• National Insurance card, or a letter from the Department for Work and Pensions or HM Revenue and Customs showing your National Insurance number - find your National Insurance number if you’ve lost it
• photocopy of the front page of a benefits book or an original benefits claim letter
• P45, P60 or pay slip
• your marriage or civil partnership certificate
• your divorce or end of civil partnership document (decree nisi, decree absolute, conditional order or final order)
• a gender recognition certificate
• college or university union card, education certificate or PASS proof of age card (issued after June 2014)

Any sources for this?
Curious how grocers can filter out the extra food consumed that causes obesity, the amount of food waste we have, and the food that tourists eat….

Also curious how utility companies can filter out household with high energy and water needs like small holdings, disabled, low efficiency housing stock, in system losses and leaks due to poor infrastructure…

But the biometric permits are being replaced by e-visas. I think carrying a physical ID card , similar to carrying a driving licence, is a good way to prove who you are, wherever you are, and will help assess criminal activity. I don’t get why people are so against it with silly theories that it will develop into something sinister.

Maybe people are greedy and buying in excess.

It would be an incredibly expensive exercise which I can see no reason for.
When are we to show this ID card. Many would leave it home and many will not have one as they are not citizens.

Yep

@Pinkfluffypencilcase thank you.
That's very helpful information 🙂
I might attempt again to get one.

This is astonishing. Why does it have your class on? And is social
mobility not possible?

Wow that's disturbing to say the least!

@Bambamhoohoo

Biometric residency cards were discontinued in 2024, so they are irrelevant to this discussion. They and their successor are not ‘ issued to every immigrant’ only to those who have entered legally and applied for settled status, or those who have successfully applied for refugee status. The card shows your status within the UK, once that has been vetted or granted.

I don’t know what happens to people who have thrown their existing identity documents into the sea, I suppose they are excused the validation process. People who overstay a student visa ( such as the men who murdered the delivery van driver in Shropshire) are ‘immigrants’ , that is , citizens of another nation, but their permission to reside in the UK had expired, so they did not have valid UK I D.

They are supposed to be unique. However I wouldn't rely on it.

You should meet my friend who nearly lost all her contributions because somebody else had her number (or vice versa). She was lucky that she went to claim aged 24 and it was spotted. It could have been annoying if she'd tried to retire with no contributions. Some MP -> Inland Revenue (as 'twas) boot action was needed.

Subsequent chats with accountants has suggested "it happens".

As someone who possesses neither a passport or a driving licence,I would welcome this. t's not often that I'm asked to provide photo ID,but it's annoying when I am that only a passport or driving licence will be accepted. I've never learnt to drive,hence no licence and I can't afford to travel abroad so don't see the need for a passport. I'll now sit back and wait for the abuse that typically comes with Mumsnet for not learning to drive. 😂

No wonder there is an obesity problem then ! That’s quite some over consumption ( do all the greedy people leave the taps running and the lights on all night as well?)