I am a Labour voter, a Labour supporter and I do not regret my vote.

[CurlewKate]

However, I think that Starmer has been incredibly stupid and/or very badly advised over this expenses issue. He has done nothing wrong, but his behaviour is not what he led us to believe he would do, and I am incredibly exasperated and disappointed.

In my opinion, he should admit that he made a massive misjudgement, and agree to take no more freebies from now on.

Apart from anything else anything which allows people to say "They are all as bad as each other" (they aren't) is a distraction from the real issues the country faces. He should be laser focussed on repairing the damage caused by 14 years of Tory misrule. Not scrambling around dealing with peripheral stuff.
Starmer-say sorry. Don't do it again. And get back to work.

Keir Starmer said that his parents rocked up to Buckingham Palace in their 'beaten up old Volvo' when he received his knighthood - I guess you've settled the debate on what social class his parents were.

I think the good policy that people have ignored £600m inquiry on the Covid VIP lanes. Surely we want answers on this?
I am pleased with the way that they dealt with the riots- no idea how those children murdered were used by racists to go on to commit offences and cause harm to a bereaved community.
I am pissed in parts re the wfp but I do think it should be means tested. The " pensioners will freeze" narrative is so very different from the " send them to care homes untested" very sad deaths we saw. Not the same uproar in any way.
We need to absolutely look at thresholds more closely though as the current cut offf is way too close.
Although if the HSF is extended ( and I know each county has its own rules) mine has a £110 per 3 months so that would cover the wfp lost wouldn't it(?)
The whole clothes thing is an own goal but again I didn't see the outrage previously re weddings, holidays etc..
I would choose to stop them BUT I do think some things will cost in this job and if a donor pays ( and not getting a Covid contract for example) and they are transparent donors eg a clothing firm wanting goods showcased and not a company with no employees and we don't know ( spot fitness- jenrick) then I see why it happens.
I am slightly surprised Labour fell into this. They know if they walk around in a sackcloth they are compared with Michael Foot and Angela wearing clothes that cost a lot isn't right for a northern working class woman, neither is going to Ibiza and neither is going to New York.... maybe she should try Mustque. It is ok for some as I understand.

x.com/philmyers53/status/1837970115062637001?s=46&t=65L8UPMxSE-b0A_JBXdR1A

Jeez, some people will swallow any old political announcement, however blatantly a deflection and however desperate.

Ooh look, a squirrel!

You’re absolutely determined not to recognise this, aren’t you? Regardless of all the evidence.

@ThatbloodyRoblox The reason Labour is being pulled up on the clothes is 1. No one actually noticed them 2. They cost a lot for little or no impact 3. Rachel Reeves still looked boring and so did KS 4. They had a right go at every Conservative that got freebies and then did it themselves hence proving they are the same and therefore disappointing 5. They didn’t recognise an own goal. 6. They appoint expensive advisers to tell them these things, except they didn’t. Therefore rubbish appointments and a waste of money. All points to naivety and being grabby and entitled now they can be. As if they cannot afford various sets of clothes!!! Total own goal.

True. They need headlines and seem to be spinning quite hard

More selling in of 'pain' today. No wonder the polls are dropping so much

There's no mention of recovering any money as a result if the investigation. Surely that's throwing good money after bad. Also, there's already been a court case, IIRC, saying that the crony contracts were legally awarded (somebody correct me if I've misremembered).

Predictable that the board's hardcore Labour supporters are clinging on to something which (to them) sounds promising though!

This is going to be a looooooong 5 years.

For a little balance:

But while Ms Badenoch accused the new government of "hypocrisy" for taking donations, she also stood by her own register of interests that shows she had taken tickets and hospitality for a rugby game, the Jingle Bell Ball concert, and Ed Sheeran (September 2024)

Apparently, it helps MPs spend time with their families!! lol!

Lets see how many die hard Tory posters pile in on her.... not!

Can you not see the hypocracy here? KS's whole persona is 'Mr Rules', bring honesty and integrity back in to politics blah blah blah. Except he's been on the take for years! His penchant for bribes freebies was well know when he was LOTO.

Kemi Badenoch is also wrong, but she is longer in government.

I thought we had been through all of this earlier in the thread. Just because the other children do it doesn't make it right.

Keir is just a lot better at getting the free stuff than anyone else. It's OK if it's him remember, but if anyone else does it then it's immoral.

Nope...

Tell me which rules Starmer has broken? or for the that matter Badenoch?

KB was taking gifts whilst in Govt too.

You re now doing it, criticising Starmer for taking gifts when NOT in Govt but its ok for KB to be taking them.....

the difference here is you call out KB for taking gifts BUT KS was being bribed.... according to you!

where is your evidence for bribery?

This is the really hypocrisy.

I agree the rules haven't been broken, but I think now is the time to review this.

Honestly, I think they just need to change the rules for MPs to more like corporates. Pre- 2009 the city was pretty much like this- big freebies to clients in terms of events and gifts. It was just normal and no-one gave it much thought.

After the reforms, you had to declare everything down to a tin of Quality Street, and where I worked any gift over 30 quid had to be declined, or if that would cause too much offence, donated as a Christmas raffle prize with proceeds to the corporate's chosen charity. If you accepted something like Wimbledon tickets you had to take a day's holiday to attend, and the donator had to also attend- couldn't just give you the tickets.

I'm not saying the whole 2009 FS debacle was caused by excessive corporate hospitality/ gifting but it definitely didn't help- created a certain culture. It just makes it harder to make good decisions when there's too much chumminess in what should be an "arms length" relationship.

Which of Labour or the Tories campaigned on the ‘sleaze’ of the other and its own high ethical standards and thorough decency? And which of the two didn’t campaign on that basis?

When you’ve answered that, you’ll know which party is the one full of rank hypocrites.

Which laws or guidelines has KS broken? what is sleazy about either KB or KS 's gift taking?

Both declared their gifts.

Sleaze is wrong doing/illegal/corrupt, are sure you want to go down the route that the Tories didn't campaign against any of this in Govt?

I did not say that KS had broken the rules.
I did not say that KB was OK to take freebies.

As for the bribery, I'm assuming you have convinced yourself that these so called donors are dishing out thousands of pounds for nothing? You think this is due to altruism? This really matters when the person on the receiving end is in a position of power don't you think?

Keir did break the rules in failing to declare £5000 donation to his wife for her lovely new clothes. He only declared the donation when he was found out presumably. Too late to comply with the rules at any rate.

The others clearly did break the rules by trying to hide the true nature of the donations by admin waffle. So they knew they were doing the wrong thing.

As Keir said to Boris "the rules are very clear: so there's really no excuse for him, a lawyer whose job it is to know the rules, to break them.

The majority of the country, who just want honest, straighforward government without fear of favour, would see straight through that type of attempt at spin. People are tired of the twisty ways of politicians trying to get out of situations they put themselves into by their own behaviour. It doesn't wash and it's tiresome.

Almost all KS 's gifts were pre GE... so not in power.

Bribery is a serious charge, i assume you've evidence for this? i haven't got any for either Tory MPs or Labour ones.

I'm talking about the ability of some to criticise KS/Labour but not Tories taking Gifts, who are taking them right now, whilst having ago at Labour.

I think the real influence is done via lobbying groups and party donations, not via a suit or glasses.

Don't disagree, so treat all MPs of whatever party, equally?

Ban all personal gifts, all donations and fund parties via the tax payer and remove these allegations of favour: Tories in the hands of big business, Lab in the pockets of the Unions...

About 30 minutes ago you said the Tories had acted illegally. Now you’re saying you have no evidence of that.

Keir doesn't seem to be enthusiastic about your point of view given that he's pushing back against the country about his football hospitality. The Cabinet don't think they've done anything wrong. I had the misfortune of watching a dreadful interview that Bridgette Philipson gave to Sky. That is not someone who agrees that £14,000 donations for 40th birthday parties is anything to worry about. She was angry and fought back at the very suggestion.

Fear or favour *

I'm not asking for his support, ;like i said up thread, Tory supporters wont ever criticise their party, whatever they do and you re proving this.

So she had a meeting or party with business leaders, teachers, press mp's etc and you think she should pay for this herself???

yes i heard the interview.

She did nothing wrong at all, however, Rayner shouldn't be taking free accomodation in NY, i don't see any justification in that,

though i suspect that if a good friend of yours offered you free accommodation in their holiday home in Spain/France, you'd not turn it down?

I wouldn't.

He won't want to give up the football freebies. It's interesting how it's worked out given he beefed up the football angle to show he was man of the people pre GE - or should that be son of a toolmaker

They have all been defensive and farcical which hasn't helped their cause

Unfortunately for Keir he'll be in the press when he turns up to freebie football hospitality