The Westminster Arms

[DustyDiamond]

As requested, I have contacted MNHQ via the contact provided in the deletion message

Welcome to The Westminster Arms!

🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷🍷

A non-partisan politics pub thread for political chit chat....!!

Please stick within MN talk guidelines - any posts which you think may have crossed the line, please report rather than getting into scraps on thread 😠

Political punch-ups are soooo last decade - ain't nobody got time for that 🥊❌

Be nice! Be respectful!

S'ok to slag off politicians, but not other posters 🍻

Morning, all,

It’s another big day for Ian Blackford. It’s the second reading of the NHS Funding Bill, the one that commits the government in law to spending an additional £33.9 billion a year by 2024 on the NHS in England.

What, you might ask, does this have to do with Oor Ian, given that NHS Scotland is a devolved matter in which Westminster has no say?

Well, this is the first bill since the election to trigger EVEL (English Votes for English Laws) and the first time it has ever applied to a major bill. Next week, MPs will sit as a Legislative English Grand Committee; only MPs from English constituencies can vote, although the report stage will follow when all MPs can vote.

The SNP of course really really object to EVEL (but have no probs with Scotland having a devolved government while England does not, obviously) so this is Oor Ian’s golden opportunity to drum home his favourite refrain - “Scotland’s voice cannot be ignored...taking Scotland out against her will...democratic mandate for Scotland...IndyRef2...” and so on.

Expect him to insist on making amendments to an English law on the grounds that it might, only might, possibly have an effect on the Barnett Formula.

You can’t blame a man for trying...but you don’t have to listen to him either.

Crumpets for breakfast - please help yourselves.

Kettle’s on ☕️☕️☕️

Merkel of course does nothing.

She can't, Scary. Hoist with her own petard.

Just to help things along, Deutsche Bank is now being investigated for handing over $1.1million to a Saudi royal advisor to secure a private wealth management agreement. DB is blaming two rogue employees who acted without their knowledge or approval.

Must have taken it out of petty cash then.

I'm not suggesting that DB's underlying performance is sound, merely relaying that the expected loss is being attributed to the restructuring and bad debt write-offs. The fact that severe pruning was applied and such a significant amount of debt written off in the first place says much about previous custom and practice at the bank. This latest news suggests they are still finding dirt under the carpet. DB's troubles are not over and in the banking world, confidence is hard won and easily lost.

Morning Singing

Dog was playing up last night so abandoned hope of getting any sleep at around 4.30am so I could certainly go for a plate of crumpets about now😊.

Wasn’t aware of that debate in Parliament today so thanks for the heads up. It always amuses me when I see Ian Blackford rising to speak, it’s like wait for it, wait for it, yup there it is ‘Indyref 2” “Scotland’s voice cannot be ignored” shoehorned in at any and every opportunity.

Morning, Time4, the cat woke me up at 2.31. He wanted food and a cuddle and now he's fast asleep. I, however, am not. Again.

I feel your pain

Morning all

I'll miss it all as per usual, so I may just watch a YouTube clip of any of Oor Ian's speeches as they're indistinguishable from each other...!

I used to think it was maybe not so bad that Scotland had such a large block voice standing up for her interests - but the SNP are so utterly obsessed with independence that it drowns out everything else 🙄

At heart I'm a unionist & I'd be sad to see Scotland break away, but as a supporter of leaving the EU I can understand Indy supporters' frustrations.

What I cannot understand however, is how the SNP can be simultaneously for Scottish independence but against UK independence

It's the same concept/principle, surely??

My cat tends to jump on top of me & stare into my face from about 6 every day 🙄

I think the SNP is focused on Scotland and therefore it wouldn't care about UK situation beyond its impact on Scotland.

Thank you for my award walking!

It is ironic that bellini and I are pretty much in the same place over all this now 😂

It is a shame that there’s still so much animosity and so many people determined to cling on to the past though

I do hope neddie isn’t a man - their comments are always provoking and whilst it’s unnecessary and undignified if it’s a woman, I’d find it much worse if a man has chosen to do such a thing on a forum where they know it’s mainly women who post

It pains me to thread 👮‍♀️
I hate it

But...

Please don't talk about other posters on thread - this is what they want, as they're watching like hawks for any reason to report these threads & get them pulled

As LilyMN said earlier on the thread - ignore all provocation/goading & report anything that is of concern

Morning all - 5 more days! 🇬🇧🍸🇬🇧

And yes, ignore ignore ( & report ) our attention is what they crave. Don’t give it to them.

My cat tends to jump on top of me & stare into my face from about 6 every day

6am is a luxury. Happy to swap, Dusty. Just let me know when you're ready.

Still no news yet on how Lega has done in Calabria but closer to home, I saw this in the Spectator about Len McCluskey.

"On Pienaar's Politics, he also addressed suggestions that centrist MPs might quit if Long-Bailey, who is his union Unite's nominated candidate, won: 'Good riddance,' he said."

My take on that is that while the restructuring of the Conservative Party took place a few months ago (21 rebels having the whip withdrawn, a handful crossing over to the Changey-Wotsits, others either standing down at the GE or standing as Independents), the restructuring of the Labour Party is about to begin. It won't be pretty.

As a democrat, and I've said this over and over, I want to see a functioning opposition - a credible government-in-waiting - challenging the government, giving it a new perspective and keeping it on its toes. Looks like I'll have to wait a lot longer.

Morning Dirty.

I read about that interview earlier this morning Singing and thought there’s Len McCluskey being his usual charming self😊. Agree it’s not going to be pretty.

Morning and thanks for the breakfast Singing. I love crumpets. Not sure they are good for me but hey ho.

So crumpets and a large coffee and a seat by the fire and I'm set.

Can't believe Matteo might win in Italy. He says he will try for a GE if he wins. Italy has more elections than we do.

Watching the NHS bill with interest. Although I don't think the NHS can be sorted until social care is solved. Don't expect that to be soon.

Many years ago my DF was very ill. He was discharged from hospital into convalescent home. We need a similar model again.

Yes, I read about McClusky.
In the piece I read he said Jezza was right, the policies were right but the media are all right wing and accused him of all sorts of things that were untrue like antisemitism and mixing with terrorists.
Murdoch lost them the election.

I think (and hope) the breakup will be swift and the moderates in the party get together and give us a decent opposition.

this is the first bill since the election to trigger EVEL

Thanks for the summary of this Lily I wasn't aware but am very interested to see how it works if its the first time.

Leo Varadkar on the BBC talking about the EU having the upper hand in trade talks. It seems childish to me that he's saying this. We need to bring some mutual respect back to these talks and not be braying about who has got the upper side etc. The focus is a sensible deal for both parties. He's also disregarded the many strengths of the UK economy as part of our bargaining power as well, not to mention other trade deals in the offing.

Of course 'the moderates' will try to shut down the left of labour, they've been doing that ever since Corbyn won the leadership but even if they succeeded what then? A decent opposition isn't what Tory voters want.

Did they want Millibands moderacy? of course not and the press tore him apart at the GE whatever way they could find, however low they had to go.

A decent opposition isn't what Tory voters want.

And yet several (in fact all) recent Tory voters on this thread have repeatedly said they do 🤷🏻‍♀️

And no one crossed over to Tory from Labour this election. Not a single one of us. We ALL stuck with Labour this time.

Of course they say they do, I expect even Borvis trots that one out about it being essential to democracy. As soon as the new leader is installed the hatchets will be out.
It's not what pp say, it's what they do's that counts

I wasn't aware but am very interested to see how it works if its the first time.

Morning again, all. If memory serves, it was William Hague who put together the EVEL procedure with cross party support, as an acceptable alternative to having a separate English Parliament (with the UK Parliament retaining overall say on defence, budget, immigration, security, etc). It was meant to address the West Lothian question.

The last thing the taxpayer needed was yet another building and assembly to pay for so this seemed a reasonable way of achieving the same outcome. It possibly would not have been necessary if the MPs representing Scottish seats had kept to their convention of abstaining on any vote on purely English matters that had a direct equivalence with matters devolved to Scotland but again, if memory serves, it was the SNP who broke convention.

It is perfectly possible that Ian Blackford will resist the temptation to sing his favourite song once more but I'm not banking on it

Kettle's on again ☕️☕️☕️

Thanks Lily and this coffee is good. It has been better since Dom Raab popped in to help fit the all singing all dancing one,with shelving surround, behind the bar.

I remember the West Lothian question but did not realise we had solved it with the English whatever it is called.

Leo Varadkar on the BBC talking about the EU having the upper hand in trade talks. It seems childish to me that he's saying this.

Leo has the Irish GE to look forward to, Holly, and the polls are not looking terribly healthy for him. I rather think that's for the benefit of his domestic market. It might look different again after 8 February.

this coffee is good. It has been better since Dom Raab popped in

On my third cup now, Copper, and you are right.

Dom. Not just a pretty face.

Afternoon all. Speciality tea for me please.

I agree that Leo is playing to the domestic gallery. However I also think he is pointing out an inevitably the journos are all missing.

Both the UK and the EU have said they are aiming for a comprehensive agreement by Dec 2020. It has been the naysayers who have been feeding the line that this is impossible and therefore there will be a piecemeal approach. Ime that narrative makes no sense. Far more likely that it will indeed be an overarching Deal with standstill arrangements for any areas where "detail" needs fleshing out later.

On EVEL, I don't think it works as a mechanism because almost anything purely affecting England will have an impact via Barnett. Would make much more sense to get on with devolving more powers to English Regions and keep WM in overall control. In any case it is somewhat irrelevant as Boris has a majority in England and in the UK.

Anyone missing out on Oor Ian can have a whole 15 minutes of him on Sunday politics Scotland (iplayer) followed by 10 minutes of Sir Curtice sporting his very natty Sunday jumper. No prizes for guessing what they were discussing.

Hi again my friends.
Watched as the Bill went through.
Wondering what lies ahead.