Why would you vote Conservative

[BigGrannyPants]

Just that really, I am utterly bemused why anyone would vote conservative knowing the lies they've told, the lives they've ruined and the fact they are only interested in looking after their rich friends. I appreciate the choice of parties aren't great, but surely Tories need to be at the bottom of the list? If you are planning to vote Conservative please enlighten me! This thread isn't intended to bash anyone so if you could try and avoid that if possible!

"Because they hate the NHS or want to get rid of it, or because there isn't enough money?"

Some conservatives want to save money. A few actually do hate the NHS on principle. I know a couple of people in real life who are against the idea of free at the point of delivery healthcare.

I agree that taxes probably do have to rise slightly in order to properly fund not just the NHS , but the services that interconnect with it (social care and mental health etc).
It is a myth that the NHS is horribly inefficient - I am sure that there are inefficiencies, but we spend far less per GDP than many other developed countries. Moving closer to a private health care system will, from what I can see, cost most people more on average than our current tax contribution to the NHS.
You could end up with a fragmented, partially privatised system which still receives huge subsidies from the government, has less buying power than the NHS, is more complicated (and thus more expensive), is subjected to less oversight, is more unequal across the country, and on top of all that money will be taken from the system as profit for the private companies. Its not that private companies are evil or anything - but they will, understandably, want to make a profit. The decisions they make will be led by what makes the most money - not what is fair or compassionate.
The rates currently charged by private healthcare insurance companies will also increase, because more claims will be made.

I am very pro-business, and there are some things businesses do much better than the public sector. But there are some things the public sector does better - like nationwide organisations that our lives quite literally depend upon.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_health_expenditure_per_capita#/media/File:OECD_health_expenditure_per_capita_by_country.svg

Theresa May's Brexit will be a red, white and blue Brexit. Everyone else would only be able to get a beige Brexit. Or maybe pink if you're lucky.

I've voted for most of the main parties over the years; not UKIP or BNP or that ilk obviously.

Tribal Labour initially, family habit(!) then I alternated between Lib Dem and Green. I'm usually swayed by environmental stuff.

I voted Tory once, in a local election, I think, as I'm in Trafford and wanted to keep the Grammar Schools.

@AdviceNeededPlease2 because of the brutal cuts to benefits and disability. Almost 3000 people have died within 2 weeks of being told they were fit to work (not the same 2 week period of course) families are being pushed in to poverty. State Pensions are almost worthless so people my age (34) will either have to have a good private pension or be faced with nothing at retirement.

I'll probably spoil my ballot. I grew up in the Blair years & grew to hate Labour. I thought the Tories might be a good fit for me as a Christian but the more I learn about politics the less I see my opinions reflected in any party. I'm distinctly disillusioned with the whole thing. I'd love there to be a party I could relate to but until I can stand to align myself with any party I feel my only option is to turn up & make them count my protest!

I don't understand what the point is of spoiling your ballot (directed at anyone who is doing so), isn't that the same as not voting at all. So why go to the effort of going to the polling station to spoil the ballot? Is there something I don't know about

Apparently spoiled papers are also counted in the results, so it's like registering that you think there's no one worth voting for but if you didn't turn up that could be taken to mean you are happy or indifferent, so it's like protesting... I asked this question earlier in the thread. Personally I don't think anyone cares about spoiled ballot papers but I could be totally wrong about that

bigGrannyPants

Great name
Thank you for explaining that. I don't think anyone would care either, unless there were a significant amount of spoiled ballot papers. It's not like the counter is going be like, 'ooooo look so-and-so from 2 xyz drive spoiled their ballot paper so we have to sit up and take notice'. It's only going to work if thousands upon thousands of people did it.
Does anyone in the know, know if spoiled ballot papers are in anyway significant?

In the event the result is close Dead, they'll scrutinise any spoiled papers. So you could have them passing round your paper with a scribble to see if it could be construed as a vote.

Plus some of the elections have very low turnout on a very small electorate so turning up and spoiling your paper does show.

Don't spoil your paper by writing 'wanker' next to your least favourite candidate as this may actually count as a vote for them.

Ha! noble I originally wrote they'd be passing it round to see if your scribbled 'wanker' fits in one box
And then thought someone will tell me off

Don't spoil your paper by writing 'wanker' next to your least favourite candidate as this may actually count as a vote for them.

It won't. The voting intention has to be clear. I have been involved it election counts, every spoilt ballot is looked at by the candidate or their representative and has to be agreed it's a spoilt paper or a vote. And every vote does count. Even if you live in a super safe seat the number of votes for each party is added up and relates to how much TV coverage etc they get. Also there's a percentage of the vote a party needs to get (5%?) to get their deposit back.

They've been saying that since I was a kid BigGranny. 'In a few years', and 'you wait -this time next year' etc. Because every winter there's an NHS crisis. Aspects of it are very good and some others very bad. It depends on who you listen to. Tories wont dismantle it, no party would. They'll mess with it, play politics with it though, of course.

Life long Labour voter here but will vote Tory. Reason is Corbyn who is a Marxist puppet and completely unable to be the strong leader we need to make the most of the disaster which is Brexit. Imagine Corbyn and the EU! He would give us all away. Imagine the dangerous world situation and Corbyn with his views on defence! I don't agree with the Tories on a lot of things i.e. NHS, grammar schools at a time when schools are underfunded etc but without a reasonable Brexit everything goes down the Swanee. There will be no money for any of the things that Father Christmas Corbyn wants to give everyone. In fact give Corbyn and co his way (imagine a Brexit with him in charge) and we will be like Greece without an EU bail out. Theresa May at least looks and acts like a strong leader which is our only hope in the future negotiations upon which all our futures depend.

A friend has posted this.

In other news, I want a pair of diamond shoes and a pet unicorn

(it's all well and good wanting all this lovely stuff , but he doesn't seem to understand that he is trying to spend every pound about 30 times over!)

"It's only going to work if thousands upon thousands of people did it."

....But you could say that about however you voted.
It is better to vote than not vote, but if you really can't decide at least spoiling your ballot paper means that you count in the turnout figures. Yes, its a drop in the ocean, but its an angry drop rather than an apathetic one.

I'm glad you're so optimistic, mrspriggy. I agree that although the NHS isn't perfect, things could be a lot worse. That's why I don't want to see it any more underfunded, and it will be affected by cuts to other areas. I don't believe that we will wake up overnight and find the NHS gone, but I am worried about it being allowed to slowly slip into a state of atrophy.
I think it would be wise for the government to pay attention to what NHS staff are saying, and heed the warning signs before a crisis hits - prevention is cheaper than cure.
Of course, if it does begin to implode, certain aspects of the media and politicians will confidently put all the blame on immigrants anyway.

Life long Labour voter here but will vote Tory. Reason is Corbyn who is a Marxist puppet and completely unable to be the strong leader we need to make the most of the disaster which is Brexit. Imagine Corbyn and the EU! He would give us all away. Imagine the dangerous world situation and Corbyn with his views on defence! I don't agree with the Tories on a lot of things i.e. NHS, grammar schools at a time when schools are underfunded etc but without a reasonable Brexit everything goes down the Swanee. There will be no money for any of the things that Father Christmas Corbyn wants to give everyone. In fact give Corbyn and co his way (imagine a Brexit with him in charge) and we will be like Greece without an EU bail out. Theresa May at least looks and acts like a strong leader which is our only hope in the future negotiations upon which all our futures depend.

^ this

See, I completely disagree that May and her merry band of muppets can competently handle the complex Brexit negotiations;
Boris cannot keep himself from making "hilarious" jokes about nazis, Davies does not even have the most basic grasp of the facts, and Fox can't work out one end of the unicorn from the other. They are backed up by the noisy, guffawing weirdos of the Tory backbench, whilst anyone with a viewpoint that deviates even slightly from the hard right Brexit vision is excluded from the process entirely.

I think its extremely unlikely that the Tories wont win in June - so even if you reluctantly accept they will be best at negotiations, you don't have to vote for them.

Best (realistic) case scenario that I can see is that the Tories have their majority reduced slightly, and enough people vote for the Lib dems/Labour to send the message that not everyone in the country shares Jacob Rees Mogg's priorities.
This is the closest you will ever get to a "left wing Brexit."

Worst case scenario: May has an overwhelmingly huge majority, and takes this as a clear mandate to carry out her narrow interpretation of "the will of The People" with any moderating voices completely silenced.

Tories wont dismantle it, no party would.

The Conservatives have privatised the energy companies, the water companies, the railways, the Royal Mail, the probation service - do you really think they wouldn't privatise the NHS if they thought they could get away with it? It's only public support for the NHS that keeps them from doing it, and that support will decline if the NHS is left to go into permanent crisis.

In my honest and humble opinion - and as a nurse in the NHS, if you vote Tory you're signing away your NHS. Be prepared for no doctors or nurses, long waiting lists, huge bed shortages - think very very carefully what a world without the NHS would be like.
I'm voting labour. Don't like Corbyn but I hope he will help the NHS.

Mum2Jenny
I'm not in the UK but am interested in politics.
Why do you loath Theresa May?
If it's any consolation the politics/ politicians in Ireland are, in the main, dire.
At least in UK they have to resign if they f**k up. Not in Ireland- oh no- they brazen it out.

They could never privatise it all NotDavid - private companies would only want certain pieces of it. So we'd end up paying for the most expensive bits through taxes, while subsidising the "cherry picked" areas of care run privately through taxes, while possibly paying for many services at the point of use as well. And then if a private contractor went into financial difficulties, the government would have to pick up the tab anyway because they couldn't let a hospital fail.
So more expensive, less efficient, less fair.

And they will never declare "we are privatising parts of the NHS": They will dress it up as an "exciting new partnership with private enterprise" or somehting

AGnu why did you think the Tories might be a good fit for a Christian? I'm a Christian which partly informs my political view that I wouldn't dream of voting for them. Interesting innit.