Is there an 'underclass' on MN?

[wildswans]

I have name changed for this.

I have been on MN for about 6 months - off and on - and one of the most interesting aspects is the insight into people's lives and the contrasts and similarities. You can communicate with others you probably wouldn't meet in RL and in circumstances where they feel able to be completely open and frank about themselves, their families, their worries, their aspirations etc.

However, I can't help wondering if there is an 'underclass' who subscribe to MN. I have noticed, in particular, that any site which relates in any way to money or status - such as jobs and level of earnings and spending or whether a SAHM or WOHM - provokes very strong reactions. By this I don't just mean engaging in heated debate - which is part of the fun - but there is an undercurrent of envy and spite, which is very unattractive.

There are clearly a lot of high earning, highly successful women in MN and a number who have DHs who are well off. There are also lots who are earning less but do worthwhile and fulfilling jobs and others who are happy to care for their DC full time. Most MNs agree that it's all about choices and it doesn't really matter what you choose as long as it's right for you.

Yet the 'underclass' often seek to highjack interesting and constructive threads by pouring scorn on anyone who is a high earner, can afford tickets to the theatre (or even the zoo in one case!), or go on decent holidays. Presumably these are the ones who want the entrepreneurs to be taxed into exile and for a 'mansion tax' to be imposed. I can tell you that you don't get a 'mansion' for £2m in london or the South East, so what is that all about? In my view, it's nasty spiteful class envy and emanates from a small number of people on MNs who haven't achieved much in their lives so don't think anyone else should either.

Has anyone else reached this conclusion or AIBU?

i am really proud of what my family have achieved. i dont think its boasting. i wish more would do the same. i think loads of people are really capable.

boffin - sounds from what you have written in the first paragraph, that was down to your parents, not luck.

"People overestimate how much sheer luck has to do with success. Being born to the right family at the right time, having good health, and living in a prosperous area have more to do with your success than anything else."

Plenty of people born to poor families have worked hard to improve themselves and have done really well in life (my father is an example of this).
If you have the mindset that "everything is luck" then you will never achieve anything.

:o :o at those who think the OP is imagining it. If you don't smell the fart then its most likely that you are the source.

As so often, I feel the need to refer this thread to 6 Things Rich People Need to Stop Saying - in particular, number 5.

maybe if we werent told it was luck, there would be no need to.

do you really think the average self made millionare doesnt work harder than the average person?

the way i see it, i i started working really hard when i was about 12. so like a athlete developing their body as a child, i developed my mind. i used to do 5 hours homework.

an athlete cannot just run faster than me today because of the training they did this year, but the extra they did every previous year.

& thats why they run so much quicker than me.

Great link Dilys

Tilly I don't understand what your post means

Are you saying that some members of your family are rich and some are poor therefore luck has played no significant part in any of your fortunes?

yes. if you start from the level playing field of my grandparents children, my parents v their siblings, then me & my sibling v my cousins.

so Tilly, you work harder than everyone poorer than you, right?

And if you earn 4 times the amount of a teacher its because you work 4 times harder, right?

Lots of rich people work hard. Lots of people work just as hard who are not rich.

Tilly I still don't get your point

If some of your family are far more successful than others then this has nothing to do with luck, is that what you are saying?

I don't mind people having a greater income than I do. I haven't really noticed that anyone here does.

I have noticed that many MNers are willing to say "you're being ridiculous", when people having budgeting difficulties on £45,000 per annum, have sought to claim that their financial problems are caused by poorer parents having successfully budgeted for a Wii. I think that's a good thing about MN. Nay, I think it's absolutely wonderful!

If you are struggling, the problem, and solutions (if any) may be many and various. But complaining that the poorer family down the road have something you haven't got (often while failing to notice that you yourself spend lots of things they don't) isn't going to solve it for you.

Fantastic link dylis Says it all

I absolutely agree with the idea that with great priveledge comes great responsibility and bemoan the fact that philanthropy is so thin on the ground these days.

Why do we venerate rich people who give nothing back?

And if you earn 4 times the amount of a teacher its because you work 4 times harder, right?

it depends what you mean by 4 times harder. i would say i deliver multiples of value compared with people earning 40kpa, in that they can look at a problem for 1-2days, & i can solve the same problem in minutes or a few hours almost all the time.

Nope that isn't what I mean at all

All you have done Tilly is to explain why you earn more than a teacher

EFA Tilly I still don't get your point If some of your family are far more successful than others then this has nothing to do with luck, is that what you are saying?

what sort of luck do you mean?

i deliver multiples of value compared with people earning 40kpa therefore i earn that multiple of what they earn.

So, those of you who are so vocal in support of the 'underclass', what do you actually do to help them, by donations of money, time and effort, to share and to care and to 'give back' to the community? I am really interested to know.

In the terms of the good old cliche - I respect those that 'walk the walk' but not those who merely 'talk the talk'.

What charities do you support, how much do you donate (by way of % of income will be fine), what do you actually DO that gives you the right to adopt the moral high ground over others?

i deliver multiples of value compared with people earning 40kpa therefore i earn that multiple of what they earn

if i deliver 4x the value of work of people in the same industry, i earn 4 x what they earn. why any less than that?

Your assumption that everyone has choice is very misguided

The Second - i dont work in teaching. why should i have any skills in that area?

I know that self made people get rich by hard work.

But that doesn't mean that poorer people work less hard. Your profession/job often limits your maximum earning potential. Morality and ethics can also limit earning potential

Not everyone is driven by money, not everyone aspires to be wealthy. Being richer doesn't make a person better and enviable. That is the tone of the OP. The use of the term 'underclass' is pretty sickening and says a lot. It is perfectly possible to dislike and ridicule the crass bandying around of loadsamoney without being in the least bit jealous