Is there an 'underclass' on MN?

[wildswans]

I have name changed for this.

I have been on MN for about 6 months - off and on - and one of the most interesting aspects is the insight into people's lives and the contrasts and similarities. You can communicate with others you probably wouldn't meet in RL and in circumstances where they feel able to be completely open and frank about themselves, their families, their worries, their aspirations etc.

However, I can't help wondering if there is an 'underclass' who subscribe to MN. I have noticed, in particular, that any site which relates in any way to money or status - such as jobs and level of earnings and spending or whether a SAHM or WOHM - provokes very strong reactions. By this I don't just mean engaging in heated debate - which is part of the fun - but there is an undercurrent of envy and spite, which is very unattractive.

There are clearly a lot of high earning, highly successful women in MN and a number who have DHs who are well off. There are also lots who are earning less but do worthwhile and fulfilling jobs and others who are happy to care for their DC full time. Most MNs agree that it's all about choices and it doesn't really matter what you choose as long as it's right for you.

Yet the 'underclass' often seek to highjack interesting and constructive threads by pouring scorn on anyone who is a high earner, can afford tickets to the theatre (or even the zoo in one case!), or go on decent holidays. Presumably these are the ones who want the entrepreneurs to be taxed into exile and for a 'mansion tax' to be imposed. I can tell you that you don't get a 'mansion' for £2m in london or the South East, so what is that all about? In my view, it's nasty spiteful class envy and emanates from a small number of people on MNs who haven't achieved much in their lives so don't think anyone else should either.

Has anyone else reached this conclusion or AIBU?

"Malign Pollyanna" - . I'd take that as yer next posting name, I would.

Sorry you were so badly treated though.

ido - i like that idea!

Haven't read the whole thread, so maybe out of context....

But I think you make a very common mistake of thinking it is always envy, it is sometimes just distain for expensive/extravagent lifestyle

I'm pretty much an inverted snob, I don't consider myself 'underclass' or in anyway less than you, because you have more disposable income/ material possessions

It's nothing to do with money, IMO. It's what you get when you put a bunch of women together with insufficient dilution by the opposite sex. You end up seeing the very best and very worst of human nature. I would apply that to when you get too many blokes all together as well, by the way.

There is a widening gap between rich and poor in this country and a reduction in social mobility and opportunity.

This unsuprisingly results in some resentment from the folk at the bottom of the income brackets. I think this is understandable and reasonable. I think it is healthy that there is palpable discontent with a system that I believe does not serve the majority of this country well.

You say "In my view, it's nasty spiteful class envy and emanates from a small number of people on MNs who haven't achieved much in their lives so don't think anyone else should either." I think perhaps it suits you to think like this so that you can dismiss the inequalities in our society and conclude that if you have little money it is nobody's fault but your own, and if you have a lot it is because you deserve it and are more worthwhile and worthy than those with less than you.

People overestimate how much sheer luck has to do with success. Being born to the right family at the right time, having good health, and living in a prosperous area have more to do with your success than anything else.

which are all luck boffinmum, this is what is meant by luck

I wish the dc would believe the thing about health, Boff.

I haven't noticed it.

Wealth should be distributed much, MUCH more evenly than it is. It's not about jealousy, its about wanting to live in a fair and just society where everyone is treated equally and given fair chances.

That's what I was saying - by extension banging on about the fact that it's the poor's own fault for being feckless and lazy is a complete waste of breath - so much of all this is down to fate. That's not to say you can't improve the odds a bit by doing the right things, but then again sometimes the odds are always going to be too enormous.

So much of health is in our genes. I have learned a bitter lesson there.

boffin - so are you really successful & thats how you explain your sucess? or are you talking about other people who you know well?

Yes; although when you still young, you can do a lot with what you've got. I have no idea how to convince young people that their health is really, really important, however.

Youth is wasted on the young!

wibbly do you seriously not think the likes of Branson and Sugar have worked hard?! Mind boggles...

its two of the MN myths:

1. rich people dont work hard. i have always thought there are hard workers/lazy people at all income brackets.

1. rich people are so due mainly to luck. so how has my family gone from one of the poorest areas of the country to the top 1% in 2 generations, while other family members havent? (we havent won the lottery, nor would i ever wish to

Tilly I don't understand what your post means

Are you saying that some members of your family are rich and some are poor therefore luck has played no significant part in any of your fortunes?

'It has also become apparent that many people are claiming benefits who should not be claiming them.'

The sick and disabled, you mean?

'The new work capability assessment (introduced by a Labour government) has resulted in over one third of claimants of incapacity benefit being assessed as fit for work'

Yes, because the lovely coaltition has now decided that people with cancer are fit for work, unless they are going to die within the next 6 months. The new assessment deliberately tries to fit people who are not able to work into a 'fit for work' category by changing the criteria unfairly.

I can't believe some people actually think this is reasonable!

Good question.

Yes, I am successful. A lot of things were on my side: my parents pushed me quite hard, I was born at a time when things were opening up for women generally, I got into a good school where academic success and university was expected, and there are also ancillary things that helped, such as looking quite striking, coming from a small family so I got lots of attention, and being from a dual nationality family so I got an extra language for free, so to speak.

I put all that lot down to luck.

I have worked hard too. I often find I work considerably longer hours than people from similar backgrounds to me, that I know socially, and I have done better at work as a result. I also take more risks and the rewards can be higher for that. That bit's not luck.

However my health has started to fail, as a result of osteoarthritis, and that's bad luck, and something I have to battle against. I've also suffered from postnatal depression and recently had a breakdown. More bad luck. But the good luck has made me pretty resilient, so I do find I am able to bounce back from tough things like that.

What this has all taught me is that when you have good luck, you should try to share it out a bit, and when you have bad luck, you should persevere a bit. That's all anyone can do in life.

The top 1% are not doing enough sharing of their good fortune IMVHO, BTW.

There's something about boasting, stealth, or blatant, that really gets on my wick so I usually have something grumpy to say to the worst offenders. I don't think that makes me part of an underclass though.

I see far far more bashing of the poor and unlucky on this site than the other way round.

Any bashing is pathetic.

Never understood why people feel the need to boast. What is it supposed to achieve? Unless you're very proud of something and yell I NEED TO BOAST FOR A MINUTE, HUMOUR ME! first, it's only ever going to aggravate other people, is it not?

Boasting is, in itself, a sign of insecurity; so again, it's pretty self-defeating. You might just as well say: look how sad I am.

Yes, that must be it.