To think some posters need a "reality check" re. views on benefit changes

[lesley33]

I have some concerns about some of the proposed changes to benefits and how these may adversely affect people. So this is NOT a thread about that. But I am getting increasingly fed up at some of the frankly ridiculous reasons some posters are giving against the proposed changes. Examples include:

1. That children 12 and over will be traumatised if both parents work - even if second parent only works 20 hours a week.

1. That a parent with children 12 and over shouldn't have to commute up to 90 minutes each way to work. Far from ideal I know and if someone is on low wages this might not be affordable. But perfectly doable.

1. That childcare is impossible to get for teenagers. Ignoring the fact that many parents, myself included use a combination of kids home alone and afterschool activities.

AIBU to think some people need a reality check? Plenty of people with children already work, many with both parents working full time by the time their kids are teenagers. Plenty of people have long commutes, struggle with childcare, etc. Things might not be "ideal", but these are things that many many working parents already do.

It might be a good idea. Or just hide them all as they pop up.
I wish people would bloody think.
Its all very well being unemotional about the issue when it doesnt affect you.
Its easy to pontificate and theorise when your bloody life doesnt depend on the next kneejerk, reactionary policy from a goverment run by millonaires.

Its all so hard isnt it? Get some sleep, plan a Nice Thing, take care of yourself.

You do a brilliant, wonderful and hard, hard job.

Reindeer - no-one on here is thinking of you, or parents in a similar situation when these things get discussed. I have read loads of these threads over time and the frustration lays with able bodied adults who can't be arsed or take the piss out of the system - not with carers, parents of young dcs or the disabled. Even the really right wing ones....

Of course there are lots of threads because of the current parliamentary debates.....it raises emotion. Even amongst the "good" posts, there is a lot of hysteria and misinformation. (((hugs)))

But Porto - people may not mean people like Reindeer but it's people like her who'll suffer.
As kind of collateral damage while they aim for the 'Shameless' types.

Why is Reindeer going to suffer? Do you mean financially or by reputation?

She seems to be upset that she is being judged for not working. That is one thing. Or do you mean she will suffer under UC?

You are right, the last (good) lot of you. Just been a difficult few weeks/months and I just am a bit tender at the moment. Have to do another Lot of hospital stuff soon and I'm so sick of fighting with DS about it all. I have to fight him to do all the treatments, which makes the job really hard, especially when he calls me evil for making him do all this stuff.

Think I need to see if the hospital can do more work. Let it cost the government more money, and I will happily go back to work. He can stay there now, and they can deal with the moods and tempers and his frustration at it all.

Portofino, it doesn't start out like an attack on carers/disabled, but the proposed legislation hits where it hurts, and some people on this thread have aired those views. I have argued so many times for the rights of Carers but its like talking to a brick wall sometimes.

(FWIW I won't let DS stay in hospital for up to three months a year - sometimes it just seems like the easier option, and I feel awful for even thinking it. Time to seek some counselling for us both I think ).

OP - yaNbu .

Reindeer, I sometimes go away with the same feeling :( Even considering that there's times when I'm the only person that can keep DS1 calm and vaguely reasonable doesn't even help. It just makes me feel trapped and undervalued :(

From what I see of the proposed legislation, you would not be negatively affected. I got cross on another thread where someone did sums and had completely misunderstood what was included/not included.

MN should NOT be your resource on how Universal Credit affects you.

Porto no it's the judgement from others and really low self esteem that I'm struggling with. I'm up to date on the proposals for UC /DLA/Carers, and I know how the changes affect us, we will be slightly worse off, but we are luckier than others due to HR DLA.

I wasn't getting at you btw, it's just the sheer number of threads where everyone knows someone who is 'faking it' and that people shouldn't have children if they couldn't support them. Almost like carers are revelling in this free money we get, when actually all we want if for our DCs to be healthy and happy and to be able to have jobs like everyone else.

Ouryve - I am sorry you know the feeling too. Almost feels like drowning in a pit of worthlessness doesn't it? All the work and effort we put in, it's a good job we love the DC's more than anything isn't it :)

I guess it is hard for lots of people atm with many threads slagging of those who dare to claim what they are legally entitled to.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/a1391767-Random-Act-of-Kindness-to-balance-all-the-ranty-threads-tell-me-of-a-random-act-of-kindness-that-you-have-never-forgotten#29726282

Spuddy I went to school with many people (one out of three kids I started secondary with in Ireland) just like those who thought they could start on the ground at 16 and work their way up; so many bright and energetic souls who got horrible advice from their parents and I hope at least some of them did well in the Celtic Tiger years and that they will have copped on enough that their children will have more of a chance. I know a few ended up in and out of jail. Their families just hadn't a clue (why would you stay in school and do the Leaving Cert and lose out on two years of working and earning?) but in some cases their parents were unfathomably unwilling to allow their children to do better than them or advance further through school than they had ('what was good enough for me is good enough for my child'). It didn't happen in a vacuum though. The 'careers teacher/academic advisor' was worse than useless.

There is something really wrong with a society where some people have more in common, culturally speaking, with immigrants from one of the most backward places in the Third World than with other people whose families have a long history of residence in Britain. The disengagement shows that once a society starts on the downhill slide towards valuing people only for what they can contribute, damage is done that may be irreparable. In British society at the moment, open season has been declared on the 'non-productive'.

What gets me is constantly being called lazy. DH and I are trying our best with job hunting just no sucess yet.. Ok I am a bit lazy I fell asleep before finishing a job application but is that really that unusual when you are functioning on 2 hrs sleep a night? Before I am flamed, now Dd has woken me up again I'll do it once she's settled. I don't want to risk the typos I would on MN.

hecubah you chose to take an extended maternity leave whilst your husband was unemployed therefore the two of you were not providing for your family. I'm sorry you're tired, can your unemployed husband not help you at night? I presume with the both of you not working you have quite a lot of time on your hands and can share duties? Or are excuses easier?

My parents are both university educated professionals. When my sister was born my father was made redundant. My mother took a job in a factory eviscerating chickens. Her choice was to put food on the table. Having instilled their work ethic in me I'm proud to say I've cleaned toilets to pay bills.

This whole 'benefits issue' extends well beyond disabled/children - it's about many, many people who choose not to take responsibility for their own lives and are just on the take. C.f., yesterday's thread about vitamin D - get it free on prescription! Ffs what a waste of resources. I've read of people getting aspirin prescribed by the doctor - what is wrong with people?

Oh STFU I only delayed job hunting by a few weeks due to being ill with a wound infection. Do you really regard 7 weeks as extended mat leave. OK its 5 weeks longer than the legal minimum but I really don't think it's extreme.

He is applying for anything and everything what else do you expect him to do?. Now I am doing the same.

I can't turn the clock back but I really doubt any application I completed while pyrexial and in pain would be any good.

We won't be affected by the cap we only get CB and contribution based JSA which will stop soon so we are not sitting back doing nothing.. No success yet with job hunting and vice versa.

oops that should read its not because he hasn't tried I proof read his applications and vice versa. I promise I am a lot more careful with applications than I am with MN.

hecuba you have a 7 week old baby, a C-section, AND you are job-hunting?? big respect to you, I couldnt handle that. I hope something comes good for your DH very soon and you can have a bit of a rest (haha, tiny baby, rest, hollow laughter - but hopefully you know what I mean!)

I didn't realise you'd only just had the baby. In which case why on earth are you assuming people are thinking you're one of the lifestyle choices gang? You're muddying the waters yourself. I hope very much your husband finds something new soon, it's undoubtedly shit timing, but this is what the safety net is for!

Is this the first time the power of cleaning toilets has been envoked on the thread?
Blimey not bad, how many pages?

Why do people think cleaning toilets is a mark of their supreme sacrifice?

Get over yourself, you cleaned some toilets. Many of us do that without feeling the need to puff out our chests and declare it to the world.

I have to give you credit for not adding the 'I would get down on my knees and scrub...' though.

Working in a call centre to pay the bills , now....that would be worth boasting about.

Alpine becuase sadly it is People like reindeer and hecuba ,hunty cat and yes myslef that is catching the fall out from people becuase people are thinkking that most are fakeing it or that we all have plasma tc , new cars and holidays abroad

Hell I even got accused that chances are im not disabled

I said in my first post and subsequent posts how old she is and I said that I had had a couple of months off. When I said couple of months I was being literal. Also if you read my first post it doesn't say I made a lifestyle choice it is pointing out that it is difficult to get a job even if you desperately want one. So tbh I don't think I muddied the waters, reread my posts and you'll find the information is there.

How many times does this have to be explained? If you qualify as disabled under UC then yes, you will experience only a slight reduction in your income.

HOWEVER, the guidelines on what constitutes disabled have been altered to such a degree that many people are being classed as perfectly fit to work. People like Hunty, with non-controllable epilepsy. People like my aunt with autism (unable to live independently). Well maybe they might be fit to work in certain roles, but the massive drop in income means they will be unable to put in place the measures required to do that (my aunt for example would be completely unable to cope with catching a bus and would end up hysterical in the middle of nowhere, but could cope with a taxi or specialised bus service), and just how many employers do people feel are willing to take on employees like this?

sunshineandbooks on a previous post i said i almost employed someone with dyslexia & had recently has time off for stress (i didnt because of his personality).

for a small employer, this approach enables you to work with people who wouldnt otherwise consider your company.