The Grauniad seems to be dying - hurrah!

[longfingernails]

I doubt Polly will be selling her Tuscan villa any time soon, but it will be a wonderful day when the BBC's in-house journal gets what it deserves.

www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/media/8580566/Job-cull-looms-at-The-Guardian.html

I am incensed by their dogged determination to turn all their journalists into personalities.
They're so bloody dull anyway.
Nigel Slater only saving grace of G/O.

And all those columns written people archly describing their domestic routines are excruciatingly bad.

You seem to be implying that only people of a certain level of intelligence read the Guardian.
Are you?

not exactly. Its more that the DM is simplt more readable. I don't read either often, but the G is harder work to get into than the DM - and tbh I'm not that motivated to get into it. DM headlines draw you in better. In that sense its a better paper. In other ways - you can keep the pair of them.

Jack- yes, you're right ... up to a point, I think reading the DM fosters and normalises some of those attitudes which may otherwise not have been particularly strong (or in the case of my MIL, non-existant)

can't they just go like the mirror but with a blue top
and ads nicked from the mail on sunday

How do you define 'readable'

Are you talking font size and style=picture to taxt ration and so on?

In that case Take a Break is 'readable' but in terms of it being readable....
I'd be happier and more fulfilled reading the small print on my lavatory cleaner.

"Jack- yes, you're right ... up to a point, I think reading the DM fosters and normalises some of those attitudes which may otherwise not have been particularly strong"

Grimma - True, but you could say the same about the Guardian.

When I was a child my parents bought the daily Telegraph all week & the Observer on Sunday (to provide an alternative view point). I've always thought that a sensible approach. I tend to read the FT and Guardian. But, lately, thanks to Twitter (and Mumsnet) I find myself reading interesting articles from all newspapers.

But then I find all 'points of view' interesting and worth consideration.

Gimmathenome. Your mother in law must have always had these opinions, but kept them to herself. It's like saying that I have read the Guardian and would change my views on Iraq, mass Immigration or otherwise. I won't. I should imagine your dear MIL is not that young, and for her to suddenly change her views IMO just does not happen. People do indeed become more outright in their views as they get older (and more Conservative) as they become less idealistic. I have read the Guardian, but it too has quite extreme views out of the norm, such as supporting the building of a mosque at ground zero, and wanting more troop involvement in Libya. It seems controversal for the sake of it, and many including me just 'turn off'. This 'turing off' is reflected in the low readership and it nearly going bust.
In saying that the Mail often carries some depressing stories, so I try to read the Times,Telegraph and the Mail on Tuesdays. The Mail does IMO say
what many think people think, that's why it sells so well, not as well as the 'Sun' being the biggest seller in the country though. Jack I agree with you. I find interesting articles on politics posted here on mumsnet.
Longfingernails. I sometimes agree with what she posts, and they normally create debate, so I hope she keeps posting.

Your mother in law must have always had these opinions, but kept them to herself
Nope. Really not.

If you rely on one source of information too much, its highly probable that your views will get distorted. Which is why I agree with Jack's last post that reading a variety is good. Its why I think the demise of the Guardian would be on the whole a pity, even though I don't personally agree with a lot of what it says any more than I do the DM.

Moondog, I've not exactly analysed it but I think you're being deliberately obtuse. I simply doubt that most people would qualitatively find it easier to pick up the G and scan a piece in the same way you can with the DM.

Slating the Beeb and The Guardian in one post? Run to the hills, people, LFN has learned to multitask.

I don't think Grimma's mother in law is stupid. I think she had never been previously exposed to the arguments and opinions in the Daily Mail. She has now started to read it and has found that she agrees with it.

The Daily Mail, the people's paper with the second highest sales in the country, is derided by the progressives, just as Sarah Palin is. They make jokes songs on youtube about the Mail and Palin. They call Palin stupid and think Mail readers have low intelligence. The reason they do this is because they want to discourage people from listening to Palin and reading the Mail, because they know that if they do, then just like Grimma's mother-in-law, they will find that they agree with Palin and the Mail, they will find that they agree with the majority of the people who buy the best selling newspaper, and disagree with the progressives.

The Guardian is a good newspaper, there is good news, opinion and comment in it, and it is written by clever journalists. We need the Guardian to do well, even if some of us think that some of it is propaganda. We need a broad spectrum of views. We need Grimma's mother-in-law to read all papers and decide for herself which views she agrees with. We don't want one side of the story, we don't want people to be put off listening to Sarah Palin or reading the Daily Mail because the progressives mock them. That is what the progressives want, not what the people want.

Fortunately for the people, the progressives are failing in their task. The Daily Mail is growing in popularity and is now the second most visited news website in the entire world, and Sarah Palin's popularity is rising.

Interesting reading about the Daily Mail

I agree!

Foul commie rag

I like reading about politics, but also like to read more trivial things, such as what is going on in the celebrity world. The Mail covers it all, which is why ordinary people buy it in large numbers. They are not all interested in reading Gordon Brown's speeches and reading about sustainability and the environment. The Guardian may not be for them.

Yesterday the Mail had a story about a celebrity, which I tthink is pretty shocking. I am glad the Mail brought it to my attention. It has changed my view of this celebrity. Unfortunately the majority of Mail readers seem to think that Evans was not doing anything wrong, but I think what he said was shocking. I also didn't know about the shocking thing that the other BBC presenter, Sarah Kennedy, had said. The progressive papers didn't cover this story yesterday, as far as I could see. I disagree with the BBC's treatment of it

"Last night, the BBC said Evans?s comment had simply been a ?quip? referring to the studio lights being dimmed. They denied it was a ?racist remark? and said the guest had also drawn no such ?inference? from the remark."

I want the Mail to keep informing us of issues like this, so that the BBC will be forced to treat it more seriously than just a 'quip'.

This shocking story didn't even make it into Mumsnet 'In the News' section, probably because so many MNers never read the Mail. If we relied only on the progressives, then we might never be informed of such stories.

Ooo, what was it?

sorry, forget to post the link

www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2006540/Chris-Evans-race-row-saying-black-scientist.html

hhahahaha

reminds me why i never read celeb anything

Its a bit of a moot point now she can't read any more but ...

I think she had never been previously exposed to the arguments and opinions in the Daily Mail. She has now started to read it and has found that she agrees with it.

Again, not really. You'd have to have lived in a box not to come across them in other forms the first 7 or 8 decades of your life . If DH asks her whether that's what she really thinks and she stops and thinks it through - nope, she doesn't truly agree at all. (it may be on a point where DHs opinions will be closer to the DM than his MILs true position, its not that he's persuading her - just asking her to think.)

Come on claig - we all know they've got the DM tucked inside their Guardian.

The guardian and it's communist followers are history - we all know it makes sense.

Of course they have, that's why the Mail is so much linked on MN and sells so highly. The people are not wrong, they don't enjoy reading about environmental sustainability and catastrophic climate change, because they know it is bunkum. The Guardian is a good paper, and who knows, maybe it will start to adapt and cut down on some of the bunkum.

Jan Moir - Peter Hitchens - Richard Littlejohn -
The voice of the silent majority.

All hail to them.

they don't enjoy reading about environmental sustainability and catastrophic climate change, because they know it is bunkum

No. They don't know its bunkum. They'd like to believe its bunkum , and not face up to the issues, so are obviously happier reading a paper which encourages them to carry on living in cloud cuckoo land.

Fortunately serious people read peer reviewed science rather than the DM to understand the complexities; they'll probably come up with enough technological fixes to save the skins of the DM readers in the UK, who probably won't be too arsed what happens elsewhere. Unless of course other parts of the world becoming uninhabitable drives population shift....

claig - very much agreeing wth your post @ 10.34 on Palin and The Daily Mail. Also on the Guardian obsession with climate change.

jackstarb - very interesting analysis on 'Blue Labour'. My PILs live in the socialist republic of Tyneside and are DM readers. They actually vote Tory but are from working class backgrounds and their views are almost identical to their Labour voting neighbours. Neither they nor their neighbours have any intelletual, social or emotional connection with the Fabian progressive Miliband project or the Guardianista metropolitan elite.

I do read the Guadian occasisonally. Their economics corresponent has been excellent on the Greek crisis. I still think the Guardian will eventually fade away and die or perhaps just be an online subscrition only website.

Grimma - I used to read that serious peer reviewed science on climate change for a living. Its a cult and people have seen through it.

Jan Moir wrote a very good piece recently about euthanasia and our treatment of old people. It was a good counterpoint to the progressive BBC TV programme with Sir Terry Pratchett, which showed the death of a man on TV, and which received complaints from the silent majority. Thankfully we still have some voices and newspapers that are not progressive.