Atheists and proof

[Kdtym10]

On several threads, some atheists have said they would believe in God/the Divine if they had proof. If you’re an atheist what would that proof look like to you?

Faith in a doctors skills, training, knowledge and experience - has nothing to do with faith in any god.

We can prove the technology works, we know how it works, and we can quantify its accuracy.

The fact that nobody can do the same for God is what this thread's about.

Science is a religion of its own, so it’s not going to allow for the existence of other religions. Religions are realities.

This is a nonsense. There are many, many scientists who also hold a religious faith.

We are neither stupid nor shallow. It's that we have looked where you looked, and didn't find what you found. We found other things elsewhere.

@Garlicking, well, then, why would you assume that what works for me is false and what works for you is true? I have no doubt you can find the spiritual in other practices. My own practice is not limited to prayer either. But really to find God you need to be genuinely seeking Him otherwise what you find isn't necessarily God.

OMG, this is so circular now 🤯

It’s only nonsense if you believe that humans are incapable of holding multiple faiths at once. 😉

Most units of quantification are created by naming qualitative (subjectively observed) differences.

We can prove the technology works, we know how it works, and we can quantify its accuracy.

@Garlicking, hmm the proof is very shaky with lots of cancer treatments. The research is by no means complete. No case is exactly the same. I had triple negative breast cancer. There are huge risks in undertaking many of the treatments. A lot of suggested treatment are pretty experimental. I know this from the documents I had to sign. It's not an easy thing to negotiate your way through as a patient.

Si.
Asking can you scientifically prove the Christian God exists is just like asking can you prove Buddha exists by reading the Bible? Or can you prove the Christian God exists by reading the Popul Voh?

Each religion cannot be used to prove or disprove the existence of another religion. They are separate realities, all of which can/could exist.

I'm not suggesting it doesn't work for you.

I'm saying I won't go looking for God because I don't believe there are any gods, I don't need a god, and I satisfy my 'spiritual' side by other means - which I can explain, unlike that which relies on faith.

This thread asked what sort of proof of God an atheist would need. Not whether your spirituality's better than mine!

Blind people can also use a refrigerator, relying on other material evidence to establish the presence or absence of asparagus.

The only way for the fridge and the asparagus to be undetectable by any means, is for them to be purely a metaphysical possibility, untethered from material reality. First, can something be untethered from material reality and still be termed asparagus? Aren't its material properties essential to what makes asparagus, asparagus?

Regardless, I can't attach much importance to the contemplation of whether to add metaphysical asparagus to the shopping list. Anyone placing as much value on metaphysical possibilities as material reality when navigating their every day life would be extremely dysfunctional.

I'm saying I won't go looking for God because I don't believe there are any gods, I don't need a god, and I satisfy my 'spiritual' side by other means - which I can explain, unlike that which relies on faith.

@Garlicking, out of interest how do you define your spiritual side? What is your own spirituality?

@heyhohello - my reply was more about MRI scans than experimental cancer treatments. I'm sorry you went through all that, and hope you'll stay clear.

Applause!

Science is not a religion. Religion does not allow for hypotheses to be tested and for theories to be improved as knowledge improves. Religion requires faith/belief and holds its central tenets to be true and unchanging without investigation.

Science is a method for understanding the world, and does not require faith/belief nor does it hold any tenets as unarguably true and unchanging.

It’s a shame there are so many doctors who think they are God though. And not in any interesting esoteric way!

my reply was more about MRI scans than experimental cancer treatments. I'm sorry you went through all that, and hope you'll stay clear.

@Garlicking, thank you. The reason I posted this is that it might surprise some people regarding just how experimental lots of treatments that are offered are. There needs to be a lot more research in order for this not to be the case.

It is a certain way of looking at the world though

Sounds like you have a limited and blinkered view of medicine and those who practice it.

Like the comment - “science is a method for understanding the world “ - so true

Well actually no applause because I never said anything about a blind person not being able to see them, I said what happens if they are invisible ? Entirely different thing!

it certainly is that (well when talking about the physical world) it’s not a way for understanding the spiritual world though

Vegetables in a fridge are not invisible - common sense strikes again

I don’t believe in any spiritual world any more than I do in any gods.