Why (or why not) be Christian?

[Mustardseed86]

Continuing the "Will you make it to heaven?" threads started by @VincitVeritas which have become a more wide-ranging discussion about matters of faith, Christian belief.

Hope to see you on here when the last thread runs out of space! And new posters welcome too.

We've recently been discussing the evidence for God, the soul and life after death, and debating what constitutes reliable evidence in this context.

Also some talk about whether it's accurate to say humans are 'sinful' and why/why not, some discussion of Paul and the validity of his writings and status as an apostle, how the Bible was formed (and why other writings didn't make the canon) the basis of morality/ethics, whether Jesus's message was intended for an excusively Jewish audience, the meaning of Christ (or Messiah), church tradition and different denominations, end times and probably more I've forgotten!

Overall yes god may have made us, but why should humanity bow down to any god when we may have the potential as humanity as a whole to rule the galaxies and beyond

That's an interesting question. I suspect if some humans survived, oral tradition would maintain the belief in a God. However, if all of humanity were eradicated and another sentient species took over, I wonder what would happen.

I've always been of the 'Man makes God in his own image' school of thought, so then you're into whether there is a connection between sentience/intelligence and the potential for evil, and whether therefore the God that developed would actually be very similar to ours, or whether there is no connection and therefore a new species might end up with a very different kind of deity.

Just BTW, has anyone on here read a novel series by an author called Sheri S Tepper? The books are Grass, Raising the Stones and Sideshow. Some very interesting philosophical concepts in there. Tepper was a feminist science fiction writer with a strong interest in the nature of humanity and their deities.

@Lalupalina

Why are you trusting the Bible as a source of truth?

Because it hasn't let me down.

@pointythings

Summary copied from the internet:

The novels "Grass," "Raising the Stones," and "Sideshow" by Sheri S. Tepper are rich with intriguing philosophical concepts that invite readers to ponder the deeper meanings behind the stories. Here are some of the noteworthy philosophical themes explored throughout the trilogy:

Ecology and Environmentalism: One of the central themes in the trilogy is humanity's relationship with the environment. In "Grass," the planet of the same name is covered in a sentient grass that poses a threat to human life. This setting allows Tepper to delve into themes of ecological balance, the consequences of environmental exploitation, and the importance of living in harmony with nature.

Societal Structures and Power Dynamics: Throughout the trilogy, Tepper examines various societal structures and power dynamics, including hierarchical systems, oppression, and resistance. Characters in the novels navigate complex social landscapes, challenging established norms and questioning the distribution of power within their societies.

Identity and Belonging: The characters in the trilogy often struggle with questions of identity and belonging, grappling with their place in the world and their relationships with others. Themes of self-discovery, acceptance, and the search for meaning permeate the narratives, as characters confront their own prejudices and preconceptions.

Religion and Spirituality: Religion and spirituality play significant roles in the trilogy, influencing characters' beliefs, motivations, and actions. Tepper explores the role of faith in shaping individuals and societies, as well as the potential for both positive and negative outcomes resulting from religious fervor.

Artificial Intelligence and Consciousness: In "Raising the Stones," Tepper introduces themes related to artificial intelligence and the nature of consciousness. Through the character of Abasio, readers are prompted to contemplate the ethical implications of creating sentient beings and the potential for coexistence between humans and artificial intelligence.

Morality and Ethics: The novels raise questions about morality and ethics, prompting readers to consider the consequences of their actions and the principles that guide their behavior. Characters grapple with moral dilemmas, ethical quandaries, and the complexities of navigating right and wrong in a morally ambiguous world.

Reality and Perception: "Sideshow" delves into themes of reality and perception, challenging readers to question the nature of truth and the reliability of their own perceptions. Through the characters' experiences, Tepper explores the fluidity of reality and the ways in which perception shapes our understanding of the world.

Overall, Sheri S. Tepper's "Arbai Trilogy" offers readers a thought-provoking exploration of a wide range of philosophical concepts, inviting reflection on fundamental questions about humanity, society, and the universe. Through imaginative storytelling and intricate world-building, Tepper encourages readers to engage with these themes in meaningful and profound ways, making the trilogy a compelling literary experience for fans of science fiction and philosophy alike.

Overall yes god may have made us, but why should humanity bow down to any god when we may have the potential as humanity as a whole to rule the galaxies and beyond

@RealRubyBee, because He is God and in bowing down to Him we can have unity with Him become as one with Him and partake in His greatness, infinite knowledge, love and mercy.

Worship is about acknowledging God, it's an appreciation of Him. It's recognition that He is God. And we're not

Do you think he enjoys being appreciated and worshipped by humans, being appreciated just for being himself?

@RealRubyBee well exactly. Some of the best SF ever written IMO. I still reread them regularly.

fair points then we could always use that knowledge to then rule and advance alot better than current methods

I would turn that around and say that from a human perspective, worship is a very deep and profound connection to something (someone) 'beyond'. It's transformative.
The human response to the presence of God is worship. So the command is not really external, any more than the command to love one another is purely external. It's hardwired.

Just BTW, has anyone on here read a novel series by an author called Sheri S Tepper? The books are Grass, Raising the Stones and Sideshow. Some very interesting philosophical concepts in there. Tepper was a feminist science fiction writer with a strong interest in the nature of humanity and their deities.

No, but I now really want to. Thanks for the recommendation 😊

because He is God and in bowing down to Him we can have unity with Him become as one with Him

We may not want unity with him. Why are you assuming that it's in your/our best interest to have unity with him?

To avoid hubris, perhaps.

fair points then we could always use that knowledge to then rule and advance alot better than current methods

@RealRubyBee, as what happened in Genesis? After eating from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil?

@Mustardseed86 enjoy! AbeBooks has them for not much money.

In contemplating humanity's potential to rule the galaxies and beyond, we are confronted with profound questions about our place in the universe and our relationship with divinity. While the allure of cosmic dominion beckons, we must remain vigilant against the pitfalls of hubris and arrogance.

Humility, tempered by reverence for the mysteries of existence, serves as a guiding light, reminding us of our interconnectedness with all creation. Whether bowing down to a god or reaching for the stars, let us tread the path with humility, wisdom, and compassion, mindful of the delicate balance between aspiration and humility.

@RealRubyBee That puts it well. 🙂

Maybe we should write it on a pillar of wood and pillar of stone 😀

@Lalupalina,

Why are you assuming that it's in your/our best interest to have unity with him?

It's an assumption based on my experience of the Christian faith so far.

You should read Samuel Taylor Coleridge’s comments on imagination

Maybe we should write it on a pillar of wood and pillar of stone

@Kdtym10, maybe it is written in our hearts?

humans should indeed embrace the knowledge that the biblical allegory of Genesis offers. By recognizing the potential benefits and risks of knowledge, we can strive to harness its power for the greater good while remaining vigilant against its potential pitfalls

@RealRubyBee and the greater good is with God. In unity with Him. According to my faith. 🙂

exactly a partnership with god and with that spreading the faith of god by ruling the galaxies in gods honour and giving faith to the various other species across the galaxies

in doing gods work, humanity should rule the galaxies otherwise we would be doing a disservice by not spreading gods faith to other worlds

@RealRubyBee perfect harmonious unity, acting as one with God, with Him as our ruler.

Not quite a partnership, as He has infinite knowledge/power and we don't. We only are partakers of this by submitting to Him.