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42
robobot · 18/05/2023 20:58

100% agree about the attempts to be reconverted! Drives me mad

PrimitivePerson · 18/05/2023 21:47

I get a trauma reaction every time I'm near anyone trying to evangelise these days. There was a knock on my door a few days ago which I assumed was the postman. It turned out to be a Jehovah's Witness. I sent him away sharpish but my hands were shaking for a good hour afterwards. I also do some work helping manage crowds at a local rugby stadium on match days. Some Christians came along handing out leaflets near where I was working, and it threw me into a full-blown panic. I had to ask my manager to move me away from them.

WordtoYoMumma · 18/05/2023 22:19

BadSkiingMum · 18/05/2023 14:43

May I ask a question to anyone who grew up in this environment: what was the view of family or friends who were non-believers?

I have heard it said that Christian young people could not have a boyfriend or girlfriend outside the church.

Ooh I remember the chair analogy. At a weird evangelical youth group I went to, we had to get into pairs and one stood on a chair, one on the ground. We each had to try to get the other to "join us" ie chair person get floor person on to the chair, and vice versa. Of course we all got pulled off the chairs onto the floor. AND THAT IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU DATE A NON BELIEVER KIDS. You'll never pull them up to your lofty heights of righteousness, instead they will pull you down into the murky world of the unbelieving. Fuckin hell, right?!

Heroicallyfound · 18/05/2023 22:27

I have heard it said that Christian young people could not have a boyfriend or girlfriend outside the church.

Oh yes… you shouldn’t be yoked with unbelievers!

Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?
2 Corinthians 6:14

https://www.crosswalk.com/family/singles/why-being-unequally-yoked-is-more-dangerous-than-you-think.html

This is bringing back memories… not good ones… of how suffocating it all was.

Why Being Unequally Yoked Is More Dangerous Than You Think

Being equally yoked is not meant to inhibit our dating lives. Rather, it is a command designed for protection and honor. Being unequally yoked is more dangerous than you think – and waiting for someone with whom you share the same spiritual...

https://www.crosswalk.com/family/singles/why-being-unequally-yoked-is-more-dangerous-than-you-think.html

Coldandcross · 18/05/2023 23:16

Yes to all the celibacy teaching totally messing us up with sex for life! I still struggle sometimes to get past the ingrained feeling of shame around sex. Anyone read/listened to anything helpful as they've journeyed this?
fwiw I still have a faith, and am still part of 'that world', but I can totally understand why many on this thread aren't, and I'm sorry that the church/christians let you down x

LotsOfBalloons · 18/05/2023 23:17

We didn't have the chair analogy.

But we did have "how far is too far?" With dating and it was all about not seeing how far close to the edge of the cliff you could go but keeping close to the mountain so no chance of falling.

I really think all this affected me and relationships more than I realised.

That and general lack of safeguarding understanding then when I was living in an abusive home, and me thinking I needed to forgive and looking to the bible for "answers" when I needed safety.

emmeline8228 · 19/05/2023 06:41

PrimitivePerson · 18/05/2023 21:47

I get a trauma reaction every time I'm near anyone trying to evangelise these days. There was a knock on my door a few days ago which I assumed was the postman. It turned out to be a Jehovah's Witness. I sent him away sharpish but my hands were shaking for a good hour afterwards. I also do some work helping manage crowds at a local rugby stadium on match days. Some Christians came along handing out leaflets near where I was working, and it threw me into a full-blown panic. I had to ask my manager to move me away from them.

I can absolutely relate to this as well..I have trauma reactions to things like this too. I noticed this again recently when someone was preaching in the streets in the city I live near. Its only since this MP stuff came out and reading people's similar experiences that I have realised how messed up its made me and I've reached out to a counsellor

Ursulathemagnificent · 19/05/2023 08:45

Heroicallyfound · 18/05/2023 22:27

I have heard it said that Christian young people could not have a boyfriend or girlfriend outside the church.

Oh yes… you shouldn’t be yoked with unbelievers!

Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?
2 Corinthians 6:14

https://www.crosswalk.com/family/singles/why-being-unequally-yoked-is-more-dangerous-than-you-think.html

This is bringing back memories… not good ones… of how suffocating it all was.

As I said earlier I'm still in the church still have faith but this one really winds me up. I'm not convinced that verse is even talking about marriage and it's certainly not a bloody "commandment" as that blog says🙄. And yet as we're all saying it's been used to mess up and condem people 🤬
And sure it's often good to have shared values with your partner , I don't think I could be married to a Tory !
But the emphasis that's been put on 1 verse is disproportionate and damaging (and the verse could equally have been about business relationships in a context where Christianity was new and subversive for their safety At that time

woodhill · 19/05/2023 11:50

Yes I'm still in the church just about but really struggle.

I tend not to go anymore since lockdown but still have a faith

Catinabeanbag · 19/05/2023 23:21

Ugh.... the whole dating / relationships thing was just messed up. We were always taught 'don't touch what you haven't got' when dating - presumably until you were married. Does give a big exception for same sex relationships though.... had we even dreamed they could be a thing.
I was brought up with (hetero) Marriage = good, single = ok until you get married. Everything else just wasn't even talked about. Nada. Nothing.
Oh, masturbation (for boys) was bad. Wasn't even mentioned for girls.
I'm sure there was some sort of 'sexual purity' thing that was being promoted at Heartbeat concerts (remember that band?) in the late 80s / early 90s. I remember being at one of their concerts and they were talking about relationships.

There was someone at the church I went to as a kid who was 'yoked to an unbeliever', and I think, felt a fair bit of pressure / jugement because of it.

Reallybadidea · 20/05/2023 07:27

Does anyone else remember Josh McDowell? I went to one of his talks at Spring Harvest in the mid 90s - it was packed to the rafters. Definitely one of the busiest events of the week and I remember my mum encouraging me to go, presumably in the hope that I'd be kept on the straight and narrow by what he said!

Highlights included:

  • it was possible and there had definitely been recorded cases of people catching HIV from kissing with tongues.
  • that you shouldn't be alone with your boy/girlfriend in case you were tempted to go too far
  • that if you had sex with someone who wasn't a virgin then they definitely would be comparing your body with their previous sexual partner. And you would inevitably do the same if you ever had more than one sexual partner. And this would taint your whole sex life.

I ended up in a long relationship with a fellow Christian who I didn't like, certainly didn't love and looking back was borderline abusive because I felt that I had to marry him because we'd had sex. Thank god I came to my senses and didn't marry him.

daffodilandtulip · 20/05/2023 14:27

LotsOfBalloons · 18/05/2023 23:17

We didn't have the chair analogy.

But we did have "how far is too far?" With dating and it was all about not seeing how far close to the edge of the cliff you could go but keeping close to the mountain so no chance of falling.

I really think all this affected me and relationships more than I realised.

That and general lack of safeguarding understanding then when I was living in an abusive home, and me thinking I needed to forgive and looking to the bible for "answers" when I needed safety.

Yes my parents were abusive. My mother (main abuser) had counselling for years. They even got someone around from the church to exorcise me (?!?!?!) for my behaviour. I was just a normal kid and if they'd have done a safeguarding instead, I'd have been taken into care.

woodhill · 20/05/2023 14:27

Don't remember him but have been to SH.

I remember lots of couples getting married as virtually teens then divorcing as they came to their senses and I think the church was very sexist at the time.

I come from a family that taught me to think for myself and question things that didn't always go down too well😀

guineacup · 20/05/2023 16:50

PrimitivePerson · 18/05/2023 15:07

@Natsku Did you get some seriously condemnatory nonsense about masturbation as well?

Where I was, masturbating was ok... so long as you did it without any "lustful thoughts"...Confused

Cma1988 · 20/05/2023 17:05

Mike Pilavachi has now been suspended with immediate effect according to a new update from Soul Survivor- they are also holding up their hands and admitted they should have acted sooner

LotsOfBalloons · 20/05/2023 17:18

Oh wow yes just gone to have a look at the statement and it does seem they have completely changed track here from "lets pray for all the leaders... " to realising the hurt caused. Suspended - does that mean it's just over now for MP? (Does he still get pension/church benefits etc? How does that work if he has a church house.)

Also if suspended isn't final - why wasn't he suspended before?!

guineacup · 20/05/2023 17:57

Cma1988 · 20/05/2023 17:05

Mike Pilavachi has now been suspended with immediate effect according to a new update from Soul Survivor- they are also holding up their hands and admitted they should have acted sooner

I'm not sure I understand... He'd stepped back from all responsibilities/roles back in April... Isn't that effectively the same thing?

onepieceoflollipop · 21/05/2023 07:58

@LotsOfBalloons - my understanding of suspension is that it is a ‘neutral’ position in laypersont’s terms ‘innocent until proven guilty’
Sometimes it is to protect the individual if a potentially false allegation has been made, and sometime there is real concern that the person has caused difficulties but they are still of course investigating.
Info from gov.uk below

Have you or your kids been to Soul Survivor?
onepieceoflollipop · 21/05/2023 08:02

@guineacup

It’s not quite the same thing - my understanding is that it was voluntary that he stepped back initially. Maybe because it ‘looked better’
Maybe because other leaders knew that further allegations would be made so it was better to have him ‘out of the way’
Perhaps they hoped that if he stepped back then things might quieten down in terms of more people coming forward?
Its difficult to know…

LotsOfBalloons · 21/05/2023 09:36

That's why I was confused as I thought him stepping back was the same as suspended. Ie still paid but not working while they investigate.

Have they said suspended now to make it look like they're a more active participant, and actively supporting those who have a case rather than just covering each others backs as they were.

Interesting they make mention of the culture of soul survivor too.

I still think its so hard to see something when you live in it and it's your world/work/friemdship circles. You need an outside view.

When you're in the mix though any outside criticism is just met with "they don't understand/Satan putting obstacles in pur way etc"

Sameynamey · 21/05/2023 13:24

Jersey Road PR management have taken over, hence the new statement and style of communication.

PrimitivePerson · 21/05/2023 13:29

Sameynamey · 21/05/2023 13:24

Jersey Road PR management have taken over, hence the new statement and style of communication.

Good grief, a Christian PR agency. What fresh horror is this?

LotsOfBalloons · 21/05/2023 13:40

Oh wow.

emmeline8228 · 23/05/2023 09:05

BadSkiingMum · 17/05/2023 21:56

This is an interesting tweet/video:

Sam Howson on Twitter

He paid how much for a six month course (internship?) twenty-five years ago?
If anyone knows Sam's current role I would be interested, as it sounds like he might be in a media type role.

https://twitter.com/samhowson/status/1659176316720099328?s=20

Not sure if you saw the update last week but he is going ahead and making a documentary. I for one am so pleased that voices are going to be heard. It's not just about Mike, it's about a massive movement that has (in the most part, I hope) unintentionally left many people (myself included) traumatised through spiritual abuse and manipulation

https://twitter.com/samhowson/status/1659176316720099328?s=20