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Original poster

Any atheists out there who are drawn to the aesthetic of church?

130 replies

Forion · 01/12/2021 09:18

I was a Roman Catholic, but totally struggled with believing in God etc. I gave up going to church years ago, but I still love the Catholic Church, hymns, music, the buildings, prayers, incense etc. I wasn't interested in the social side of things so didn't get anything out of that.

I know some people will say that it's God trying to draw me in, but honestly, I can't believe in any of that even though I've tried I can't force myself and I don't even like other people let alone love them 😄

Anybody else experienced this?

OP posts:
Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 20:07

I sing in a traditional church choir every Sunday, regularly read lessons and frequently act as Crucifer at church.
Been a rabid atheist for over 40 years, but I'm good at keeping that quiet from church members who might struggle with that.
I like singing, the ceremony, the language of the Old Testament and the Prayerbook, and really enjoy choral evensong.
I have met others like me Grin

Good for you 😃

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GreenWhiteViolet · 01/12/2021 20:09

I was brought up Catholic and read lots of religious literature as a small child. I was nine when I first had the thought that I didn't really believe in God. I remember sitting in primary school Masses, thinking about the parts I didn't really agree with, and then being utterly terrified I'd go to Hell if I was wrong. My dad forced me to keep going to church well into my teens, which did more to put me off the idea than anything else could have, and for a long time I rejected anything remotely religious. I also got in a bit of trouble for pointing out that Protestant doctrine was more logical than the Catholic version (Irish Catholic family, so there's a cultural component there!)

But the music is beautiful, and many old church buildings are too. I attended some services while doing my Masters at Cambridge, just for the experience, and had a real sense of the numinous. The same feeling I get when I stare into the night sky and think about infinity.

And yet I don't believe, and that's the fundamental obstacle. I think it's certainly possible that a Creator exists, but not that any man-made religion has access to the truth, because the Creator would have to be a being far beyond human understanding. I've read (most) of the Bible, and even took a short course covering Christian theology which delved into doctrinal changes and controversies over time. It's interesting. I can't see it as the Word of God. Even metaphorically.

Nevertheless, whenever I'm in one of those lovely churches I wish I were religious.

Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 20:10

Some is more instinctive, subconscious and manifests more in feelings than thought.

That's how I felt about God not existing though. I just felt it right inside myself and knew I couldn't keep going to church and trying to convince myself.

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Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 20:20

I think it's certainly possible that a Creator exists, but not that any man-made religion has access to the truth, because the Creator would have to be a being far beyond human understanding.

^ this

To me, the Bible and religious teachings seem so messy and contradictory and I used to wonder how God, if He existed, could have possibly imparted such an important message in such a disjointed and confusing way. The teachings leave more questions than answers. Humans are fairly simple things and need things laying out for them in a straightforward and plain manner. The religious arguments only lead to division and strife. How does this benefit humanity?

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glimpsing · 01/12/2021 20:22

I can't do cognitive dissonance though. My mind restlessly searches for the truth and it just can't be found - to my way of thinking anyway. I concluded that, because the truth can't be secured, then it didn't exist and I'd spent best part of 40 years wasting my time agonising over it. That's when I gave up and let it all go and I've felt much better for it. I concluded that religion wasn't for me and isn't intended for me because it's impossible to accept.

I believe there are truths that exist beyond human understanding. I don't really want to give up on that. It gives me hope. So I don't understand something, it's mysterious - I think great! Grin This a source of hope for me rather than something to agonise over. It's a small tweak on what you have said here, really. I just embrace the uncertainty rather than expect to understand it. I find it fascinating though, so still seek to process it all but it's more relaxed than what you've described.

glimpsing · 01/12/2021 20:29

To me, the Bible and religious teachings seem so messy and contradictory and I used to wonder how God, if He existed, could have possibly imparted such an important message in such a disjointed and confusing way. The teachings leave more questions than answers. Humans are fairly simple things and need things laying out for them in a straightforward and plain manner. The religious arguments only lead to division and strife. How does this benefit humanity?

How else would you expect human beings to process omnipotence? I think the Bible shows God but the understanding of it all is a lifelong journey. Yes, arguments can lead to strife but strife and arguments exist in all societies - it's a feature of human society. Overall, though, in Christianity I get a sense of longing for unity with God and each other, in love. That is what I think the important thing is.

PermanentTemporary · 01/12/2021 20:47

I think what you find in the Bible depends on what you bring to it.

Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 20:47

I find it fascinating though, so still seek to process it all but it's more relaxed than what you've described.

Mm, I don't do relaxed. Unless it's somewhere quiet and peaceful of course 😄

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glimpsing · 01/12/2021 20:48

Unless it's somewhere quiet and peaceful of course

Ahem...like church!!!!Grin

Funny old world eh?

glimpsing · 01/12/2021 20:50

I think just let yourself enjoy the church if you enjoy it, to be honest, OP. See if it changes you. Smile

Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 20:51

I think what you find in the Bible depends on what you bring to it.

Scepticism I suppose and I'm very cynical about the human race.

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Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 20:52

I think just let yourself enjoy the church if you enjoy it, to be honest, OP. See if it changes you. Smile

People hug you though

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PermanentTemporary · 01/12/2021 20:54

God yes. I can't stand the Kiss of Peace but I suppose I'm the problem there.

CathyorClaire · 01/12/2021 20:54

I believe there are truths that exist beyond human understanding

Well that's great but I can remember struggling even as a child with a central gospel messsage that made no logical sense while at the same time being literally terrified not to believe and profess it when even the church pop group was singing about hellfire.

In answer to OP, I was brought up a Baptist. No candles, no incense, no attractive or comforting icons. I don't find any resonance in visiting places of worship whether highly decorated or plain. Some hymns are just about OK (I think I must know most) but I'd never seek them out. If I'm feeling warbly a good blast of 80's retro will do the trick.

glimpsing · 01/12/2021 20:59

*People hug you though

Luredbyapomegranate · 01/12/2021 21:00

Absolutely - the architecture, art, music, and to an extent literature, of the Christian church are some of the greatest examples of humankind trying to reach beyond ourselves - it’s divine, in the sense of embodying the most spiritual aspect of humanity.

I am completely agnostic, in the sense that I think the chances of their being a god are so remote as to be impossible, and I couldn’t give a shit either way - but there is a lot about religion that I love and value.

Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 21:02

The hugging was the only part I didn't like. I used to try and hide behind a pillar, but people would seek you out like a heat seeking missile 😬

OP posts:
GreenWhiteViolet · 01/12/2021 21:03

OP, so much of what you're saying resonates with me. I'm also autistic and can't do cognitive dissonance. I have to try to resolve it in my mind. A church which acknowledged all the mystery and messiness would be one thing, but all too often they don't. I can't recite 'We believe X' with a group of people when I don't believe half of it.

The same with the idea of an afterlife. Death terrifies me, and I've had people point out that the idea of Heaven is comforting. Yes, it is, but I can't convince myself to believe in something just because it would be much nicer if it were true. My mind won't work that way.

CathyorClaire · 01/12/2021 21:03

People hug you though

Argh. Stoppit.

Just being made to acknowledge there were randoms next to me in the pew was torture enough Grin

glimpsing · 01/12/2021 21:03

fI'm feeling warbly a good blast of 80's retro will do the trick.

This is one of my favourite Christmas songs.Smile

Love is the predominant theme as far as I understand it.Smile

MagentaRocks · 01/12/2021 21:04

I’m an atheist but I find the history of religion and churches/religious buildings fascinating. A church has a certain feeling/smell.

WeeTattieBogle · 01/12/2021 21:07

Me too.

evelynhugo · 01/12/2021 21:07

Absolutely, I love a beautiful church it's all misogynistic crap though. My teen is a chorister and we get to see beautiful 'shows'. I join in with Santa, leave a mince pie out and fill a stocking and to me religion and god is the same. In fact it took me 40+ years to realise people actually believe in god. I honestly thought they were just going along with it all for tradition. If most people do truly believe it all most are quite shockingly poor at sticking to the 'rules'. Either way churches have an ace aesthetic, I love them but I'm not religious at all.

Original poster
Forion · 01/12/2021 21:08

@GreenWhiteViolet

We need an autistic church where it has all the lovely sensory elements and peace and quiet, but that only preaches that water is wet and the grass is green and that's all you have to believe in.

And NO hugging 😆

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CathyorClaire · 01/12/2021 21:10

@glimpsing

fI'm feeling warbly a good blast of 80's retro will do the trick.

This is one of my favourite Christmas songs.Smile

g]]

Love is the predominant theme as far as I understand it.Smile

Undoubtedly a good 'un but I prefer 'Relax' Grin