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Philosophy/religion

Join our Philosophy forum to discuss religion and spirituality.

Going to Church on Sundays

225 replies

EdithSimcox · 12/07/2015 11:01

Question for Christians obviously: How important is it to you to be able to go to church on Sunday?

I have recently refound faith after an absence of 25 years. My DP is finding it impossible to accept. I've been trying to find ways of being as unobtrusive as possible about it - including going to church near the office on a weekday lunchtime so as not to disrupt our family weekends. But I do want to go to church on Sundays sometimes - I want a 'home' church, to be part of a regular congregation, to sing hymns, to feel part of a church family (DP would really shudder at that one). In the last 8 weeks I've managed to go twice. I wasn't going today anyway because I knew 2 weeks in a row would really tip her over the edge. But this morning she asked me to agree never to go on Sundays. I said it was too big an ask to try and bounce me into and she had a sort of panic attack (I don't know if that's a technical thing, but it's definitely a physical panic/pain response she has - which she is having therapy to deal with but she thinks may never go away)

I do want to put her and the DC first, and I am prepared to compromise, but I was thinking more like going once or twice a month, not never. But she says I can pray anywhere and go to church in the week, so it's not a big thing to ask at all.

As a compromise I'm think I'm going to agree not to go until September, but that won't be enough I'm sure.

What do you think?

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 23/03/2016 21:02

So shoot me- I hadn't heard of Edith Simcox.

You had noticed that I was being very supportive of your desire to worship in the way you want to, hadn't you?

vdbfamily · 23/03/2016 21:10

I also have never heard of Edith Simcox , however I assumed someone called Edith talking about her wife would likely be a lesbian couple. It would be odd for a man to use the name Edith!

springydaffs · 23/03/2016 21:17

How enlightened some of us are then.

BertrandRussell · 23/03/2016 21:19

Really? Do you assume that I am a man?

capsium · 23/03/2016 21:44

I don't fully understand why posters not realising Edith is in a same sex relationship has caused such outrage due to these posters feeling this should have been made more explicit.

I knew Edith's situation, from her posts on other threads (& it is easy to forget other posters might not be familiar with them) but had I not I am not entirely sure whether that should change the way this situation should be viewed.

Yes, her DP's fears should be treated with compassion and understanding but surely this is the same for anyone? There is always a back story.

However does compassion for Edith's DP's preclude Edith having a right to some autonomy in exploring her own religious beliefs ? I don't think it does. It might make the situation difficult to negotiate, it is, hence the request for advice here.

springydaffs · 23/03/2016 21:53

I am not entirely sure whether that should change the way this situation should be viewed.

Except the church has hardly covered itself in glory on the gay issue. So it is absolutely pertinent to the situation the op is presenting here.

Honestly, such a basic detail to leave out.

EdithSimcox · 23/03/2016 21:53

bert no I assume you are a woman because most people in MN are - unless there is any reason to think otherwise that's what I always think...

Lots of the early posters on this thread are people who know me well on this board. I'm sorry that some of you felt that I was hiding something. It certainly wasn't intentional.

OP posts:
EdithSimcox · 23/03/2016 21:55

And yes, Bert, I think I acknowledged your support before, but if not I apologise for that too - I had noticed.

OP posts:
capsium · 23/03/2016 22:02

Well, yes, but there are a multitude of situations that could be pertinent to the situation, as presented. There could aspects of the OP's DP's past, which even she does not fully know, that compound her DP's fears. The thing is, without having to explain your whole back story on every thread, there is always some contextual information missing.

Regardless, why not just assume compassion is needed and ask questions where you think relevant (eg what are the DP's fears?)? Whatever the context is though, Edith still has her own need for some autonomy to explore and develop her own beliefs.

springydaffs · 23/03/2016 22:43

Well, something's not hanging right here.

But, come along, we need to be Good Christians and let dear Edith find her way.

Sorry, didn't know the rules of this clique. My bad.

All the best Edith.

capsium · 23/03/2016 22:51

Eh? Why are you so riled springy?

DioneTheDiabolist · 23/03/2016 23:07

Edith has been a regular on this board for almost a year. She has previously disclosed that she is a woman in a lesbian relationship. There has been no secrecy and certainly no attempt to cheatHmm contributors to this thread. It is not her fault that some posters assumed incorrectly.

BertrandRussell · 24/03/2016 08:16

I didn't say that Edith attempted to cheat anyone. I said that I felt cheated. A different thing.

I have put a considerable amount of thought into this thread, only to discover that I was missing a crucial piece of information. I can completely see why the op's partner would find it incredibly painful that she wants to become a part of an organization that all over the world and in all sorts of ways has at worst persecuted and at best tolerated a fundamental part of who she is. And before everyone piles in, I am fully aware that there are many gay Christians, and many Christians are tolerant and thoroughly wonderful people. But the institutions and hierarchies aren't. And that is what the OP is wanting to sign up to. Not a lovely tolerant embracing house church.

EdithSimcox · 24/03/2016 08:37

What a heteronormative world view, to assume that someone who chose the name Edith, on a website (mainly) for women, would be a man though!
Plenty of other people who don't know me assumed I was female; so there was obviously nothing to indicate the contrary. Anyway, despite your assumptions about it, as I explained above, the gay thing is not the main issue for DP.

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 24/03/2016 08:43

Yeah, right. I'm so heteronormative. In fact, I'm probably homophobic as well. Hmm

capsium · 24/03/2016 09:25

But the institutions and hierarchies aren't.

Tbh there are not many institutions that are universally tolerant with a past that lacks any kind of wrong doing and persecution - get people together, add power and acquisition of wealth and there is usually some form of corruption. However would you feel the same about women, homosexual people in the armed forces or government or health services? Inequalities have / are present in all these institutions.

My point is that equality includes having a major role to play in various institutions, to question injustices and inequalities. Anyone, regardless of background or sexual orientation, male or female might want to explore their spirituality as a need within them - the shameful element in the history of the institutions which are there to cater for this need does not preclude the need itself.

BertrandRussell · 24/03/2016 09:52

Just a heads up- I don't respond to PMs.

originalmavis · 24/03/2016 09:57

Why, what happens?

capsium · 24/03/2016 10:01

You can report a PM to MN if it is offensive, Bertrand. It is a shame this thread seems to have turned quite heated, with people getting upset all over the place. I'm not completely sure how it all snowballed.

BertrandRussell · 24/03/2016 10:17

I'm not heated at all. I just don't respond to PMs about threads I'm on. I think anything relevant to the thread should be said on the thread.

capsium · 24/03/2016 10:28

My assumption was that someone must have felt quite heated to address a PM to you Bertrand. But as no one else can see this PM, perhaps I should not be making assumptions. I've only ever responded to other people's PMs myself, I don't really know much of the sender's motivations.

Astrophe · 24/03/2016 11:21

What an interesting thread. I'm new to it, just read it all then.

When I read the OP I wondered whether the poster was male or female, but reading on I can't see how it mattered. The Op said their DP had some historical issues with faith that couldn't be elaborated on- What those personal issues are is irrelevant to the question the OP was asking (how important is Sunday worship to fellow Christians).

Edith. Kudos for your patience in what sounds like a tough situation for you both. My two cents worth:

Regular attendance at a community gathering at a home church (on whatever day- ours is Sunday) is really important to me. Theologically I believe it's important and is encouraged and endorsed throughout the New Teatement as being valuable and a key way to grow spiritually, be encouraged, and encourage others.

That's not to say that God doesn't care for and encourage those who cannot for whatever reason, meet with other believers (obviously he does - so many amazing stories of persecuted Christians). And maybe, if you can't find another way forward with your DP, you might need to make loving sacrifices for your DP and not meet in the ways the NT encourages - and if that's the case (somethings between you and God and your DP, so I can't say), then I trust that the Lord will sustain your faith in other ways...but it IS important and I do think you are right to do all you can to work towards being part of a church community.

That said, I believe that church is a community to belong to, not an event to attend, so there should hopefully be ways you can connect with a church community without having to attend on Sundays. If your current church doesn't have midweek home groups ( sorry I can't remember if you said it did), then maybe you need to find one that does, so that you can get to know the church members without regular attended nice on weekends. There are a w members of our church who come very irregularly on Sundays, but attend weekly or fortnightly home groups and other social events, and are loved and included as part of the community in other ways. Having said that, I wonder how your DP would feel if you were to begin attending social events with your Christian friends? That might be just as hard.

Bertram - not sure if you're still reading or have...we...left the thread...but to your point about it being a big issue if your DP became a Christian, I quite agree with you - but not because I think it would be a change from being a rational to non-rational person (I don't believe Christianity is without evidence, but that's another thread;-) )

I'm a Christian- so is DH. If he were to suddenly renounce his faith that would be enormously hard for me, because faith is not just a hobby or interest but a worldview - more than that - being a Christian (ie having a relationship with God through Jesus' sacrificial death) is the most fundamental aspect of who I am. I wouldn't leave DH is this were to happen. But it would be devastating for me because he would be fundamentally changed at the core of his self- and, whilst I would still love him, our relationship would be very different.

OrlandaFuriosa · 24/03/2016 11:53

Edith,

Am trying to think options through. DH, who was a committed Christian when we married has, perhaps under my unwitting influence, turned his back on any formal Christianity. I'm fortunate in that he doesn't forbid me but he does make it emotionally difficult.

I go to the full caboodle when I am involved in it and make that commitment understood. But I limit my involvement. I go to an evensong or 8.30 am if I can without too much disruption. I try to listen to the Weds/Sunday R3 evensong to get my ration of beauty. I try to offer up the rest as a sacrifice. And pray for loving resolution. Not sure if that helps.

Thinking of you.

EdithSimcox · 24/03/2016 12:15

to get my ration of beauty
yy, I would be lost without choral evensong on iplayer... Smile and there are other radio services, and podcasts and apps, and most importantly online friends, to support my prayer life and bible study when going it alone gets hard.

But yes as astrophe says, it's the local church community that I lack connection to. Though in fact Lent has been great for that - it's the one time of year when things do happen on weekdays (in my church at least) - and when I do get to go along I feel very welcome and included, and it's good.

I will keep up my patchwork connections with other churches for now, and continue to hope and pray that one day Sundays get easier.

OP posts:
ApocalypseSlough · 24/03/2016 14:24

(Can I just say I haven't sent any PMs, feeling a little paranoid Confused)
I'm not sure how it got so heated, sorry if my post inflamed- I mentioned rereading because I wondered whether it's been mentioned before or whether I'd jumped to conclusions.
Flowers for all.

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