Difficult Questions about Christianity

[ReggieJones]

This is inspired by discussions on mn and also in rl about Christianity. Jesus' death for us can sometimes seem like an easy thing to explain and those of us who've heard about it for many years can become a bit complacent. But I also often find it a really tricky thing to get my head around, despite believing iyswim. It would be interesting to hear what questions people have and also how we might be able to answer questions in a way that's humble and not personally offensive (although Jesus does say that people will be offended by the Gospel.

Yes I do love God than my family, and if it came down to choosing between them and Him I would choose Him. I try to prioritize Him when thinking about how I spend my time, energy, money etc (but I fail to do this because I am human and imperfect). When Jesus talks teaches this He's echoing the two greatest commandments which teach us to love God FIRST and others SECOND. So God highly values loving others but values us loving Him more. Sometimes the way we love God and others may be compatible and sometimes it won't be.

I'm not conforming to the world by expressing my beliefs. If you tell people that God can forgive anything and that even pedophiles and murderers can get into heaven you may be told to fuck off or that you're talking a load of shite. I'm also not conforming by not having sex outside of marriage, by trying not to gossip. A big example when I was a student was not getting drunk, this was definitely noticeable to my peers. I think these things look different for different people and in different situations. So Christians in Nigeria and Syria for example are non-conforming in a big way which is likely to end in their death in many cases. But yes others non-conform as well and will also be mocked or persecuted. I don't think Jesus claims that Christians are unique in this but tells us not to be surprised when people reject the gospel. I don't base my faith on the fact that people reject the gospel, its more complex than that I think but would be interesting to hear what others think.

Well done ReggieJones for answering so many questions so faithfully. Bless you.

There may be a lot of Christians who avoid hard questions but there are a lot of Christians who live their lives wonderfully, I am sure there are people of all faiths who do that, and of none. But I know of Christians who have faced death because of sticking up for other people's rights.

adequately answer questions about justice

Actually I think having your good and bad points weighed up is a MORE just scenario than one where you are admitted to heaven on wether you believe a certain thing regardless of what you have done. I also find it repugnant that God sees all sin the same, I have already explained how you would not tolerate this model as being anything like fairness if you came across it in everyday life, but you tolerate it within your religion because it's not actually affecting you.

Also Allah didn't come and walk on earth

So you just like the christian one more because the God visited this planet. Why would he need to? Maybe Allah is omniscient enough to know what it is like to be human without the need to come down here. And if earthly visitation floats your boat why didn't you end up believing in the Greek gods who live on Mount Olympus and go as far to having the odd sexual counter with mere humans. You have just as much reason to believe that as the biblical account of Jesus' life.

without a price being paid

Are your children God enough to be in your presence? Who makes the rules about someone needing to die?

paedophiles and murderers can get into heaven

What disgust me about this is that this happens while a generally good person is being sent to hell just because they didn't pay lip service to a God there was no evidence for, or a different God they thought there was just like you do yours. That is immoral.

Say a man rapes and murders a 20 year old charity working atheist/Muslim. She goes to hell because she didn't believe in any God/a different one. Meanwhile this raping murderer spends his life raping and murdering and just before he dies he converts to Christianity and he goes to heaven. If you think that is in any way moral that would surprise/alarm me.

If you actually loved God more than your family you would sell all your possessions and do nothing but worship/preach. How has your family actually ever suffered because you rejected them in favour of God?

by not having sex outside of marriage, by not gossiping

Lots of people refrain from sex outside of marriage and gossip. One way or another all of us are outside of what is the average behaviour. But in general those behaviours still do not put you in anyway outside of society otherwise one way or another we would all be considered outside of society. As I said you are paying bills, working, caring for family, planning for the future. To your neighbours you look like a normal person going about their life, I'm guessing you do not draw gasps of astonishment at how outside of the norm your lifestyle is. This self belief that we are actually not part of society is a common feature with religions and even other movements, and is a way to consolidate support by making the adherents feel 'special' and part of a secret society almost.

Allah and God are the same... Just a different name.

I do love God more than my family

See I wouldn't respect someone who expected me to love them more than others especially when this person was quite able to look after themselves and yet the people he wanted me to favour him over were vulnerable. If my husband started demanding that I always put him first even when it meant the children may genuinely suffer I would lose respect for him and consider him to have narcissistic tendencies. A trip to the solicitors would not be far off.

Why does an omniscient, omnipotent omnibenevolent God need humans to put him before the other vulnerable humans? Could you imagine requiring someone to put you first all the time even if it meant vulnerable people would suffer?

allah and God are the same

Be nice if he told the followers that, maybe he enjoys watching the horrors on the news of people who think 'their God is better' when actually it is him?

but values us loving him more

Me and my DH are very loving, I think he'd agree we are still 'in love' after 14 years and 2 children. I'd be gutted if he stopped loving me, but I'd be more disgusted if he caused the children to suffer physically. I expect him to give his attention more to where it is needed. When the kids were babies we barely communicated some days because we were so tied up in the relentless cycle of feeds and early mornings and broken sleep and so on.

It was right that we put our relationship behind the needs of the children. We had been together long enough to know we were both reasonable and logical and would both appreciate that as responsible adults we look after the most vulnerable first.

I value how much he loves the children more than how much he loves me and that he is able to prioritise who needs attention. If he was demanding attention when the babies were needing it I would have been very unimpressed and disappointed that he couldn't see that three were over more pressing needs.

People often fail to realise that Jews, Muslims and Christians believe in the same god.
Its all down to how they practise their faith in that god

Even then they can't agree within their own faith

001 I think there are some fundamental differences in the God that the Muslims and Christians believe in. Namely that Christians believe that God came down to earth as a human died and rose again defeating death and winning us forgiveness. This idea of atonement and grace does not exist in Islam as far as I'm aware.

Jews believe in the same God as Christians but they don't believe in Jesus. So in terms of the trinity they believe in a third of God (as I don't think they believe in the holy spirit either). And they don't believe in the whole saved by Jesus' sacrifice bit, simply because they don't believe in Jesus.

Its not about what they practice, the fundamental beliefs are different. Within Christianity there are certainly differences in terms of the smaller details but the belief that Jesus died for our sins, rose again and defeated death, winning redemption and eternal life for us is shared by all Christians, its in the name. If someone claims to be a Christian but doesn't believe these things about Jesus then they're either still seeking and working things out or have missed the point majorly.

headinhands are you Muslim?

001000 01 in my humble opinion I think you are half right. Jews believe in the God of the Old Testament scriptures. Christians believe in him too but Jews do not recognise 'our' revelation of Jesus as the Messiah, so they do not recognise that we think of our God as the same. As far as I am aware Muslims feel they have a further revelation in Mohammed. So maybe they would say their view of God was ours but with more added on.

*001000 01 Are you Jewish, Christian or Muslim? If not, then I am not sure how you can say what 'we' all believe and even being one of those faiths you can't fully know what the others, think just as i don't fully know how Jews or Muslims think. But you are partly right in that we have a certain common view of a monotheistic God.

Regardless of if we are, or ever have been a certain faith we have the same texts that make the various claims. A christian might say 'God says in the bible he answers prayer' but we can see that this is clearly not true. A christian might say that God is a feminist and and supports LBGT but again we have the same text in front of us as you so can see that your morals are superior to the ones therein and that it's logical to assume you are creating a faith in the image of your 21st century morality, which is at variance to the book you claim to use as a guide.

Reggie will God let Muslims into heaven?

Reggie, are you a follower of the type of Christianity that says you can be saved purely through faith in Jesus alone, or are you a believer who feels that faith by itself is insufficient and you would also be judged on your works?

I believe that the bible teaches 'faith alone'. I believe that God will judge us our works find all of us lacking as our works are never going to be good enough to make us worthy of heaven. Those who trust in Jesus will be pardoned as Jesus has already paid the debt we owe and sanctified us through dying and rising again. C S Lewis explains tis concept really well in 'Mere Christianity'.

The Koran and the Bible are not the same texts, sure there are similarities but also significant differences, mainly no Jesus in the Koren and hes pretty much the main character in the Bible!

The first five books if tje Qura'an are the fitst five books off the old testament. Muslims do believe in the deity as Jews and Christians.

Jesus is a character in the New Testament, he is not mentioned directly in the Old Testament. So to say he is the main character in the Bible is incorrect.

Now if you believe God and Jesus are one. Then sure, but then really, its God that is the mai character.

I believe that the bible teaches 'faith alone'.

So someone can spend their life being an absolute arse to everyone they meet, they can ignore the poor and needy, they can steal and covet and scheme, but provided they believe in Jesus they get eternal salvation.

Yet someone who is moral, ethical, helpful and caring but who doesn't happen to believe in Jesus is condemned.

Nevertheless we are supposed to believe that your god is merciful, just and loving. How can you hold such conflicting beliefs at the same time?

Now if you believe God and Jesus are one. Then sure, but then really, its God that is the main character.

Christians do believe God and Jesus are one (with the Holy Spirit - the trinity).

HowardTJMoon because we believe God is just and loving we feel we can trust him to work it all out.

ReggieJones and I will not agree on all things at all, I am sure, but because we share a faith in Jesus Christ we will have some significant things in common.

Speaking personally I would not want to ever say who will not be going to heaven, it is not my place to jujdge but I do believe i can know who will go to heaven, those who believe in Jesus. I do believe God is just so I feel sure he has it all covered. I acknowledge it doesn't seem fair but I would also say that when people believe in Jesus they do not just 'believe' they repent their former live (which means more than just being sorry but also actually turning their lives around and going in the other direction). The good works bit is that because of our love for God we will want to do good things. They are the fruits of a Christian life (hopefully) not the way we become Christians and of course all people of other faiths and of none can do good 'works' or good things.

because we believe God is just and loving we feel we can trust him to work it all out.

So the philosophical equivalent of sticking ones fingers in ones ears and hoping for the best, yes? Fair enough.