Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Philosophy/religion

Join our Philosophy forum to discuss religion and spirituality.

Original poster

Catholic Baptism problems

180 replies

smartypants1000 · 20/04/2014 18:02

Basically, we have our daughters' Baptism booked for late May, outside of our Parish (where Godparents live and where we are originally from). For various reasons (serious bereavements for two of the Godparents, the girls are aged 4 and 2 - it has always been the intention to have them Baptised. It seemed pretty straightforward but we've now been told that we need the permission of our Parish Priest. This shouldn't have been a problem, except that he won't give his permission.

We moved into the Parish less than 3 months ago, and he requires that we be registered members of the Parish for 3 months before we can apply for Baptism. Then, he requires us to attend a preparation course here, and won't accept us attending preparation in the Parish where we will be having our dd's Baptised. he also requires baptism certificates for all Godparents - they don't live locally, and probably don't know where their certificates are. But the main problem is the 3 month rule. I have attended Mass with the children every Sunday since we moved here in Feb. But he requires both of us to attend for 3 months before he will allow us to attend the preparation course, and since that only runs at certain times, will not allow us to have the Baptism as planned - it has been a military operation getting a date when everyone can make it, and after so many problems I don't want to delay, as it is very important to me that the girls are Baptised :-(. Dh is Catholic, but he isn't practising. he is happy for the dc to be raised Catholic. I joined the church as an adult (prior to meeting dh) and it is so important to me to raise the children with faith.

I'm feeling very unwelcome in the Church at the moment, very upset about this, feeling that my children are not considered good enough. Can the Parish really deny us permission? Can they really just impose these arbitary rules? When ds was Baptised, it was very friendly, welcoming and straightforward. Is there anything I can do, or do I have to accept that the Baptism will not happen?

OP posts:
HarveySchlumpfenburger · 21/04/2014 00:13

Agree lucked. This is so unusual I would be very surprised if it was a diocesian policy. I know most of the priests in my parish and the surrounding ones and despite being a range of ages and ranging from traditional to more liberal they would all be quite shocked by this. I am sure that none of them would actually do this.

Original poster
smartypants1000 · 21/04/2014 00:16

Would I be able to approach another church locally for permission? Does the Parish I am in work according my my address, is it specifically this Priest I need permission from (that's what I assumed)? Or could another priest within the town give permission for my dd's to be baptised?

OP posts:
zzzzz · 21/04/2014 00:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
smartypants1000 · 21/04/2014 00:33

I think you're right, zzzzz. thanks to everyone who has replied with advice.

OP posts:
MountainGoatee · 21/04/2014 00:34

Can't you just de-register from your local church and re-register in the church that you will be holding the baptism using your parents' address (assuming that they are from that parish too)? It's not exactly the truth, but it would appear to be true which is usually enough for the Catholic Church (although the Catholic Church in the UK may hold itself to a higher moral standard than they do here in Ireland).

zzzzz · 21/04/2014 00:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SheherazadeSchadenfreude · 21/04/2014 00:42

I'm so glad I'm not a Catholic when I hear people like Annunziata spouting off.

And the sooner education in this country is entirely secular, the better.

zzzzz · 21/04/2014 00:48

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SheherazadeSchadenfreude · 21/04/2014 01:14

No, zzzzz, sorry, most of you were really understanding and helpful. But you always get one, like Annunziata (as we say - "more sanctimonious than the Pope") who takes this stance and the "I am right and everyone else is wrong" line.

But I stand by what I said about secular education.

Annunziata · 21/04/2014 08:24

That is very hurtful Sheherazade.

I am not being mean or sanctimonious. I don't understand why the OP suddenly can't wait until autumn when she has already waited four years.

OddBoots · 21/04/2014 08:48

It's not as much the three month bit that surprises me in terms of rules a church might have but I do find the idea of needing to attend a course that runs for three whole Saturdays without children being allowed of a creche being provided rather a high hurdle to jump, it effectively bars the families with the least local support.

charitymum · 21/04/2014 08:55

It's the place of priest to welcome all to Baptism. It's a sacrament for the child not a test for parents. Even if you were doing it with school in mind it doesn't matter - it's not for him to judge or put barriers in. It's welcoming the child into the church.

whatcolour · 21/04/2014 09:09

Three fat with no DC would have barred us from the church 100%. We have no one to look after them, we don't have the cash to pay some one for that amount of time on top of normal childcare. We work and would refuse to not spend 3 Saturdays with our DC

Annunziata · 21/04/2014 09:10

No, in Catholic baptism the parents make the promises for the child so it is a test of their faith! You have to be prepared before you make a promise like that.

We did DD3's course with all the local parents, so maybe the priest isn't to blame for the timing OddBoots.

Dumbledoresgirl · 21/04/2014 09:32

It is a ridiculous situation. I cannot understand why the priest cannot contact your previous parish and be told by them that you have been a regular attender of Mass since 2001 (or however long).

And as for 3 whole Saturdays without children, attending a course! Who on earth dreamt that one up? When I had young children, I would have struggled to attend one evening. The least they could do is provide a creche. My marriage course was only one day and was a waste of time

LynetteScavo · 21/04/2014 09:34

A test of faith shouldn't include testing the ability to find child care for three Saturdays.

LynetteScavo · 21/04/2014 09:39

And it doesn't matter why the op hadn't had her dc baptised before now. The point is she wants them baptised now without delay, and having to jump through hoops. She simply wants her DC welcomed into the church. Her being a practicing catholic should be sufficient IMO.

gingerdodger · 21/04/2014 10:00

I found myself coming back to this thread because it made me feel really sad about the way this particular situation seems all about the rules and not about the welcome. I am glad to see a selection of other Catholics who also say this wouldn't happen in their church, as I know it wouldn't happen in mine.

OP I really would go to your old PP to see if he can help and if not the diocese. I would raise the Saturdays issue too. It seems like your new PP and those who support him might need to think a little more about reality for families and inclusion.

The schools issue seems a red herring to me. Children are 4/5 when they start school so if the really want to limit to practising Catholics then they could have a criteria measuring over that time rather than just baptism. Like others I struggle as to why someone with no faith would want their child in a faith school but that is probably more an indictment of the quality if other local schools, a whole other issue. And for those who have faith the size of a mustard seed.....

Annunziata · 21/04/2014 10:13

Is that directed at me ginger?

I don't think 3 months attendance is jumping through hoops. I really think the OP is wrong for turning up in a parish and demanding that the priest starts preparing for her children's baptism straight away. And in the middle of the busiest 6 weeks of the church year!

Clearly I'm in the minority so there's no point arguing any more.

zzzzz · 21/04/2014 10:17

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

zzzzz · 21/04/2014 10:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

gingerdodger · 21/04/2014 10:22

My apologies annunziata it was not aimed at you although re reading my message I can see that the line 'those who support him' could come across that way so I am sorry if this felt like a personal attack - it wasn't, I actually meant those who support is assist him in the church. I don't agree with your viewpoint on this issue but I am sorry if clumsy wording made you feel under attack

Annunziata · 21/04/2014 10:28

Don't you think a promise to bring up you child as Catholic is a test of your faith? All the things you have to teach then and the responsibility, I know I was scared of that!

I get so upset by the constant parade of babies into our church who you never see again. (And I go every day to Mass, not just on a Sunday!) i just think of all those broken promises and it makes me sad and angry. It seems a mockery of those who do believe.

Thanks ginger.

zzzzz · 21/04/2014 10:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SheherazadeSchadenfreude · 21/04/2014 10:38

Annunziata appears to be scared of people who suddenly discover Catholicism because the best local school is a Catholic one. Clearly this is not the case with the OP as she has explained (over and over again) that she is a regular attendee, albeit at a different church before they moved, and was unaware of this arbitrary three month rule imposed by this particular priest. And she has hardly "just turned up" - she's been attending Mass regularly, but is a few weeks short of his three months requirement, and can't meet the demand that her DH attends as well.

And yes, Annunziata, you appear to be in a minority of one! Everyone else has pointed out that this wouldn't happen in their churches, and that the church should be welcoming to all. It appears to be only you who thinks the Priest is completely reasonable in his, frankly bonkers, demands!