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Original poster

Who Wrote The Gospels?

940 replies

headinhands · 10/04/2014 08:53

"Matthew contains 606 of Markâ??s 661 verses. Luke contains 320 of Markâ??s 661 verses. Of the 55 verses of Mark which Matthew does not reproduce, Luke reproduces 31; therefore there are only 24 verses in all of Mark not reproduced somewhere in Matthew or Luke."

A good diagram here

OP posts:
capsium · 14/04/2014 16:42

The question at the end of my post, you have quoted above, should have been in a new paragraph and you should have been in italics. The sentiment was that this is an impossible question to give a conclusive answer to, from a human perspective.

As to whether babies can die from not having enough faith. The answer is no. We have all been given the same measure of faith.

Original poster
headinhands · 14/04/2014 16:46

So all babies have the same amount of faith but some die and some don't? What's the point of faith sorry?

OP posts:
capsium · 14/04/2014 16:50

head what is the point of Faith?

Why don't you try and find out? Experiential knowledge is the only kind I expect you would find satisfying, going on from what you have said before.

I will say this though, Faith is needed, because not everything is humanly known.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 19:41

Capsium: Many people have Christian belief and find their Faith a comfort in very difficult situations

People like this?
www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-faith-healers-sent-to-prison-for-death-of-second-sick-child-9142463.html

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 19:45

Given that faith apparently has healing powers and it is God's will whether someone is cured or dies, is this the case with all religions? Are Christians any likelier to have a positive outcome from an illness than, say, a Hindu?

capsium · 14/04/2014 19:53

CasualCobra no where have I said Christian belief is incompatible with consulting medical doctors.

We are physical beings, as well as spiritual, we should do all we can to help practically, as well as spiritually. The Bible says that if we have food and another is hungry, we should feed them. Jesus did feed the 5000. He didn't tell them they would have to wait for food.

God works through people in practical ways too. Many hospitals were set up by the church.

If someone is healed by Faith, this is all well and good. Doctors will be able to verify they are well.

capsium · 14/04/2014 19:56

CasualCobra you would ask to ask a Hindu your question. I do not know much of how their faith works. However I believe comparing individuals is very difficult as they are born with different strengths and weaknesses.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:02

Capsium: no where have I said Christian belief is incompatible with consulting medical doctors.

There are plenty of people who will use faith healing as a substitute. And there are plenty of conmen who will happily feed off their gullibility. I don't see that as harmless.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:03

Capsium: The Bible says that if we have food and another is hungry, we should feed them.

In the secular world, it is called empathy.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:04

Capsium: If someone is healed by Faith, this is all well and good.

That is a very big if. And there is no evidence for this happening.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:07

Capsium: you would ask to ask a Hindu your question. I do not know much of how their faith works. However I believe comparing individuals is very difficult as they are born with different strengths and weaknesses

You are avoiding the point. Let me rephrase. Are Christians any likelier to be cured because of their faith?

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:08

CasualCobra would you be happier if the Bible taught against helping people practically? Or against empathy?

Well Jesus showed great compassion, the highest form of empathy, placed above emotional or cognitive empathy by most people.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:18

Capsium: would you be happier if the Bible taught against helping people practically

Strawman. You highlighted that the bible says that you should help others. I just pointed out that this is a human attribute not restricted to biblical characters.

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:22

You are avoiding the point. Let me rephrase. Are Christians any likelier to be cured because of their faith?

Yes and no.

Yes, because you cannot receive healing by Faith, if you do not exercise any Faith in the healing, if you do not believe it.

No, because not all Christians can exercise their Faith in terms of healing, they have unbelief in this area. No, because people have different strengths and weaknesses to begin with. No, because some illnesses invoke such fear, are so very serious, so there is more which has to be overcome, in order to operate strongly enough in Faith. No because strength in Faith cannot be always achieved quickly enough to satisfactorily heal.

As we do not experience full Redemption from sins in this life, we might not see full physical healing in this life either. Faith has to be worked outward from our spirit to see physical manifestation, there can be inertia.

So overall, as I said, you cannot compare individuals.

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:25

Strawman. You highlighted that the bible says that you should help others. I just pointed out that this is a human attribute not restricted to biblical characters.

I believe we were made in God's image. The good in humans can be attributed to God, whether they acknowledge this or not.

Or did you mean your statement was the 'Strawman'?

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:32

From what you have said, there is no discernible difference between those using faith healing alongside their medical treatment and those who don't. It therefore looks very much like using faith to heal is as effective as keeping some lucky heather in your pocket.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:35

Capsium: Or did you mean your statement was the 'Strawman'?

If you can point to my statement being a strawman, I will happily look at it.

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:39

Casual there are plenty of Christians who believe they were miraculously healed by their Faith, I am happy for them and thankful they are now well. I do not require scientific proof.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:40

Capsium: The good in humans can be attributed to God.

It is more likely to be due to how our genes have developed which has made us more likely to survive.

The good in humans seems to have developed somewhat since they made up the stories about drowning the entire world, or committing genocide against ancient desert tribes. We seem to expect a higher standard of behaviour from our deities these days and they seem to be taking note of this.

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:41

CasualCobra what you consider a straw-man, in this instance is dependent on what you believe. I cannot conclusively prove otherwise.

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:41

Capsium: there are plenty of Christians who believe they were miraculously healed by their Faith

Would these be the ones that were seeing a doctor and taking medicine?

CasualCobra · 14/04/2014 20:42

Capsium: what you consider a straw-man, in this instance is dependent on what you believe.

I was asking you about your comment about my strawman.

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:48

I'm not sure we have a higher standard of behaviour, globally. There is still plenty of oppression and war going on.

We still have brutal stuff going on here in the UK. It is sanitised and often dressed up as something different but it still exists. Workfare could be considered a form of slave labour, people considered to be mentally ill can be denied basic human rights, women are blamed when they are victims of rape, for dressing 'provocatively'.

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:51

I was asking you about your comment about my strawman.

I asked you a question, did you consider your statement a straw man?Then I replied to your question regarding what I thought.

capsium · 14/04/2014 20:57

Cobra, regarding those who believed they have been healed by Faith. A lot of stories are shared when people have seen doctors, who diagnosed. The reason they believe they were healed by Faith was because the doctors did not or could not offer any effective treatment. Some had been healed before they underwent surgeries which had been scheduled.